Kerry says plan will reduce deficit 50% in 4 yrs
Moderators: Alyrium Denryle, Edi, K. A. Pital
- MKSheppard
- Ruthless Genocidal Warmonger
- Posts: 29842
- Joined: 2002-07-06 06:34pm
Kerry says plan will reduce deficit 50% in 4 yrs
Teh Washington Compost
Democrats Vow to Cut Deficit by 50% in Four Years
By Dan Balz and Lois Romano
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, August 4, 2004; Page A04
BELOIT, Wis., Aug. 3 -- Seeking to exploit a budget deficit that has ballooned under President Bush, John F. Kerry pledged Tuesday to restore fiscal discipline in Washington as he barnstormed through small towns in southern Wisconsin.
"We have to get back to being fiscally responsible," the Massachusetts senator told an enthusiastic audience in an old hockey arena. "Here's the pledge that John Edwards and I have made: We've laid out a plan that will help us reduce the deficit in half over the first four years of our administration."
On the fifth day of his trip across the country, Kerry offered his most detailed look at how he hopes to reduce the deficit while at the same time enacting a major expansion in health care coverage, assuring middle-class Americans a continuation of the tax cuts they have received under Bush, boosting spending on education and the environment, and giving state and local governments direct assistance.
Kerry's bus caravan rolled across the southern Wisconsin border, leaving Milwaukee in the late morning, stopping here at midday and continuing on to the Mississippi River and an evening rally in Dubuque, Iowa. Along the way he visited at a cheese store and a tavern and toured a brewery in Monroe. His day was to end in Davenport, Iowa, and on Wednesday both he and the president will campaign there.
Bush's campaign has challenged Kerry on fiscal issues since the general-election campaign began in March, saying that Kerry's health care plan alone would require him to raise taxes and asserting that his spending proposals far exceed the new revenue he can raise. "When it comes to fiscal discipline, John Kerry's claims lack credibility," said Bush-Cheney spokesman Steve Schmidt.
Kerry advisers again challenged that assertion Tuesday by issuing a balance sheet that they said showed that over the next decade, his programs would generate about $365 billion more in revenue than they would require in spending. But those estimates would require significant changes in the tax code winning passage in Congress and are based on other assumptions that may prove challenging to a Kerry presidency.
Advisers said that, while Kerry is committed to reducing the deficit by returning to pay-as-you-go financing and automatic spending cuts, he would not allow that to frustrate his goal of enacting major health care reform. "He's willing to scale other things back, but on health care he believes we need to address the health care deficit as well as the budget deficit," policy adviser Sarah Bianchi said.
During a question-and-answer session here, Kerry pointed to the Clinton administration's record, saying he would restore the kinds of policies that brought about sustained economic growth and a balanced federal budget. "When Bill Clinton left office, we had a $5.6 trillion surplus. Surplus!" he said. "That has now been turned into a deficit as far as eyes can see. What's worse is there is $6 trillion of unexplained expenditures and proposals. They don't say where the money is going to come from."
Those policies, according to Kerry advisers, include restoration of caps on discretionary spending and budgets that keep the growth of discretionary spending in line with inflation, with the exception of security and education spending. Automatic cuts would come into force if spending exceeded inflation, again excluding security and education.
Kerry's health care plan would cost about $900 billion over 10 years, but when measures to cut costs are included, the price tag would fall to about $653 billion, according to estimates by Kenneth E. Thorpe of Emory University. The candidate also proposes about $200 billion in new education spending. Other major items include a cut in corporate tax rates, which would cost about $120 billion over 10 years.
To raise revenue, Kerry would roll back the income tax rate cuts for Americans making more than $200,000, repeal capital gains and dividend tax cuts enacted under Bush, and repeal the elimination of the estate tax, which Kerry's campaign said would produce about $860 billion in revenue.
Beyond repealing the Bush tax cuts, the biggest source of revenue comes from eliminating "corporate welfare" and closing tax loopholes. All together, Kerry's campaign listed $500 billion in savings over 10 years from the changes. Independent budget analysts said privately Tuesday that a Kerry administration would have trouble enacting all the changes in the tax code, given the power of special interests in Congress.
