Palestindains storm government offices in Gaza

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » 2004-07-18 11:03pm

RAMALLAH, West Bank - Militants sacked and burned Palestinian government offices Sunday, the latest sign of growing anger over Yasser Arafat’s decision to reach into his old guard and choose a loyalist relative as his new security chief.

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A confrontation was brewing between Arafat — reluctant to yield significant power — and Palestinian militants, including some of Arafat’s own officers. They are demanding deep reforms and new faces, Palestinian analysts said.

The divide between the two sides centered on the appointment of Moussa Arafat, Arafat’s cousin, as the new head of Palestinian security. Many Palestinians rejected him as a symbol of corruption and cronyism, propelling long-held dissatisfaction into the open.

At least 12 Palestinians were wounded in fighting between Palestinian militants and security forces loyal to Moussa Arafat as a gunbattle raged in the southern Gaza Strip. Medics in Rafah said 12 people had been brought to the hospital with wounds from the gunbattle at the town’s military intelligence compound. At least one person was in critical condition, they said.

A Reuters journalist was one of the wounded. Ahmed al-Baba, a Palestinian, was shot in the thigh and was being treated in hospital. His family said his life was not in danger.

‘Yes to reform!’
Dozens of masked gunmen marched through the Nusseirat refugee camp in central Gaza after sundown Sunday, chanting, “No to Moussa Arafat! Yes to reform!”

The internal Palestinian unrest was the most serious in more than a year. In 2003, protests against corruption forced Arafat to promise reforms and appoint a new government, led by Mahmoud Abbas. He resigned after only four months.

The turmoil came as Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon planned to withdraw from Gaza next year, intensifying a struggle for power and influence among the various Palestinian factions.

Israel calls reforms ‘an illusion’
Sharon said the trouble reinforced his contention that Israel cannot negotiate with the present Palestinian leadership.

Defense Minister Shaul Mofaz called Arafat’s reforms “an illusion” and said the Palestinian leader had retained his grip on power. “They are playing musical chairs,” he told Israel Radio.

Coalition negotiations between Sharon’s Likud Party and the moderate Labor Party began Sunday, as Sharon tries to shore up his shaky government, weakened by internal opposition to the Gaza pullout. Talks were to continue Monday, according to a statement from Labor Party leader Shimon Peres.

Decree sparks unrest
The unrest began after Arafat decreed a consolidation of about a dozen disparate security branches into three services — a key element of reform that the United States and Egypt have said would be necessary to revive deadlocked peace efforts.

Nasser Nasser / AP
Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qureia leaves after submitting his resignation to Yasser Arafat during a meeting of the Palestinian Legislative Council in the West Bank city of Ramallah on Saturday.
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But the Palestinian leader defied international peacemakers by declining to put the security forces under the control of the Cabinet, and by tapping Moussa Arafat for the top security post.

Protesting the appointment, militants broke into a building of the Palestinian Authority in the southern Gaza city of Khan Younis early Sunday and burned two offices. A security guard was wounded in a gunfight.

Hundreds of Palestinians, many of them carrying assault rifles, demonstrated in Gaza’s streets against Moussa Arafat.

The appointment deepened the rift between Arafat’s generation, which led the Palestinian struggle from exile for decades, and young Palestinians who lived under Israeli occupation and now accuse the old guard of corruption and monopolizing power.

Other resignations
Dissent, however, went beyond the generational divide and spread to the security forces.

Navy chief Gomma Ghali, an Arafat loyalist, handed in his resignation to protest Moussa Arafat’s appointment, joining the head of intelligence and the head of the preventative security, who resigned Friday. However, Arafat has not accepted the resignations.

A statement from the office of Maj. Gen. Amin Al-Hindi, the intelligence chief, said Arafat’s recent appointments “cannot help solve the internal situation and the internal reforms.”

“The new appointees are a part of the problem and therefore cannot be part of the solution,” Issa Abu Aram, the head of operations for preventive security in the West Bank, told The Associated Press.

Arafat relative rebuffs protests
In a rare news conference, Moussa Arafat brushed aside protests over his appointment. “I take my orders from His Excellency President Arafat,” he said, seated below a huge portrait of his mentor. “He is the only one who can ask me to quit my job.”

