My New Pal: Adam Adler

SpyderGS · Post by **SpyderGS** » 2004-07-26 09:46am

The fact that they named a shuttle after it, despite the shuttle's power shows that Star Trek played a major part to space.

Indeed, though it was 30 years ago, I do recall that the only reason NASA named the orbiter test-bed "Enterprise" was due to a protracted letter writing campaign on the part of Trekkies. I believe the were originally going to call it Constitution or Columbia or something along that vein.

How ironic that it's the only orbiter never to fly in space. Poetic justice?

SpyderGS · Post by **SpyderGS** » 2004-07-26 09:48am

GAH! Sorry for the double post. Could a mod delete one please?

Thanks.

Kitsune · Post by **Kitsune** » 2004-07-26 07:10pm

Sharp-kun wrote:It's the same on all forums. People never read the rules/instructions no matter how obvious you make them.

Hmm, my website clearly states that I don't sell firearms yet people still try to order them from me. It is the same everywhere.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2004-07-27 02:20am

Hey, Wayne? If goof-ass replies again, tell him that sonar identification of ship types by way of propellor noise has it's beginings in WWII, and I'm thinking that maybe, just maybe Star Trek has an, ahem, negligible influence on it!

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2004-07-27 04:56am

Frank Hipper wrote:Hey, Wayne? If goof-ass replies again, tell him that sonar identification of ship types by way of propellor noise has it's beginings in WWII, and I'm thinking that maybe, just maybe Star Trek has an, ahem, negligible influence on it!

Hehehe! Unfortunately, he did reply again, but I accidentally erased it. I could probably ask him to resend it, though!

The Nomad · Post by **The Nomad** » 2004-07-27 07:18am

If he's so sure that warp drive is realistic, why not ask him where you can find cortenium vertenide, or what the heck this "subspace" thing has to do with real physics.

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2004-07-27 08:52am

Well this guy has opened my eyes. Star Trek is obviously 100% responsible for modern civilization as we know it.
And meaningless, technobabble explanations about warp drive coils forming subspace bubbles etc. etc. make it *that* much more superior and plausable than anything else..

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2004-07-28 02:15am

Hey Mods, can you delete the first one?
done~CO

Once again I write to you Wayne,

Oh thank god. I thought I'd have to pass the time tonight cleaning my toilet.

Because you foolishly erased my last e-mail (not smart)

You don't think so? Think about it...

I

am writing another e-mail. I wouldn't think that it would be necessary to say it but alas, I will for you. The previous reply that I received from you you didn't answer any of the questions that I asked of you. "Ask Yoda" "Because they are" that doesn't further your argument and of anyone but your cronies read it it would reflect unfavorably on you.

Yet still, you can't get it through your head that your questions are meaningless, and hypocritical when you don't apply them in the same manner to Star Trek. You honestly can't see that?

I have made a stunning observation about deathstar.net. It isn't really an open ground for the star wars star trek dispute. All of the posts are in favor of Star Wars because only Star Wars fans are there.

Wow, I'll have to visit that site sometime. BTW, what did you think of stardestroyer.net ?

As to the proposterous postings on the site, yes Star Trek had a HUGE effect on every aspect of society today. Such as the episode with the aliens witha black side and a white side, each one despised the other for having their black/white side on a different one from there own. Hmm... in the 60's black and white skinned creatures not liking each other... I wonder what this displayed to the public.

LOL!! Probably a sappy, self-serving and simplistic take on race relations.

A black woman being an important part of the crew, also haveing the first interracial kiss on national TV.

Yeah, she was so morally important to the show that she banged Roddenberry for the part, and then wore a mini skirt on the show because Roddenberry the altruist...liked mini skirts.

In the episode patterns of force, Kirk and Spock go to the Nazi planet driving in yet another message on prejudiced ideas.

Are you honestly suggesting Star Trek episodes have helped society gauge the impact of civil rights and the evils of Naziism? You need to get out more, kid.

Star Wars having a social impact....never...

Of course not. Its just a stupid fucking movie, just like Star Trek, idiot.

tech impact.....never. If I'm wrong then correct me.

You're wrong. I have a lightsaber I use to scratch my ass, on occasion.

Insulting me will only show your cronies how much smarter you are than me.

That should be, "...smarter you are than I." But I still agree with the gist of it. My cronies love me. Just ask them. If you get an actual account to post there, that is.

Any impartial webtraveler will clearly see that I am the one with teh stronger arguments.

Really? You certainly haven't displayed this strength yet.

[snip Trek's "social messages]

Look, dude. Trying to show that Trek is somehow superior by attempting to focus on its socially concious diatribes is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen. One only has to look at the treatment of Klingons to see how two-faced and self serving those stories are. How many Klingon episodes show them portrayed as smelly, with bad table manners, bad attitudes, etc.? How many times have Ferengis been accused of being a Jewish stereotype? Nigga please...