Kerry advisers outlined several other steps designed to constrain spending, including a pledge to enact a constitutionally sound line-item veto, as well as the elimination of a few small federal offices and up to 100,000 federal contractors.
Edwards took the same fiscal message to Louisiana. But local officials who introduced him in this heavily Catholic state emphasized the ticket's values. "At the Democratic convention, we decided to take back the issues of faith and family and country," Lt. Gov. Mitchell J. Landrieu told the 1,500 people who greeted Edwards in Baton Rouge.
Just before Edwards arrived at the old state capitol, the Bush campaign sent an e-mail to reporters alerting them that "more than 1,000 Bush supporters" would be on hand; 48 made it, and they shouted as Edwards spoke. "Don't worry," he quipped. "They'll stop in a minute."
Later in Alexandria, Edwards argued for reducing the government bureaucracy and accused the Bush administration of having "layered on a whole crowd of supervisory people in the government."
"We don't need any more supervisors. . . . We got to get rid of these people," he said.
But it may have been Elizabeth Edwards who got off the best line, when she was talking about how all the manufacturers in her husband's boyhood town, Robbins, N.C., are closed. "[It's] people doing the right thing and being let down by your government because they're not fighting for your job," she said to much applause.
Romano reported from Louisiana.
***********************
Right, so John Kerry wants to do all these big spending programmes like
Health Care, etc, YET cut the federal deficit in half in 4 years. That'd
be a nice hat trick, considering we're spending something like $200 billion
on homeland security, and he CAN'T CUT THAT. To do so would open him
up to attack by the Republicans as being weak on defense issues. This
plan is just ridiculously laughable.
Democrats Vow to Cut Deficit by 50% in Four Years
By Dan Balz and Lois Romano
Washington Post Staff Writers
Wednesday, August 4, 2004; Page A04
BELOIT, Wis., Aug. 3 -- Seeking to exploit a budget deficit that has ballooned under President Bush, John F. Kerry pledged Tuesday to restore fiscal discipline in Washington as he barnstormed through small towns in southern Wisconsin.
"We have to get back to being fiscally responsible," the Massachusetts senator told an enthusiastic audience in an old hockey arena. "Here's the pledge that John Edwards and I have made: We've laid out a plan that will help us reduce the deficit in half over the first four years of our administration."
On the fifth day of his trip across the country, Kerry offered his most detailed look at how he hopes to reduce the deficit while at the same time enacting a major expansion in health care coverage, assuring middle-class Americans a continuation of the tax cuts they have received under Bush, boosting spending on education and the environment, and giving state and local governments direct assistance.
Kerry's bus caravan rolled across the southern Wisconsin border, leaving Milwaukee in the late morning, stopping here at midday and continuing on to the Mississippi River and an evening rally in Dubuque, Iowa. Along the way he visited at a cheese store and a tavern and toured a brewery in Monroe. His day was to end in Davenport, Iowa, and on Wednesday both he and the president will campaign there.
Bush's campaign has challenged Kerry on fiscal issues since the general-election campaign began in March, saying that Kerry's health care plan alone would require him to raise taxes and asserting that his spending proposals far exceed the new revenue he can raise. "When it comes to fiscal discipline, John Kerry's claims lack credibility," said Bush-Cheney spokesman Steve Schmidt.
Kerry advisers again challenged that assertion Tuesday by issuing a balance sheet that they said showed that over the next decade, his programs would generate about $365 billion more in revenue than they would require in spending. But those estimates would require significant changes in the tax code winning passage in Congress and are based on other assumptions that may prove challenging to a Kerry presidency.
Advisers said that, while Kerry is committed to reducing the deficit by returning to pay-as-you-go financing and automatic spending cuts, he would not allow that to frustrate his goal of enacting major health care reform. "He's willing to scale other things back, but on health care he believes we need to address the health care deficit as well as the budget deficit," policy adviser Sarah Bianchi said.
During a question-and-answer session here, Kerry pointed to the Clinton administration's record, saying he would restore the kinds of policies that brought about sustained economic growth and a balanced federal budget. "When Bill Clinton left office, we had a $5.6 trillion surplus. Surplus!" he said. "That has now been turned into a deficit as far as eyes can see. What's worse is there is $6 trillion of unexplained expenditures and proposals. They don't say where the money is going to come from."