He said he was ready to “engage in any battle against any potential enemy,” and made it clear the enemy could come from within the Palestinian camp.

Previously the head of the Palestinian intelligence services, Moussa Arafat has a reputation for ruthlessness. He was among the founders of Fatah in 1965 and has stood by his cousin’s side since then.

In 1996, during a mass roundup of Hamas and Islamic Jihad militants, Moussa Arafat shaved the heads and beards of the men he imprisoned to humiliate them. Human rights groups accused him of torture.

“I don’t like Moussa Arafat, but I also don’t agree with what happened in Khan Younis,” said Hisham Betar, a 32-year-old school teacher who described himself as a supporter of Arafat’s Fatah movement. He warned that internal Palestinian conflict would benefit only Israel.

Qureia firm on resignation
There also was no apparent solution to the standoff between Arafat and the prime minister of the Palestinian government, Ahmed Qureia, who resigned in frustration over his inability to effect change.

“I totally reject your resignation and consider it nonexistent,” Arafat told Qureia on Sunday, according to Cabinet minister Saeb Erekat, who attended the meeting. Qureia told his Cabinet on Saturday he was firm in his decision to quit.

The crisis began after the kidnappings on Friday of two senior Palestinian security officials and four French volunteer workers in three separate incidents.

The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report.

Comments?

I'm pretty sure that a new less currupt government would only benift everyone. But what if that new reformed government was made up of "Kill the Zion Pigs Now!" Extremist? That couldn't end well...

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-07-18 11:37pm

Dare I say that the Palenstinian people are tired to being used as tools by every single mother fucker surrounding them?

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » 2004-07-18 11:38pm

I could only hope.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-19 12:14am

Anyone else find this hilarious? I have a feeling that if Israel left the West Bank totally, Arafat would find himself hanged higher than Haman by his own people...

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-07-19 12:17am

Xenophobe3691 wrote:Anyone else find this hilarious? I have a feeling that if Israel left the West Bank totally, Arafat would find himself hanged higher than Haman by his own people...

Funny, no. Facinating? Yes.

I guess there is a point where you can't blame others any more. Is this that point? I don't know but its a good sign. At least IMHO.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » 2004-07-19 12:20am

At this point I'm for anything that puts an end to sudice bombers killing pregant women (Fuck you Arafat) and F-18 missles being fired into apartment building to kill one man (Fuck you Sharon).

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-07-19 12:28am

Did Sharon ever follow through with the "withdrawing settlements" thing?

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-07-19 12:37am

HemlockGrey wrote:Did Sharon ever follow through with the "withdrawing settlements" thing?

Last I heard/read, he was still scrambling around trying to save his own ass but still wanted to carry through with it.

*shrug*

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-07-19 12:42am

HemlockGrey wrote:Did Sharon ever follow through with the "withdrawing settlements" thing?

Why the quotations?

In any case, they haven't gone through it yet, but today's events certainly do not make it any more likely. Sharon has got a lot riding on its success, if it falls through he may lose his position.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-07-19 01:06am

No particular reason for the quotations.

Does anyone know if the general Israeli population supports or is against the settlements? I think I mentioned one of our local Israeli netizens mention something about the populace generally opposing the settlements, but I can't remember.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-19 01:08am

Knife wrote:
Last I heard/read, he was still scrambling around trying to save his own ass but still wanted to carry through with it.

*shrug*

From what I've read, Sharon knows that he has the support of the majority of the Israeli electorate on the issue of withdrawing from Gaza, so he's just looking for a government that won't force him to call elections. They're a fucked up business, because, for all intents and purposes, Israel is run like a huge district. Hence the pandering for the ultrareligious votes, because a few percent can actually elect someone. Wacky, eh?

EmperorSolo51 · Post by **EmperorSolo51** » 2004-07-19 02:39am

Xenophobe3691 wrote:
Knife wrote:
Last I heard/read, he was still scrambling around trying to save his own ass but still wanted to carry through with it.

*shrug*
From what I've read, Sharon knows that he has the support of the majority of the Israeli electorate on the issue of withdrawing from Gaza, so he's just looking for a government that won't force him to call elections. They're a fucked up business, because, for all intents and purposes, Israel is run like a huge district. Hence the pandering for the ultrareligious votes, because a few percent can actually elect someone. Wacky, eh?