Now I ask you with the subject now being tech. What is wrong with Trek technology, I see nothing that isn't theoretically possible.

You mean other than transporters, replicators, FTL travel, Genesis Devices, etc?

In your response for this message, I have given up asking you not to insult me, now I'd like you to give me clear cut answers that make sense, they can insult me all you want but I want answers and I want good ones.

Here's an good answer. Try living in the real world rather than rubbing yourself against the Star Trek Encyclopedia.

Post by **Kuja** » 2004-07-28 02:16am

Insulting me will only show your cronies how much smarter you are than me.

*eyebrow shoots sky-high*

He actually said this?

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2004-07-28 02:21am

Kuja wrote:
Insulting me will only show your cronies how much smarter you are than me.
*eyebrow shoots sky-high*

He actually said this?

Yep. Some kind of reverse psychology?

Shadow WarChief · Post by **Shadow WarChief** » 2004-07-28 02:34am

Adam the loneliest brain cell wrote: As to the proposterous postings on the site, yes Star Trek had a HUGE effect on every aspect of society today. Such as the episode with the aliens witha black side and a white side, each one despised the other for having their black/white side on a different one from there own. Hmm... in the 60's black and white skinned creatures not liking each other... I wonder what this displayed to the public.

Did he actually just say that Star Trek caused the racial problems of the 20th century? I know that's not what he meant, but he did just say that didn't he?!

Post by **Kuja** » 2004-07-28 02:38am

Lord Poe wrote:
Kuja wrote: *eyebrow shoots sky-high*

He actually said this?
Yep. Some kind of reverse psychology?

If it is, it's a monumentally bad attempt.

Howedar · Post by **Howedar** » 2004-07-28 02:57am

Shadow WarChief wrote:
Adam the loneliest brain cell wrote: As to the proposterous postings on the site, yes Star Trek had a HUGE effect on every aspect of society today. Such as the episode with the aliens witha black side and a white side, each one despised the other for having their black/white side on a different one from there own. Hmm... in the 60's black and white skinned creatures not liking each other... I wonder what this displayed to the public.
Did he actually just say that Star Trek caused the racial problems of the 20th century? I know that's not what he meant, but he did just say that didn't he?!

He did not make a case for any causal relationship, he merely noted the similarity. I think.

Post by **Kuja** » 2004-07-28 03:03am

Howedar wrote:He did not make a case for any causal relationship, he merely noted the similarity. I think.

A guy like this doesn't stop at noting similarities.

Shadow WarChief · Post by **Shadow WarChief** » 2004-07-28 04:06am

Howedar wrote:He did not make a case for any causal relationship, he merely noted the similarity. I think.

"yes Star Trek had a HUGE effect on every aspect of society today."

Certainly sounds like he's establishing a causal relationship to me.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-07-28 04:37am

Lord Poe wrote:Yeah, she was so morally important to the show that she banged Roddenberry for the part, and then wore a mini skirt on the show because Roddenberry the altruist...liked mini skirts.

Really? Where did you hear this?

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2004-07-28 05:07am

Stofsk wrote:Really? Where did you hear this?

In the book "Inside Star Trek" and Nichelle Nichols' own book, "Beyond Uhura"

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-07-28 05:15am

Lord Poe wrote:
Stofsk wrote:Really? Where did you hear this?
In the book "Inside Star Trek" and Nichelle Nichols' own book, "Beyond Uhura"

Jesus. What else does it have to say about Roddenberry? Wow.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2004-07-28 11:39am

Now I ask you with the subject now being tech. What is wrong with Trek technology, I see nothing that isn't theoretically possible.

I can't believe he said THIS.
You know, when you begin to actually UNDERSTAND the technobabble, you see just how much of it is meaningless. Misapplied units, made up words, impossibilities, etc. You'd think they just grabbed a dictionary and pulled scientific terms out of a hat.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-07-28 01:47pm

Stofsk wrote:
Lord Poe wrote:
Stofsk wrote:Really? Where did you hear this?
In the book "Inside Star Trek" and Nichelle Nichols' own book, "Beyond Uhura"
Jesus. What else does it have to say about Roddenberry? Wow.

That's a subject for another thread. G-Rod was not an especially great role-model (which is part of why I laughed so hard when a Californian libertarian gubernatorial candidate listed him as one of their favorite philosophers

). Regardless, any work on him is going to show that he had a very checkered life.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-07-28 02:20pm

I'm so sick of people bringing up that "first interracial kiss" thing. Not only is it absolutely absurd to think that Star Trek caused the civil rights movement, but Uhura and Kirk didn't want to kiss in that episode! They were FORCED to kiss by the gamesters!

Fleet Admiral Blair · Post by **Fleet Admiral Blair** » 2004-07-28 03:20pm

Did they even actually kiss? I don't remember the episode, but I recall reading somewhere that Nicholes and Shatner never actually kissed there.

Trek did effect the civil rights movement in an albiet small manner by putting a black woman on the bridge and a female as first officer (for one episode).