Those policies, according to Kerry advisers, include restoration of caps on discretionary spending and budgets that keep the growth of discretionary spending in line with inflation, with the exception of security and education spending. Automatic cuts would come into force if spending exceeded inflation, again excluding security and education.
Kerry's health care plan would cost about $900 billion over 10 years, but when measures to cut costs are included, the price tag would fall to about $653 billion, according to estimates by Kenneth E. Thorpe of Emory University. The candidate also proposes about $200 billion in new education spending. Other major items include a cut in corporate tax rates, which would cost about $120 billion over 10 years.
To raise revenue, Kerry would roll back the income tax rate cuts for Americans making more than $200,000, repeal capital gains and dividend tax cuts enacted under Bush, and repeal the elimination of the estate tax, which Kerry's campaign said would produce about $860 billion in revenue.
Beyond repealing the Bush tax cuts, the biggest source of revenue comes from eliminating "corporate welfare" and closing tax loopholes. All together, Kerry's campaign listed $500 billion in savings over 10 years from the changes. Independent budget analysts said privately Tuesday that a Kerry administration would have trouble enacting all the changes in the tax code, given the power of special interests in Congress.
Kerry advisers outlined several other steps designed to constrain spending, including a pledge to enact a constitutionally sound line-item veto, as well as the elimination of a few small federal offices and up to 100,000 federal contractors.
Edwards took the same fiscal message to Louisiana. But local officials who introduced him in this heavily Catholic state emphasized the ticket's values. "At the Democratic convention, we decided to take back the issues of faith and family and country," Lt. Gov. Mitchell J. Landrieu told the 1,500 people who greeted Edwards in Baton Rouge.
Just before Edwards arrived at the old state capitol, the Bush campaign sent an e-mail to reporters alerting them that "more than 1,000 Bush supporters" would be on hand; 48 made it, and they shouted as Edwards spoke. "Don't worry," he quipped. "They'll stop in a minute."
Later in Alexandria, Edwards argued for reducing the government bureaucracy and accused the Bush administration of having "layered on a whole crowd of supervisory people in the government."
"We don't need any more supervisors. . . . We got to get rid of these people," he said.
But it may have been Elizabeth Edwards who got off the best line, when she was talking about how all the manufacturers in her husband's boyhood town, Robbins, N.C., are closed. "[It's] people doing the right thing and being let down by your government because they're not fighting for your job," she said to much applause.
Romano reported from Louisiana.
***********************
Right, so John Kerry wants to do all these big spending programmes like
Health Care, etc, YET cut the federal deficit in half in 4 years. That'd
be a nice hat trick, considering we're spending something like $200 billion
on homeland security, and he CAN'T CUT THAT. To do so would open him
up to attack by the Republicans as being weak on defense issues. This
plan is just ridiculously laughable.
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
I doubt even that will allow him to implement all the programs he's planning AND cut the deficit by 50% by the end of his first term...Durandal wrote:Did you miss the parts about repealing several of Bush's tax cuts, corporate welfare and closing tax loopholes?
The M2HB: The Greatest Machinegun Ever Made.
HAB: Crew-Served Weapons Specialist
"Making fun of born-again Christians is like hunting dairy cows with a high powered rifle and scope." --P.J. O'Rourke
"A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." --J.S. Mill
HAB: Crew-Served Weapons Specialist
"Making fun of born-again Christians is like hunting dairy cows with a high powered rifle and scope." --P.J. O'Rourke
"A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." --J.S. Mill
- Illuminatus Primus
- All Seeing Eye
- Posts: 15774
- Joined: 2002-10-12 02:52pm
- Location: Gainesville, Florida, USA
- Contact:
He's showing some of the amazing iniative that many Conservatives said he just couldn't have?
Cutting Government jobs and a line-item veto? I like the sound of that.
Cutting Government jobs and a line-item veto? I like the sound of that.
"You know what the problem with Hollywood is. They make shit. Unbelievable. Unremarkable. Shit." - Gabriel Shear, Swordfish
"This statement, in its utterly clueless hubristic stupidity, cannot be improved upon. I merely quote it in admiration of its perfection." - Garibaldi in reply to an incredibly stupid post.