This is one of the reason why proportional representation is bad idea. As for Arafat, he and his cronies have running the PLO with corruption for years. He ,like Saddam, have used international aid for his own ends and have sent many a young boy to his death and there is huge unemployment in both the West Bnak ang Gaza. The sooner Arafat is gone, the better it will get for the Palestinians.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-07-19 08:56am

EmperorSolo51 wrote:This is one of the reason why proportional representation is bad idea. As for Arafat, he and his cronies have running the PLO with corruption for years. He ,like Saddam, have used international aid for his own ends and have sent many a young boy to his death and there is huge unemployment in both the West Bnak ang Gaza.

Sure Arafat is corrupt but the collapse of the Palestinian economy has a lot more to do with restrictions of movement imposed upon the Palestinian population by Israel than PLO corruption as this Amnesty International press release describes.

The sooner Arafat is gone, the better it will get for the Palestinians.

Are you sure things will get better? Arafat is corrupt, brutal and in many ways a terrible leader but till we know who’ll take his place it’s impossible to say that things will get better. On the whole IvP thing Arafat is actually about as moderate a leader as Palestinians will tolerate it’s likely that any popular leader who takes his place will be more not less radical than him.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-19 02:35pm

Plekhanov wrote:
The sooner Arafat is gone, the better it will get for the Palestinians.
Are you sure things will get better? Arafat is corrupt, brutal and in many ways a terrible leader but till we know who’ll take his place it’s impossible to say that things will get better. On the whole IvP thing Arafat is actually about as moderate a leader as Palestinians will tolerate it’s likely that any popular leader who takes his place will be more not less radical than him.

Electronic Jihad
When Arafat's own support base is demanding that he gets the hell out and takes his cronies with him, I doubt he's that popular. And the average Palestinian is starting to hate him, just read the above article and the e-zine it's attached to.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2004-07-19 02:38pm

Xenophobe3691 wrote:
Plekhanov wrote:
The sooner Arafat is gone, the better it will get for the Palestinians.
Are you sure things will get better? Arafat is corrupt, brutal and in many ways a terrible leader but till we know who’ll take his place it’s impossible to say that things will get better. On the whole IvP thing Arafat is actually about as moderate a leader as Palestinians will tolerate it’s likely that any popular leader who takes his place will be more not less radical than him.
Electronic Jihad
When Arafat's own support base is demanding that he gets the hell out and takes his cronies with him, I doubt he's that popular. And the average Palestinian is starting to hate him, just read the above article and the e-zine it's attached to.

Just to add, it has been commonly believed for some time that Arafat needed the Israeli conflict because otherwise his own people would have strung him up a long time ago. Once they start looking around at the way he and his government treats them they are going to want revenege. Its considered one of the primary reasons he backed away from Ehud Barak's deal years ago granting them 90% of what they wanted.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-07-19 08:10pm

Xenophobe3691 wrote:
Plekhanov wrote:
The sooner Arafat is gone, the better it will get for the Palestinians.
Are you sure things will get better? Arafat is corrupt, brutal and in many ways a terrible leader but till we know who’ll take his place it’s impossible to say that things will get better. On the whole IvP thing Arafat is actually about as moderate a leader as Palestinians will tolerate it’s likely that any popular leader who takes his place will be more not less radical than him.
Electronic Jihad
When Arafat's own support base is demanding that he gets the hell out and takes his cronies with him, I doubt he's that popular. And the average Palestinian is starting to hate him, just read the above article and the e-zine it's attached to.

Did you even read my post before submitting? I’m not defending Arafat you muppet I’m well aware of what a scumbag he is, what I am doing is expressing concern at who could potentially arise to replace him as there is a very significant chance they could be worse than Arafat.

Stravo wrote:Just to add, it has been commonly believed for some time that Arafat needed the Israeli conflict because otherwise his own people would have strung him up a long time ago.

Commonly believed by who?

Once they start looking around at the way he and his government treats them they are going to want revenege. Its considered one of the

Considered by who?

primary reasons he backed away from Ehud Barak's deal years ago granting them 90% of what they wanted.

