Identity of Sidious Reveaeled?

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-08-09 05:41am

Stofsk wrote: If they're DIFFERENT people, why the fuck are they played by the same fucking actor?

A clone perhaps? Or perhaps Siddious is secretely manipulating Palpatine and wants to take his place once the crackdown on the sepretists is over and his power is cemented. There are literally infinite ways this could go that don't lead to Palpatine = Siddious OR Palpatine != Siddious (at least not in such a clear cut manner).

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2004-08-09 05:46am

The Kernel wrote:
Stofsk wrote:If they're DIFFERENT people, why the fuck are they played by the same fucking actor?
A clone perhaps? Or perhaps Siddious is secretely manipulating Palpatine and wants to take his place once the crackdown on the sepretists is over and his power is cemented. There are literally infinite ways this could go that don't lead to Palpatine = Siddious OR Palpatine != Siddious (at least not in such a clear cut manner).

That's what I heard; Palpy was a clone, who had no force abilities and thus couldn't be detected by the Jedi who were in close proximity. But then, that was before AOTC, where it's stated the Jedi are being attacked on more than one plane and angle. (they're 'use of the force being diminished' thing couldn't have been an accident...)

Sir Sirius · Post by **Sir Sirius** » 2004-08-09 05:55am

Vympel wrote:Your disgust with the idea is only matched by the idea's stupidity. It is, IMO, propagated by idiots who haven't been following the behind the scenes chatter of the PT at all. It's a stupid twist, it's been disavowed more than once from practically the top, IIRC. Fucking hell, it's just so STUPID. It probably originated with some dumbass who doesn't even know Ian McDiarmid played the Emperor in ROTJ.

The first time I heard of this was from a guy who said that he based his predictions of the events in Ep.III (this and a couple of others) on something GL said in the commentaries of AotC DVD, I haven't seen them so I don't know what he was talking about.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-08-09 05:57am

Stofsk wrote: That's what I heard; Palpy was a clone, who had no force abilities and thus couldn't be detected by the Jedi who were in close proximity. But then, that was before AOTC, where it's stated the Jedi are being attacked on more than one plane and angle. (they're 'use of the force being diminished' thing couldn't have been an accident...)

That would make sense. If you were Siddious and you knew the Jedi could detect you if you tried to become chancellor, why not get a force-dumb patsy to do your work for you? If it is a clone that can help secure the secrecy of your identity, so much the better.

Robert Treder · Post by **Robert Treder** » 2004-08-09 07:07am

As for why Palpatine goes around as Sidious, ask yourself why Anakin goes around as Vader. It's this simple: part of being a Sith is adopting a pseudonym.

When Anakin Skywalker becomes a Sith, he adopts the name (and title) Darth Vader. When Palpatine became a Sith, he adopted the name (and title) Darth Sidious. But, since the galaxy at large isn't too keen on Sith, he has to go by his original name when dealing with the public.

It is very much like the difference between Batman and Bruce Wayne. They're both the same person, but they have different names for different occasions.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2004-08-09 10:20am

Agent Fisher wrote:
DPDarkPrimus wrote:He could have split personalities! ROFLOL!

If that's seriously what happens, I'm going to kill a puppy.
I suddenly have images of gollum from LoTR

Only both halves agree with each other.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2004-08-09 11:45am

Stofsk wrote:Here's what I don't 'get': If Palpatine and Sidious are the same person, why the identity change? ie Why do we have Palpatine and Darth Sidious?Why is Darth Sidious named at all?

If they're DIFFERENT people, why the fuck are they played by the same fucking actor?

What was GL's intention? I can't remember the commentaries that well, they were mostly GL wanking to CGI or someshit. Does he explain why at all?

Same reason secret agents use code names, makes it harder to get caught (too tired to explain beyond that).

EDIT :: Okay so I will; what's the point of belonging to a secret organisation if you use your real name

dworkin · Post by **dworkin** » 2004-08-09 03:12pm

As long as it's not done like a Scooby Doo cartoon I'll be happy.

Daphne - "And the evil Sith Lord is...Chanchellor Palpatine!"
Palpy - "Yes and I would of got awat with it if it wasn't for those rotten kids. Wait a second, this movie is called 'Revenge of the Sith', isn't it."
Velma - "Well, yes."
Palpy - "Thought so. Buwahahahahahaha! Force Lightning!"

Palpatine unleashes force lightning on the scooby gang, they die.

Palpy - "And your movies really sucked! Ahahahahahaha!"

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-09 05:59pm

dworkin wrote:As long as it's not done like a Scooby Doo cartoon I'll be happy.

Daphne - "And the evil Sith Lord is...Chanchellor Palpatine!"
Palpy - "Yes and I would of got awat with it if it wasn't for those rotten kids. Wait a second, this movie is called 'Revenge of the Sith', isn't it."
Velma - "Well, yes."
Palpy - "Thought so. Buwahahahahahaha! Force Lightning!"

Palpatine unleashes force lightning on the scooby gang, they die.

Palpy - "And your movies really sucked! Ahahahahahaha!"

