REPUBLICANS Plan Push For ELIMINATION OF IRS

theski · Post by **theski** » 2004-08-02 06:56am

XXXXX DRUDGE REPORT XXXXX SUN AUG 01, 2004 21:01:25 ET XXXXX

REPUBLICANS PLAN PUSH FOR ELIMINATION OF IRS

**Exclusive**

A domestic centerpiece of the Bush/GOP agenda for a second Bush term is getting rid of the Internal Revenue Service, the DRUDGE REPORT has learned.

The Speaker of the House will push for replacing the nation's current tax system with a national sales tax or a value added tax, Hill sources tell DRUDGE.

"People ask me if I’m really calling for the elimination of the IRS, and I say I think that’s a great thing to do for future generations of Americans," Speaker of the House Dennis Hastert explains in his new book, to be released on Wednesday.

"Pushing reform legislation will be difficult. Change of any sort seldom comes easy. But these changes are critical to our economic vitality and our economic security abroad," Hastert declares in SPEAKER: LESSONS FROM FORTY YEARS IN COACHING AND POLITICS.

"“If you own property, stock, or, say, one hundred acres of farmland and tax time is approaching, you don’t want to make a mistake, so you’re almost obliged to go to a certified public accountant, tax preparer, or tax attorney to help you file a correct return. That costs a lot of money. Now multiply the amount you have to pay by the total number of people who are in the same boat. You can’t. No one can because precise numbers don’t exist. But we can stipulate that we’re talking about a huge amount. Now consider that a flat tax, national sales tax, or VAT would not only eliminate the need to do this, it could also eliminate the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) itself and make the process of paying taxes much easier."

"By adopting a VAT, sales tax, or some other alternative, we could begin to change productivity. If you can do that, you can change gross national product and start growing the economy. You could double the economy over the next fifteen years. All of a sudden, the problem of what future generations owe in Social Security and Medicare won’t be so daunting anymore. The answer is to grow the economy, and the key to doing that is making sure we have a tax system that attracts capital and builds incentives to keep it here instead of forcing it out to other nations."

Developing...

http://www.drudgereport.com/

If this is true...... HOOOOO wee does this make it interesting... and Where is JOe on this

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-08-02 07:01am

WHOO FUCKING HOO

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-08-02 07:33am

IRS or no IRS, the government is still gonna get your money, and lots of it.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2004-08-02 07:35am

You fools! Think of all the madness, the hate, the utter crueility contained with that foul instition know as the IRS, Without highly paid Goverment jobs to distract these utter bastions of evilness they will be released out onto the land, a proviberal plauge of evil........

Repent Sinners for your DOOM is at hand!

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2004-08-02 09:00am

Not to sound like some sort of Communist or something, but VAT's and sales taxes are among the most regressive taxes that can be imposed, and I suspect a consequence of eliminating the income tax and putting a sales tax in its place will be another 50 years of Democratic majorities in Congress.

If this report is true, Hastert's been smoking some good shit and I want some.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-02 09:07am

Won't believe it until I see it.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-08-02 09:51am

Income tax consulting is a rather large business. I'd have to imagine that streamlining the process of paying taxes would kill quite a few jobs.

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2004-08-02 10:26am

National sales Tax.

It's about time we take money from people not making any.

Xenophobe3691 · Post by **Xenophobe3691** » 2004-08-02 11:18am

I hope they're prepared to cut the Federal Government to pre-1913 levels if they are...

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-08-02 12:47pm

Now, while the IRS and a progressive income tax is an abomination, VAT s even worse. Why t just institutes a nice happy flat tax? Sure you would have to cut government spending(Oh, darn!!!

) Have a flat taxof 15% with deductions for various things(home offices etc) and have that be the only federal tax. Then youu pass a balanced budget amendment.

This would encourage more stuff(Schools etc) being done at the state and local level(as it should be)

Then for states, Balanced budget amendment yet again, just to be sure. Oh, and allow people to own their own land again(in every state but texas you cant actually own land, you own the house the grass the tress, but not the dirt. Which is why they can charge property taxes)

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-08-02 12:53pm

This'll be great for firing up the base, but it will never actually happen.

Mutant Headcrab · Post by **Mutant Headcrab** » 2004-08-02 01:52pm

I'm worried about this happening. My dad happens to be an employee of the IRS. He doesn't go around taking people's money or is a mean bastard. He's a good natured cubical drone. I would hate to see anything happen to his employment status because of something like this...

Aeolus · Post by **Aeolus** » 2004-08-02 01:54pm

Glocksman wrote:Not to sound like some sort of Communist or something, but VAT's and sales taxes are among the most regressive taxes that can be imposed, and I suspect a consequence of eliminating the income tax and putting a sales tax in its place will be another 50 years of Democratic majorities in Congress.

If this report is true, Hastert's been smoking some good shit and I want some.