I suggest you go and read up a little as you clearly don’t know what the hell your talking about, Arafat’s refusal to sign the camp David accords is one his few recent plus points. The primary reason he refused to sign them was that Barak’s demands were unreasonable and intolerable to the Palestinian population, his refusal to sign up and become the Israeli’s puppet is one of the few factors in his favour, your 90% figure is complete bullshit Zionist propaganda.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-19 08:14pm

Plekhanov wrote: Did you even read my post before submitting? I’m not defending Arafat you muppet I’m well aware of what a scumbag he is, what I am doing is expressing concern at who could potentially arise to replace him as there is a very significant chance they could be worse than Arafat.

Muppet...Inventive...insult.

Anyhow, yes, I did read it. What you seem to have missed is that his support base is demanding, quite vehemently and violently, less corruption than Arafat. They're calling for self rule, they're calling for real governance. You seem to have missed the fact that the people themselves will rise up if a worse scumbag comes up, simply because they're reaching the point where they're willing to fight and die for it.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-07-20 01:11am

Shit. This is not good. I've said it before and I'll say it again - The Middle East is like the Balkans circa 1914; if there's going to be a third World War, it'll start there.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-07-20 01:14am

JME2 wrote:Shit. This is not good. I've said it before and I'll say it again - The Middle East is like the Balkans circa 1914; if there's going to be a third World War, it'll start there.

Dare I bring up Armageddon?

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-07-20 01:21am

On a more serious note, I must say that its about time.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-07-20 01:38am

On a third note, the story linked to is not the same as the one quoted in the post.

Plekhanov · Post by **Plekhanov** » 2004-07-20 09:16pm

Xenophobe3691 wrote:Muppet...Inventive...insult.

Anyhow, yes, I did read it. What you seem to have missed is that his support base is demanding, quite vehemently and violently, less corruption than Arafat. They're calling for self rule, they're calling for real governance. You seem to have missed the fact that the people themselves will rise up if a worse scumbag comes up, simply because they're reaching the point where they're willing to fight and die for it.

Why are you so confident that the Palestinians will rise up and depose any future scumbags? After all it took them a hell of a long time to do so against Arafat.

Also how about you address the profoundly important point about where any potential future leader is likely to stand upon the IvP issue, the chances are that any leader from the Gaza Strip will be less not more willing to deal with the Israeli’s than Arafat.

My central concern is who is going to replace Arafat? Until we know the answer to that question any “the sooner Arafats gone the better” type sentiments are simply idiotic, sometimes you really are better off with the devil you know.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-20 09:55pm

Plekhanov wrote: Why are you so confident that the Palestinians will rise up and depose any future scumbags? After all it took them a hell of a long time to do so against Arafat.

I'm not confident that they'll rise up, I'm confident that Arafat is reaching the point where his core constituency, a group of people who've supported him through thick and thin, and are more than willing to die for the cause, are starting to get pissed off. If they reach the point where they're willing to off him no matter what, well, all power to them.

Also how about you address the profoundly important point about where any potential future leader is likely to stand upon the IvP issue, the chances are that any leader from the Gaza Strip will be less not more willing to deal with the Israeli’s than Arafat.

Why should I? I never mentioned anything about a new leader in any of my posts. This is a Red Herring, my point is that the Palestinians are starting to want Arafat out.

My central concern is who is going to replace Arafat? Until we know the answer to that question any “the sooner Arafats gone the better” type sentiments are simply idiotic, sometimes you really are better off with the devil you know.

I've no clue, but now that the general Israeli public is starting to back a pullout of Gaza, there just might be sentiment among Palestinians that they'll get their land back. Unfortunately, Arafat isn't the person to represent the Palestinian cause for peace anymore, as he is losing (and perhaps has lost) credibility with his own people.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2004-07-21 12:37am

JME2 wrote:Shit. This is not good. I've said it before and I'll say it again - The Middle East is like the Balkans circa 1914; if there's going to be a third World War, it'll start there.

How would Europe get pulled in?

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-07-21 12:47am

Uraniun235 wrote:
JME2 wrote:Shit. This is not good. I've said it before and I'll say it again - The Middle East is like the Balkans circa 1914; if there's going to be a third World War, it'll start there.
How would Europe get pulled in?

This is Europe we're talking about. They killed their entire continent over a dead Austrian Prince. And then again twenty years later. Not to mention the fact that the previous century was full of stupid wars as well...