California Supreme Court voiding all gay marriages: Breaking

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » 2004-08-12 10:14pm

You know, I'm fairly sure at this point that disallowing gay marriage violates a truckload and a half of Constitutional admendments. Not to mention the buttrape of seperation of church and state (Look I don't the SBs to have the political power to actually act out their opinion about my D&D playing heretic ass. It's flat out self preservation).

Honestly, the churches in question would have every right to say to a couple "I'm sorry preforming that ceremony for you violates our beliefs, why not try down the street?"

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-08-12 10:47pm

Ma Deuce wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:You Americans are funny. Gay marriage is already starting to become old news in Canada; we rarely see it mentioned in the papers any more except in reference to the American controversy.
It'll become an issue again during the next Federal election, of that I am sure...

Sure, if the Conservative party wants to lose again. Maybe in the intervening period, they will finally figure out that Canadians like economic conservatives, but not social conservatives.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-08-12 10:52pm

Ma Deuce wrote:Well, maybe they could just go to Massachucetts (is it legal there yet, or still pending?)...

It's legal in Massachusetts, but thanks to the DOMA, their home state doesn't have to recognize the marriage liscense.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-08-12 11:01pm

I still say the solution to anti-gay bigotry in the US is to revoke Medicaid for the elderly

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2004-08-13 12:22am

If I hadn't been at work today, I would have gotten over to SF City Hall ASAP to join in on the protests.

Bugsby · Post by **Bugsby** » 2004-08-13 12:52am

Darth Wong wrote:
Ma Deuce wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:You Americans are funny. Gay marriage is already starting to become old news in Canada; we rarely see it mentioned in the papers any more except in reference to the American controversy.
It'll become an issue again during the next Federal election, of that I am sure...
Sure, if the Conservative party wants to lose again. Maybe in the intervening period, they will finally figure out that Canadians like economic conservatives, but not social conservatives.

That's an interesting point. Of course coming out firmly opposed to gay marriage will damn the Republicans. So why don't the Dems make it an issue? So far all I have heard out of Kerry is tax cuts and Iraq.... if he starts really attacking Bush on his record of intolerance in proposing a CONSTITUTIONAL AMMENDMENT to end gay marriage, Bush will be forced to reply. And that is one debate that Bush will not only lose, but come out looking horribly shitstained in the process. Someone send Kerry a memo.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2004-08-13 01:42am

Trouble with that is there's enough shitheads/apathy on this issue that it wouldnt sink them even though it really should. There's just a lot more fundie fuck'eads in the US of A.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-08-13 03:02am

Gil Hamilton wrote:
Ma Deuce wrote:Well, maybe they could just go to Massachucetts (is it legal there yet, or still pending?)...
It's legal in Massachusetts, but thanks to the DOMA, their home state doesn't have to recognize the marriage liscense.

The DOMA violates the 10th in so many ways...

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-08-13 03:03am

Hold on, not the tenth... That was a brain fart folks,

Rather the Full Faith and Credit Clause

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-08-13 03:08am

Alyrium Denryle wrote:Hold on, not the tenth... That was a brain fart folks,

Rather the Full Faith and Credit Clause

Technically, it doesn't. States have the right to regulate how they accept contracts and documents from other states, is how I think it works.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-08-13 12:11pm

They are mandated to accept them in a manner presscribed by law, or in other words they must accept them, but they may ask for proof etc,

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2004-08-13 12:14pm

Bugsby wrote: So why don't the Dems make it an issue? So far all I have heard out of Kerry is tax cuts and Iraq.... if he starts really attacking Bush on his record of intolerance in proposing a CONSTITUTIONAL AMMENDMENT to end gay marriage, Bush will be forced to reply. And that is one debate that Bush will not only lose, but come out looking horribly shitstained in the process. Someone send Kerry a memo.

Unfortunately most polls show 60+% of Americans oppose the idea of gay marriage an in an election this tight Kerry cannot afford to be brave and stand out on a limb against Bush on this issue. He is just not charamastic enough to educate the voters on how wrong this issue is when more than half agree with it.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2004-08-13 01:10pm

Stravo wrote: Unfortunately most polls show 60+% of Americans oppose the idea of gay marriage an in an election this tight Kerry cannot afford to be brave and stand out on a limb against Bush on this issue. He is just not charamastic enough to educate the voters on how wrong this issue is when more than half agree with it.

