Moderator: Vympel
Luke was good in Vector Prime, and Dark Tide (rescuing Jacen with a force storm of boulders).CaptainChewbacca wrote:Luke kicked ass in Vector Prime and didn't stop till it was over.
So have I, and, scary as this sounds, Ruins of Dantooine makes The Crystal Star look like A Tale Of Two Cities.Cal Wright wrote:No Praxis. Crystal Star takes the cake. BFC was bad, but *shudders* I've read through Crystal Star.
Also how about Star by Star, Enemy lines doulogy and Destiney's Way where looks flies against the enemy and and goes on covert mission and the like.Praxis wrote:Luke was good in Vector Prime, and Dark Tide (rescuing Jacen with a force storm of boulders).CaptainChewbacca wrote:Luke kicked ass in Vector Prime and didn't stop till it was over.
Luke letting loose and kicking ass in Unifying Force was one of the highlights of the NJO for me. It was a long time coming.Praxis wrote:
Luke was good in Vector Prime, and Dark Tide (rescuing Jacen with a force storm of boulders).
The rest of the series he was a wuss, whining about not to fight the Vong because attacking them leads to the dark side, etc, etc.
In the Unifying Force he finally got the point and slaughtered them like nuts.
That was their role in society but in attitude, style, and action they're very obviously based on samurai. They believe in an all-encompassing life force which they can use to augment their senses and perform great physical feats; these skills can only be properly accessed by banishing emotion and extraneous thoughts; they use friggin' swords...CaptainChewbacca wrote:Actually, Lucas most closely compared the Jedi to US Marshalls.
Darksaber was bad, but it did have a few good parts.Enforcer Talen wrote:no one's tossing out darksaber in the litany of bad books?
Dang, I was just reminded of Sisko's preaching in DS9 after battles...Faqa wrote:Where's "Courtship" in this litany of Luke-pussification?!
EVERY DAMN TIME, he tells the witches to "give up", and even RELEASES his hold on one(pulling a Vader. Heh...) when she claims to surrender. And we get preaching. Oh, god, the preaching. "No anger" this, "No violence" that. Left and right. He encourages people not to kill BEFORE A BATTLE!!
That has my vote, with Planet of Twilight in a close second. As for Courtship, I always read that when I'm feeling sick, and it cheers me up.Kuja wrote:The New Rebellion is still at the top of the shitheap as far as I'm concerned.
Here's the bad: They brought back Madine just to kill him!Spanky The Dolphin wrote:There were many parts of Darksaber that I enjoyed, but also so many that I thought were very poor. Darksaber really isn't so much a terrible book as it is a misguided one that doesn't live up to the full possible potential that it could have.
It's a book that has a really interesting idea that could have been great, but KJA made too many poor and subpar decisions with it that it ended up sounding like a bad cartoonish comic book.
The parts with Luke and Calista were somewhat lame, but there was so much more that went wrong in that book, which partially makes me a little sad...
Ninja make more sense, actually.Pablo Sanchez wrote:That was their role in society but in attitude, style, and action they're very obviously based on samurai. They believe in an all-encompassing life force which they can use to augment their senses and perform great physical feats; these skills can only be properly accessed by banishing emotion and extraneous thoughts; they use friggin' swords...CaptainChewbacca wrote:Actually, Lucas most closely compared the Jedi to US Marshalls.
Lucas has cited the famous samurai flick The Hidden Fortress as inspiration for Star Wars.
They were more than that.Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Except that ninja were pretty much exclusively spies and assassins...
True... except for my point about nobility - the samurai were considered nobles while the ninja weren't. I make the distinction because the Jedi act very sneakily the great majority of the time: Ben on the DS, Luke's plan at Jabba's palace, the Jedi infiltrating the arena in AOTC (regardless of what followed afterwards...Ghost Rider wrote:Then again why the distinction since Ninja and Samurai were one and the same...just what we consider Ninja were a couple of clans who took up a more clandestine sake of fighting.