The Fifth Illuminatus Primus | Warsie | Skeptical Empiricist | Florida Gator | Sustainability Advocate | Libertarian Socialist |
"This statement, in its utterly clueless hubristic stupidity, cannot be improved upon. I merely quote it in admiration of its perfection." - Garibaldi in reply to an incredibly stupid post.
The Fifth Illuminatus Primus | Warsie | Skeptical Empiricist | Florida Gator | Sustainability Advocate | Libertarian Socialist |
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
I don't think he missed it. I saw the same and I just don't think it can realistically be done. If nothing else these sort of massive social welfare programs have a nasty habit of ballooning out of control and I don't see Kerry's being any different.Durandal wrote:Did you miss the parts about repealing several of Bush's tax cuts, corporate welfare and closing tax loopholes?
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
Now what I want to know is, how does he think that raising business taxes is going to do good things for our troubled economy? I'd love to see that stuff cut but I don't think in the middle of economic troubles is the best time for it. Unless he's got a really good plan for helping them out in other ways I don't see that helping. All in all, I only think it's more likely we'll see more protectionism.
- Wicked Pilot
- Moderator Emeritus
- Posts: 8972
- Joined: 2002-07-05 05:45pm
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
- Durandal
- Bile-Driven Hate Machine
- Posts: 17927
- Joined: 2002-07-03 06:26pm
- Location: Silicon Valley, CA
- Contact:
Shep criticized his plan for a supposed inherent deficiency ("You can't cut the deficit while introducing new big spending programs"), not its implementation.Stormbringer wrote:I don't think he missed it. I saw the same and I just don't think it can realistically be done. If nothing else these sort of massive social welfare programs have a nasty habit of ballooning out of control and I don't see Kerry's being any different.Durandal wrote:Did you miss the parts about repealing several of Bush's tax cuts, corporate welfare and closing tax loopholes?
Damien Sorresso
"Ever see what them computa bitchez do to numbas? It ain't natural. Numbas ain't supposed to be code, they supposed to quantify shit."
- The Onion
"Ever see what them computa bitchez do to numbas? It ain't natural. Numbas ain't supposed to be code, they supposed to quantify shit."
- The Onion
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
Probably for the same reason others have. They don't believe that Kerry can deliever his big spending new brainchilds and still cut overall spending.Durandal wrote:Shep criticized his plan for a supposed inherent deficiency ("You can't cut the deficit while introducing new big spending programs"), not its implementation.Stormbringer wrote:I don't think he missed it. I saw the same and I just don't think it can realistically be done. If nothing else these sort of massive social welfare programs have a nasty habit of ballooning out of control and I don't see Kerry's being any different.Durandal wrote:Did you miss the parts about repealing several of Bush's tax cuts, corporate welfare and closing tax loopholes?
- Darth Wong
- Sith Lord
- Posts: 70028
- Joined: 2002-07-03 12:25am
- Location: Toronto, Canada
- Contact:
Why is everyone worried that Kerry will be more protectionist than Bush? I don't know what you people in the US think, but from outside, in the countries that are being punished by his various levies and trade protectionist policies, George W. Bush looks like the champion of protectionists.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
Fair enough, but John Kerry has made vague promises that he will somehow stop the outsourcing of jobs to foreign countries (of course as usual, he hasn't actually gone into great detail on how he's going to do this), and the only way to stop that sort of thing is protectionist policy.Darth Wong wrote:Why is everyone worried that Kerry will be more protectionist than Bush? I don't know what you people in the US think, but from outside, in the countries that are being punished by his various levies and trade protectionist policies, George W. Bush looks like the champion of protectionists.
BoTM / JL / MM / HAB / VRWC / Horseman
I'm studying for the CPA exam. Have a nice summer, and if you're down just sit back and realize that Joe is off somewhere, doing much worse than you are.
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
I don't know that he will be but rhetorically John Kerry has made a big deal about stopping the export of jobs and leveling the playing feild for American workers. The fact is there doesn't seem to be any conceivable way he can fufill all the promises he's made (and remember he owes far more to labor than Bush) with out resorting to a fairly heavy degree of protectionist policy.Darth Wong wrote:Why is everyone worried that Kerry will be more protectionist than Bush? I don't know what you people in the US think, but from outside, in the countries that are being punished by his various levies and trade protectionist policies, George W. Bush looks like the champion of protectionists.