A sad reflection of modern day American society rather than an antiquated gov't mandate. The only way to rectify this situation is national re-education of the issue and not shunting one lot of politicians out for another lot.

Ma Deuce · Post by **Ma Deuce** » 2004-08-13 03:52pm

Darth Wong wrote:Sure, if the Conservative party wants to lose again. Maybe in the intervening period, they will finally figure out that Canadians like economic conservatives, but not social conservatives.

Even if the Conservatives decide they don't want to touch the issue with a 10-foot pol next election, the Liberals will still make an issue about it as part of their negative "If the conservatives win, they'll abolish gay marriage!" advertising campaign.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2004-08-13 04:00pm

Ma Deuce wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Sure, if the Conservative party wants to lose again. Maybe in the intervening period, they will finally figure out that Canadians like economic conservatives, but not social conservatives.
Even if the Conservatives decide they don't want to touch the issue with a 10-foot pol next election, the Liberals will still make an issue about it as part of their negative "If the conservatives win, they'll abolish gay marriage!" advertising campaign.

That wouldn't have been nearly as effective if it weren't completely true, and Harper only made himself look like a sniveling weasel by refusing to admit what he wanted to do on the issue. After countless attempts to block gay marriage and voluminous rhetoric against it, he did an about-face on the campaign trail and said that he wouldn't push to change anything if he won. Then he slyly said that if he won a majority and if one of his MPs should just happen to bring it up on his own, he would support him with a free vote (which would inevitably go his way since a majority would mean he controls Parliament). That last part was so contemptibly weaselly that it probably turned off even some people who opposed gay marriage.

Talon Karrde · Post by **Talon Karrde** » 2004-08-15 10:58am

Darth Wong wrote:You Americans are funny. Gay marriage is already starting to become old news in Canada; we rarely see it mentioned in the papers any more except in reference to the American controversy.

Therefore, if your a gay American, move to Canada and become a gay Canadian and get married, we won't mind

Ma Deuce · Post by **Ma Deuce** » 2004-08-15 11:42am

Darth Wong wrote:That wouldn't have been nearly as effective if it weren't completely true, and Harper only made himself look like a sniveling weasel by refusing to admit what he wanted to do on the issue. After countless attempts to block gay marriage and voluminous rhetoric against it, he did an about-face on the campaign trail and said that he wouldn't push to change anything if he won. Then he slyly said that if he won a majority and if one of his MPs should just happen to bring it up on his own, he would support him with a free vote (which would inevitably go his way since a majority would mean he controls Parliament). That last part was so contemptibly weaselly that it probably turned off even some people who opposed gay marriage.

The Liberals will be certain to remind the voters of Harper's slimy about-face, as it would be rather effective ammo for during the campaign (and why not? they did remind the voters of something Harper said in '94: this is more recent and far more relevant). This would inevitably make gay marriage a part of the campaign debates. Harper and the conservatives will no doubt try and distance themselves from the issue, but the Liberals will press Harper about his socially regressive policies, and after last election, no one will believe him when he says he won't touch gay marriage. Harper has hurt his party not just in this election, but also in future ones through that one fuckup. Until he is no longer the party's leader, I doubt the Conservatives will actually be able to defeat the Liberals.

This is why I'm sure the gay-marriage issue will rear it's head again during the next election, and will probably continue to do so in each sucessive election until a more socially progressive politician becomes the Conservative leader.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2004-08-15 04:19pm

Talon Karrde wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:You Americans are funny. Gay marriage is already starting to become old news in Canada; we rarely see it mentioned in the papers any more except in reference to the American controversy.
Therefore, if your a [black] American, move to Canada and become a [black] Canadian and get married, we won't mind

sorry, couldn't resist the editing. . .

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-08-15 04:37pm

Talon Karrde wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:You Americans are funny. Gay marriage is already starting to become old news in Canada; we rarely see it mentioned in the papers any more except in reference to the American controversy.
Therefore, if your a gay American, move to Canada and become a gay Canadian and get married, we won't mind

Because, until they do so, any attempt you make to have a normal, loving relationship, will be underminded and Doomed to failure by the mere exsistence of such people.