Agreed about the VAT and sales tax. But a flat tax with no deductions of any kind could work.

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2004-08-02 02:14pm

A flat tax would never fly. It sounds good on paper, but to lose the revenue of progressive taxation would require a flat tax rate sufficiently high that everybody BUT the top ten percent or so would see their tax rates increase SIGNIFICANTLY.

BTW, how many people talking about taxation know how the tax system ACTUALLY WORKS?

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-08-02 02:17pm

Mutant Headcrab wrote:I'm worried about this happening. My dad happens to be an employee of the IRS. He doesn't go around taking people's money or is a mean bastard. He's a good natured cubical drone. I would hate to see anything happen to his employment status because of something like this...

I wouldn't worry. This is more pre-election posturing. No one's going to sit by and let Congress destroy a whole fuckload of government jobs and bring down a billion-dollar business (personal tax consulting).

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2004-08-02 02:37pm

Day this happens...quite literally pigs will fly of their own will.

Aside from a billion dollar business and the impunity of destroying whomever lives they wish...the government is not giving up the power the IRS gives them.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-08-02 05:20pm

Iceberg wrote:A flat tax would never fly. It sounds good on paper, but to lose the revenue of progressive taxation would require a flat tax rate sufficiently high that everybody BUT the top ten percent or so would see their tax rates increase SIGNIFICANTLY.

BTW, how many people talking about taxation know how the tax system ACTUALLY WORKS?

It would necessitate a spending cut now wouldnt it... Oh wait... *ACK GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY THROAT*

The key to cutting tax revenue, is to also cut spending, a bit of a foreign concept to some people. But at least you wouldnt be discriminating against rich people.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-08-02 05:33pm

Alyrium Denryle wrote:It would necessitate a spending cut now wouldnt it... Oh wait... *ACK GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY THROAT*

The key to cutting tax revenue, is to also cut spending, a bit of a foreign concept to some people. But at least you wouldnt be discriminating against rich people.

Realism, Alyrium. They are never going to cut spending enough to make it work. Not in a thousand years.

A Big Flying Fish · Post by **A Big Flying Fish** » 2004-08-02 05:42pm

You mean you people on the other side of the Atlantic don't have VAT? You bastards. The UK, and I believe a fair number of other countries (European, I believe Australia and NZ have one as well) have one, and it can work as a form of taxation. simply don't levy it on neccessities. It isn't levied on cold food, water, books, newsapapers, children's clothing and I think housing up to about £200,000. Electricity has it at 5%. Everything else is 17.5%. This on top of income tax, duties and a large number of other taxes. Don't to worked up, you're not anywhere near communist yet.

Vohu Manah · Post by **Vohu Manah** » 2004-08-02 06:05pm

No VAT in the US, and I also seriously doubt this plan will ever be enacted. I think the Republicans are being morons on a few issues, but I trust them not to ultimately shoot themselves in the foot. This is pre-election posturing, and they're being stupid about it.

Wait, Hastert said this? Isn't this the guy who in May pretended to forget who John McCain was, then proceeded to complain that McCain (a former POW) didn't understand the sacrifice of members of the Armed Forces in war?

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/05/ ... n.hastert/

Iceberg · Post by **Iceberg** » 2004-08-02 07:24pm

Alyrium Denryle wrote:It would necessitate a spending cut now wouldnt it... Oh wait... *ACK GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY THROAT*

The key to cutting tax revenue, is to also cut spending, a bit of a foreign concept to some people. But at least you wouldnt be discriminating against rich people.

Oh, those poor, discriminated-against rich people. I feel so sorry for them. Maybe they should go home and cry in their swimming pools if they feel so oppressed.

A flat tax is promoting equitability (i.e. everybody gets the same outcome) at the expense of fairness (i.e. everybody has the same opportunities). By saying that everybody should have the same tax rate, you're saying that the opportunities from having 10,000 dollars are the same as the opportunities from having a million dollars (which is definitely untrue). Now, we can't, obviously, give every American the same income - that would negate the idea of rewarding extraordinary effort and extraordinary talent. What we CAN do is minimize the impact of having less opportunity, which in our economic system is done by reducing the tax burden suffered by those who are in a position of reduced opportunity (i.e. income) vis a vis those who are in a position of increased opportunity.

THAT is the reason and the morality of having a progressively graduated income tax - not to punish success, but to ameliorate the sting of failure.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-08-02 07:47pm

Fuck this shit, I'd rather pay a simple flat tax then fuck with the 1040s.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-08-02 07:48pm

Enough Said.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-08-02 07:50pm

See, see, that's why I'm going to be an auditor instead of a tax accountant.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-08-02 07:52pm

This strikes me as being a ridiculously bad strategy. The flat-tax rate proposals that they had a few years ago were VASTLY superior to this plan, if in fact it is true.