Quite frankly, a lot of Americans aren't going to have a problem with that. Most understandably don't care about protectionist policy. They're concerned about their jobs and are willing to follow anyone that protects them, by any means. Again it's understandable.
I believe Kerry can do it, for a very simple reason. Kerry believes in raising taxes and spending money on new programs. Bush, on the other hand, believes in cutting taxes and spending money on new programs. It doesnt take a genius to do the math on this one... At the very least, Kerry will stop the fact that the deficit is going up. And thats a good thing.
This whole economic situation irritates me. Reagan did it, and now Dubya is doing it, too. If you spend money you dont have, the economy improves for a little while. Then intrest catches up to you and the economy goes in the shitter. It caught up with Bush Sr., and thats why Clinton beat him. And sooner or later, if Bush doesnt change his spending habits, there will be another recession. The only time this policy didnt end in ruin was with the New Deal. And thats just cuz WWII came along and all the wartime contracts made it so there was a big enough economy to sustain the debt.
This whole economic situation irritates me. Reagan did it, and now Dubya is doing it, too. If you spend money you dont have, the economy improves for a little while. Then intrest catches up to you and the economy goes in the shitter. It caught up with Bush Sr., and thats why Clinton beat him. And sooner or later, if Bush doesnt change his spending habits, there will be another recession. The only time this policy didnt end in ruin was with the New Deal. And thats just cuz WWII came along and all the wartime contracts made it so there was a big enough economy to sustain the debt.
The wisdom of PA:
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
Don't count on it, Kerry doesn't want to ditch that much of Bush's spending programs and what he does it's mostly to divert to his own programs. And his overly optomistic plans all assume an economy that's favorable (like the largely mythical Clinton surplus) If you're looking for fiscal responsiblity I wouldn't look to Kerry.Bugsby wrote:I believe Kerry can do it, for a very simple reason. Kerry believes in raising taxes and spending money on new programs. Bush, on the other hand, believes in cutting taxes and spending money on new programs. It doesnt take a genius to do the math on this one... At the very least, Kerry will stop the fact that the deficit is going up. And thats a good thing.
His policies are going to require a lot of spending, he's talking about one of the most (if not the) ambitious social welfare in a very long time. And all he's got in the works for financing it is repealing some of Bush and the Republican tax cuts. Which isn't at all likely to be enough.
- Darth Wong
- Sith Lord
- Posts: 70028
- Joined: 2002-07-03 12:25am
- Location: Toronto, Canada
- Contact:
I keep hearing this phrase, yet the official budget figures indicated that Clinton's budget surplus was quite real, ie- government program spending was smaller than revenue. So why it is "mythical"?Stormbringer wrote:... like the largely mythical Clinton surplus ...
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Mike/RantMode/Blurbs.html
Anything is better than what Bush is doing now (see the second part of my argument above). And although Kerry might be talking about a massive social welfare program, once it hits Congress it will be stripped down to a much cheaper plan. It always is.
The wisdom of PA:
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
Anything is better than what Bush is doing now (see the second part of my argument above). And although Kerry might be talking about a massive social welfare program, once it hits Congress it will be stripped down to a much cheaper plan. It always is.
The wisdom of PA:
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
-Normal Person + Anonymity + Audience = Total Fuckwad
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
Because it was obtained in the here and now by borrowing from the various Social Security trust funds against furture growth of revenue. With out that there would have been no surplus until 2008 or so. And the thing about those projections were they all assumed that we'd get a decade more of internet bubble rate growth; obviously even then that was an unreasonable assumption.Darth Wong wrote:I keep hearing this phrase, yet the official budget figures indicated that Clinton's budget surplus was quite real, ie- government program spending was smaller than revenue. So why it is "mythical"?Stormbringer wrote:... like the largely mythical Clinton surplus ...
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
How so? Kerry isn't even talking about balancing the budget. Just cutting the deficit against some serious tax hikes (that might well not yeild the revenue he's hoping for). So that blows the notion that a balanced budget would help the economy. First of all, it's not balance. Second of all, cutting subsidies while putting in place protectionist policies won't be better than Bush.Bugsby wrote:Anything is better than what Bush is doing now (see the second part of my argument above).