LOL. Though I could imagine that, I also help the revealing scne isn't bad.

Isolder74 · Post by **Isolder74** » 2004-08-09 06:24pm

The way I see it Sidious is Palpatine's Sith identity. The fact that the Emporer has used clones before implies that he could be using a clone puppet in order to prevent being detected by the Jedi Council.

Of course Yoda say "Do not underestimate the powers of the Emporer or suffer your father's fate you will." This implies that Palpitine has powers that we can't possible imagine. Its not quite sure what this means but it appears that Yoda might have had trouble beating the Emporer. We do know that The man in Jedi has to be Sidious. If Palpitine was a meat puppet all throught the PT I see nothing wrong with that.

Though the most likely thing it that Palpitine = Sidious and he is very good at hiding his forse abilities. It is still not explained how he became the Senetor from Naboo.

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2004-08-10 03:48am

He didn't hide them that well. There was that slip-up near the beginning of AoTC where he read Amidala's mind and answered her question before she had a chance to ask it. We know that Yoda caught that one, but it's unclear if he told anyone.

Armored Goldbar · Post by **Armored Goldbar** » 2004-08-10 04:08am

Well, he hid it well enough that the whole fucking Jedi Council never picked up on it.

Personally, the scene where Yoda almost catches something and dismisses it nails it for me. Sidious = Palpatine. It was never a secret. He was always called Emperor Palpatine, never Emperor Sidious. Frankly, his use of the Force to read Amidala's mind should only confirm what we already know...not to mention the hard-to-miss Imperial Theme as he reviews his troops.

If GL messes this up, I'm gonna go on an indiscriminate testicle-stomping rampage, so help me God.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2004-08-10 04:17am

IIRC, the commentaries for TPM and AotC might also indicate that Palpatine is obviously Sidious.

Post by **Vympel** » 2004-08-10 05:42am

Drooling Iguana wrote:He didn't hide them that well. There was that slip-up near the beginning of AoTC where he read Amidala's mind and answered her question before she had a chance to ask it. We know that Yoda caught that one, but it's unclear if he told anyone.

Yoda's suspicions might have been raised, but really, considering the amount of times I've finished the thoughts of friends during conversation (followed by laughter), it's not unreasonable for him to dismiss it. I doubt he thought "he read her mind", even though we know he can read minds (ROTJ novelization).

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2004-08-13 09:54pm

It is still not explained how he became the Senetor from Naboo.

Presumably in the usual way these things happen, campaigned, got elected or appointed, and then used that position to further his own goals.

The crisis was on Naboo because that's where he was senator.

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-08-17 10:20pm

He's obviously time-traveling Kirk!

Oh, sorry, I got this confused with the "Future Guy's Identity" thread. ; p

Seriously though, it shouldn't even be a question... though I'm sure Lucas is happy about any false suspense that's been created on the 'net since TPM came out.

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2004-08-17 11:02pm

On him having two names, Count Donku was also Darth Tyronnus(I know I didn't spell that right).

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-08-18 06:11am

Or Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader or Obi-Wan/Ben Kenobi...

Thanas · Post by **Thanas** » 2004-08-18 05:11pm

Doesn't Palpy use the Kiburr chrystal to hide his force ability?

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-08-18 05:47pm

That's what Supershadow basically says on his website, but there's a sizable consensus that he's (to put it plainly) "full of it."

He may have somebody claiming to be an insider feeding him info about Episode III, but it could be misinformation (or SS himself could be part of misinformation) or it could be a simple case of wishfulthinking/attention seeking that is so common with big movie hype.

So, I wouldn't put too much stock in the idea. Personally I doubt we'll see any Kaiburr Crystal stuff, as Lucas seems to have abandoned that idea from the early script drafts of Star Wars. The EU establishes a completely different history for the Kaiburr crystal which conflicts with any notion that Palpatine might be using/have it anyway. Not that creating conflicts with the EU hasn't happened before with Lucas's new films, but anyway, so you see the problems with that theory...

Thanas · Post by **Thanas** » 2004-08-18 06:23pm

Ah thanks. That clears things up.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2004-08-18 10:55pm

Darth Garden Gnome wrote:I agree, it would suck. Instead of Palpatine being the sinister plotting mastermind that (I really hope) he is in TPM and AOTC, it turns out to be another guy entirely? I'll pass.

What if Sidious is HIS apprentice, and he was the original mastermind anyway?

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2004-08-19 06:26am

Then that would violate the "only two" rule. Though, perhaps the "Rule" was only a ruse, or Palpatine said "hell with the rules."

Lucas could have anything planned! But assuming he's not out to double-triple fool us...

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-19 02:48pm

Kurgan wrote:Then that would violate the "only two" rule. Though, perhaps the "Rule" was only a ruse, or Palpatine said "hell with the rules."

Lucas could have anything planned! But assuming he's not out to double-triple fool us...

Agreed; Palpatine's character never suggests going with conventional plans and such.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2004-08-19 03:11pm

Yeah, tha trule was Sith tradition, when Palpatine decided to conquer the galaxy he may have decided he needed more minions.

There's also the possibility of a clone.