But ST never caused any civil rights movement

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-07-28 03:23pm

Fleet Admiral Blair wrote:Did they even actually kiss? I don't remember the episode, but I recall reading somewhere that Nicholes and Shatner never actually kissed there.

I should watch that again. I don't remember.

Trek did effect the civil rights movement in an albiet small manner by putting a black woman on the bridge and a female as first officer (for one episode).

The episode with a female first officer never aired. And while Uhura was nominally a bridge officer, let's be serious. Look at what she did: SHE WAS THE FUCKING RECEPTIONIST.

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2004-07-28 03:30pm

Didn't they say that they nixed Number One's type of character because people wouldn't accept a female XO?
So much for promoting social change. And then they put all the women in miniskirts.
Now I know I might get shot for saying this seeing as some like the miniskirts, but I preferred it when the women went around in the "proper" uniforms.. in the 1st and 2nd pilots.. they looked cooler. To me anyway.

Joe Momma · Post by **Joe Momma** » 2004-07-28 03:57pm

As to the proposterous postings on the site, yes Star Trek had a HUGE effect on every aspect of society today. Such as the episode with the aliens witha black side and a white side, each one despised the other for having their black/white side on a different one from there own. Hmm... in the 60's black and white skinned creatures not liking each other... I wonder what this displayed to the public.

Jesus, you're a fucking retard. Since you've got such a hard-on for the scientific method (as badly as you try to apply it), let's talk about a little thing called evidence. In order to argue that Star Trek's ham-fisted, overly-simplistic, and often just fucking inaccurate takes on social issues that it seldom had the balls to address directly actually had an impact, you have to show that impact. Did the airing of those episodes change the course of the civil rights movement? Were those episodes mentioned prominently as examples by civil rights leaders or enter the public discourse surrounding civil rights in any significant way? MLK asked Uhura to stay on and she inspired some future astronauts. That's great, but it's hardly evidence that Star Trek was one of the lynchpins on which the civil rights movement turned, much less having a "HUGE effect on every aspect of society."

To put it another way, how many people have announced that they had renounced their racist ways or were suddenly inspired to more actively support civil rights or other social issues because of Star Trek? How much of an actual difference did it make as opposed to just preaching (half-assedly) to the choir?

Also, looking at what actually happens in various episodes and ignoring the hype reveals a much bleaker picture.

"Turnabout Intruder" certainly wasn't a paean for women's rights for example, unless stating that women are too prone to hysteria to have a command position is your idea of equal rights. I'd say they corrected that with Voyager, but God forbid that the morally-stunted Janeway be anyone's role model.

David Gerrold's morbidly amusing introduction to his recent book Blood and Fire discusses how Roddenberry stepped aside and let the network suits eliminate any mention of homosexuals in early episodes of TNG because they were "aesthetically displeasing."

Of course, it's still an issue that ST won't touch directly. You can have aliens as gay analogues in "The Outcast" but no humans can have any unusual sexual preferences because teh buttsex might freak out our viewers. Jesus Christ, sitcoms, teen dramas, and fucking Nickelodeon has more balls than Star Trek does regarding discussion of the controversial issue of homosexuality. How wonderfully progressive ST is!

There are actually some interesting books of criticism on the subject such as Daniel Bernardi's Star Trek and History: Race-Ing Toward a White Future and Enterprise Zones by Taylor Harrison (ed.). Both books suffer from a certain amount of the bullshit that's sadly nigh-intrinsic to liberal arts, there's also a high amount of well-supported observations of the racism and sexism prominently displayed in Star Trek.

SW doesn't address these sorts of social issues, but it never claimed to either. ST makes that claim and then does it in a miserable and contradictory manner as possible. I think I prefer SW -- at least it's not pissing on my leg and telling me that it's raining.

Now I ask you with the subject now being tech. What is wrong with Trek technology, I see nothing that isn't theoretically possible.

Actual physicists like Lawrence M. Krauss disagree with you.

The practical uses that have come from them. Star Trek has inspired inventions such as the hypo spray,

You are an ignorant asshole. "Hyposprays" (or jet injectors, if you live in the real world) have been in use since 1956. Maybe Robert Hingson was inspired by those Ferengi who landed at Area 51 back in '47?

The fact that they named a shuttle after it, despite the shuttle's power shows that Star Trek played a major part to space.

Oooooh, they gave it the same name! Yeah, it's astounding a government agency would respond to a letter-writing campaign with an effortless and frankly meaningless gesture that gave them some free publicity. F34r teh POWAR of STAR TREK!

Going back to your earlier argument, the lack of an explanatory mechanism does not outweigh observed events. Let me explain it with a simple analogy. If I clock a steam engine train going 60 mph and a bullet train going 200 mph, I can state that the bullet train is faster even if I do not understand the mechanisms behind their respective propulsion systems. Do you get the picture, sweetheart?

-- Joe Momma