Look at what Kerry's actually proposing, not just the fancy sell.
Maybe, that's assuming we've got a hostile Congress. The Republicans just might loose enough to give a solid Democratic Congress.Bugsby wrote:And although Kerry might be talking about a massive social welfare program, once it hits Congress it will be stripped down to a much cheaper plan. It always is.
Because Bush spent it. It was a rock solid surplus when the Congress was licking its lips looking forward to spending it. The moment it vanished due to Bush's increased spending and cut taxes (hence tax income) it suddenly became 'mythical'.Darth Wong wrote:I keep hearing this phrase, yet the official budget figures indicated that Clinton's budget surplus was quite real, ie- government program spending was smaller than revenue. So why it is "mythical"?Stormbringer wrote:... like the largely mythical Clinton surplus ...
Wherever you go, there you are.
Ripped Shirt Monkey - BOTMWriter's Guild Cybertron's Finest Justice League
This updated sig brought to you by JME2
Ripped Shirt Monkey - BOTMWriter's Guild Cybertron's Finest Justice League
This updated sig brought to you by JME2
- Stormbringer
- King of Democracy
- Posts: 22678
- Joined: 2002-07-15 11:22pm
You do realize that it was achieved by borrowing against future gains right? THERE WAS NO REAL SURPLUS! At least no more than one's mortage is a surplusStravo wrote:Because Bush spent it. It was a rock solid surplus when the Congress was licking its lips looking forward to spending it. The moment it vanished due to Bush's increased spending and cut taxes (hence tax income) it suddenly became 'mythical'.Darth Wong wrote:I keep hearing this phrase, yet the official budget figures indicated that Clinton's budget surplus was quite real, ie- government program spending was smaller than revenue. So why it is "mythical"?Stormbringer wrote:... like the largely mythical Clinton surplus ...
The only thing more blind than born again politico is a born again fundy.
- TrailerParkJawa
- Sith Acolyte
- Posts: 5850
- Joined: 2002-07-04 11:49pm
- Location: San Jose, California
There is no way to cut the deficit in half in 4 years and create new programs at the same time. Its just bullshit talk to make people feel good. I think most Americans Demo or Rep could be stunned at how much cutting in gov't we have to do to get spending under control. Everyone wants to cut back except if it affects them, which basically means every program.
MEMBER of the Anti-PETA Anti-Facist LEAGUE
Okay. Let's ask the GOP what they think of the surplus. First of all what does it consist of GOP?Stormbringer wrote:You do realize that it was achieved by borrowing against future gains right? THERE WAS NO REAL SURPLUS! At least no more than one's mortage is a surplusStravo wrote: Because Bush spent it. It was a rock solid surplus when the Congress was licking its lips looking forward to spending it. The moment it vanished due to Bush's increased spending and cut taxes (hence tax income) it suddenly became 'mythical'.
The only thing more blind than born again politico is a born again fundy.
Hmm....people paying their taxes (I guess if you CUT them those numbers go down right?)The surplus is composed of two parts:
1. The “on-budget” surplus is a combination of people paying their federal income taxes and other revenues. Over 10 years this portion of the surplus is going to be at least $800 billion dollars.
2. The “off-budget” or Social Security surplus comes from payroll taxes collected to fund Social Security, as well as the interest on these taxes. Over 10 years this portion of the surplus will be about $1.8 trillion.
OK, maybe I'm being a smart ass. What else do you have to say about the surplus GOP?
Hmmm....Increased tax income...but wait Bush CUT those taxes didn't he?? And Social Security surplus. Where's the smoke and mirrors? Where's the myth from the GOP's own paper on the surplus.For the next couple years it is expected that almost the entire surplus will be due to the Social Security surplus. But surpluses in the non-Social Security portion of the budget will grow every year as taxpayers pay more than the government needs.
link
Wherever you go, there you are.
Ripped Shirt Monkey - BOTMWriter's Guild Cybertron's Finest Justice League
This updated sig brought to you by JME2
Ripped Shirt Monkey - BOTMWriter's Guild Cybertron's Finest Justice League
This updated sig brought to you by JME2