), Mace Windu sneaking up to Dooku and Jango et al and in a position to decapitate the separatist movement in a flurry of violence (but he didn't... yes, he's Mr Badass... ), Mace Windu later leading a group of special COMMANDO units during the battle; Qui-gon had his priority straight - go straight to the command centre and decapitate the head - if it weren't for the droidekas... oh, the Jedi act like 'secret police' or 'secret service' in TPM and AOTC, both with their protection of Padme and their conduct with criminals like Zam Weesal.
He was a bit too preachy in that. As you point out, a couple of times he went too far in it. But frankly, it's not terribly out of line with the movies and the more rational EU portrayls. Luke's trying not to kill, maim, and generally give into solving everything with violence. That's in line with what we see out of Yoda in the movies after all. And given the context of an extremely violent society in which the best of them embraced a violent way of life it made sense enough.Faqa wrote:Where's "Courtship" in this litany of Luke-pussification?!
"Too preachy" is a bit of an understatement.
He was a bit too preachy in that. As you point out, a couple of times he went too far in it. But frankly, it's not terribly out of line with the movies and the more rational EU portrayls. Luke's trying not to kill, maim, and generally give into solving everything with violence. That's in line with what we see out of Yoda in the movies after all. And given the context of an extremely violent society in which the best of them embraced a violent way of life it made sense enough.
The ressurection (which was just too much of deus-ex in general) the portrayal of Luke as a powerful Jedi wasn't unreasonable. After all, the Force does make Luke an incredible pilot in Star Wars. So that's not at all unbelievable and the Falcon is a hot-rod of a courier ship anyway.
"You feel the pull too, the bloodlust, the call of the hunt", Luke said, pulling off his flight suit. Beneath it, he was dressed in flowing robes the red color of desert sandstone. "That's the Dark Side of the Force whispering to you, calling to you"
"So, tell me", Luke said, "how did your brother die?" "Shot", Isolder said, "Harravan shot him in the head with a blaster".
"I see", Luke said. "You must forgive him. Your anger burns in you, a black spot on your heart. You must forgive him and serve the Light side of the Force"
Ugh. That's not just "too preachy". that's "Pat Buchanean on steroids" preachy!"When you remain calm, when you feel at peace, when you show mercy and justice to those who make themselves your enemies, then you will know that you are using the Force correctly. But if you surrender to hate, or despair, or greed, then you give in to the dark side and it will dominate your destiny, take control of you"
Again considering even the good gals of it were verging on the Dark side I'd say it's not too preachy. After all, a Jedi might be required to fight but when they start enjoying then there's a problem.Ugh. That's not just "too preachy". that's "Pat Buchanean on steroids" preachy!
I agree that Zahn did a far better portrayl than just about anyone else. However I disagree with your notion that a Jedi should kill lightly.I would really hate to be accused wanking off to Zahn's trilogy, but he does it RIGHT. Luke is discplined, controlled, powerful and resourseful. At the same time, he knows how and when to kill, he knows he's got a sufficiently long way to go before he can dictate or teach ANYONE, and he's NOT a one-man army! More like the way a knight is supposed to be(the only decision he made I disagreed with was not finishing off C'baoth in DFR, but he's forgiven for one lapse).
He made a shot that even the computers couldn't make all using the Force for fuck's sake! It made Anakin a champion pod-racer at nine! I don't think the piloting scene is at all over the top all things considered.Further, you must have forgotten the following ANH line:
"You bet I could, I'm not such a bad pilot myself".
Waaaaaaay before he started tapping into the Force. He's a good pilot, and the Force makes him better, but c'mon, "Courtship"'s portrayal was just plain annoying.
IM sorry i havent gotten on this post, i can only get on on weekends. For those of you who think im basing it on one book im not, the 80's book quote was to show that i have read that many books and is basing my opinion on those books. The Thernbee is coaxed in The New Rebellion, he coaxes a whole lot of creatures like the Yezzum or Yuzzem (2 species diffrent types i cant tell them apart by name) in Splinter of the Minds Eye. People put that book down because of its simplicity but may i remind you that it was the intended sequel and TV movie if A New Hope failed in the box office. I dont remember which series it was but there was one where Luke "dies" and he needs to coax mother nature to give him streagth. Crystal Star was retarded, much to Treky and featured the only other alien from a nother dimension in Star Wars next to the Otherspace books.Spanky The Dolphin wrote:What's the "80ish EU book"?
