Russians capture 3 suspects who planned massacre

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-09-05 11:58am

From ITAR-TASS via the AFP and thence the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) :

Police have arrested three suspects who they believe played a part in organising the hostage taking of a Russian school that resulted in hundreds dead, ITAR-TASS news agency reported today.

”All three of them are admitting to guilt,” the news agency quoted North Ossetian interior ministry spokesman Ismel Shaov as saying.

“According to their testimony, we hope to find the people who ordered this attack,” he said.

He said one of the three was believed to have been linked to previous alleged terror attacks.

According to the latest official toll, 330 people, half of them children, died in the three day stand-off that ended Friday in a six-hour gunfire exchange.

However, a worker at the main morgue that received bodies from the school told AFP that 394 corpses from the incident have been received to far.

Alex Moon · Post by **Alex Moon** » 2004-09-05 12:00pm

Bet those bastards are wishing for death right about now.

Omega-13 · Post by **Omega-13** » 2004-09-05 05:04pm

This could be seen as an indication between the differences between the cia/hls and the FSB,

different methods give different results.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-09-05 05:59pm

Make 'em talk, then tell 'em to enjoy their virgins.

Post by **Alyrium Denryle** » 2004-09-05 06:13pm

Make them talk, thumbscrew them, deprive them of sleep, flowly crush ther balls in a vice, I dont are how the russians persuade them

Col. Crackpot · Post by **Col. Crackpot** » 2004-09-05 09:24pm

and they're still alive? Putin's gotten soft since his KGB days.

Kazuaki Shimazaki · Post by **Kazuaki Shimazaki** » 2004-09-05 09:25pm

Can't kill them until you are sure you got everything from them. After that, perhaps a public execution.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-09-05 10:03pm

It's nice to see such a public advocation of the violent interrogation and torture of people that have yet to be brought to trial. How silly of me though, I forgot that you are all capable of judging guilt based on a press release.

darthdavid · Post by **darthdavid** » 2004-09-05 10:33pm

If they're guilty I hope the russians do unspeakble things to them. If not I hope they get a fair trial and are proven innocent.

acesand8s · Post by **acesand8s** » 2004-09-05 10:34pm

IIRC, Russia removed its moratorium on capital punishment for anyone related to the planning/execution of this attack.

SyntaxVorlon · Post by **SyntaxVorlon** » 2004-09-06 12:38am

Those fuckers deserve what's coming to them.

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-09-06 12:50am

(insert obligatory anti-terrorist statement)

Now, my (limited) understanding is that North Ossetia is a semi-autonomous province within the greater Russian federation (with, I have been led to believe, a somewhat greater degree of political autonomy than your average US state). Would then the terrorists be tried (at all?) within North Ossetia by whatever judiciary segment of the North Ossetian government exists, or would they be extradited to the government in Moscow?

Col. Crackpot · Post by **Col. Crackpot** » 2004-09-06 08:32am

The Kernel wrote:It's nice to see such a public advocation of the violent interrogation and torture of people that have yet to be brought to trial. How silly of me though, I forgot that you are all capable of judging guilt based on a press release.

i wasn't advocating it. i was expressing my suprise that it hadn't happened given the track record of the athorities involved.

GoldenFalcon · Post by **GoldenFalcon** » 2004-09-06 11:02am

I know that Russia is far from the US when it comes to justice ethics, but how do you think these prisoners will actually be dealt with?

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-09-06 01:31pm

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2004-09-06 06:44pm

If they're guilty and sentenced to death, I would first submit them to some kind of treatment to make them disbelieve in an afterlife. Then i'd kill them.

Rogue 9 · Post by **Rogue 9** » 2004-09-06 07:08pm

Slartibartfast wrote:If they're guilty and sentenced to death, I would first submit them to some kind of treatment to make them disbelieve in an afterlife. Then i'd kill them.

What, just in case?

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2004-09-06 07:21pm

Rogue 9 wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:If they're guilty and sentenced to death, I would first submit them to some kind of treatment to make them disbelieve in an afterlife. Then i'd kill them.
What, just in case?

No. It is so they will die without hope. Broken spirit.

Makes sense, but hard to do.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2004-09-06 07:51pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:
Rogue 9 wrote:
Slartibartfast wrote:If they're guilty and sentenced to death, I would first submit them to some kind of treatment to make them disbelieve in an afterlife. Then i'd kill them.
What, just in case?
No. It is so they will die without hope. Broken spirit.

Makes sense, but hard to do.

Yes, that's the idea. I agree it's hard to do, and I'm not up to date with the latest brainwashing techniques. But if there's a chance it works, I'd try it.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-09-06 08:33pm

”All three of them are admitting to guilt,” the news agency quoted North Ossetian interior ministry spokesman Ismel Shaov as saying.

This part bothers me, because I saw on CNN when they trotted them out originally one of them was pleading that he hadn't done anything. Here is a link to the CNN article and the relevant quote.

The suspect earlier had said he did not fire a shot inside the school and that he "pitied the children" who were taken captive.

"Of course I pitied the children, I swear to Allah. I have children myself. I didn't shoot. I swear to Allah," he said. "I don't want to die. I swear to Allah, I want to live."

This does not sound like the words of a jihadist to me and it's weird that now the suspects they have are admitting guilt. A cynical part of me is thinking that no matter who they catch is going to end up pleading guilty of this, but it's questionable whether or not they were actually involved in the massacre. I'm not sure that admissions of guilt are terribly good evidence here.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2004-09-06 09:12pm

Gil Hamilton wrote:This does not sound like the words of a jihadist to me and it's weird that now the suspects they have are admitting guilt. A cynical part of me is thinking that no matter who they catch is going to end up pleading guilty of this, but it's questionable whether or not they were actually involved in the massacre. I'm not sure that admissions of guilt are terribly good evidence here.

Sounds like someone who was involved in the attack, but who's now claiming he didn't actually kill anyone during the operation. Why doesn't that sound very good to you?

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-09-06 10:53pm

Master of Ossus wrote:Sounds like someone who was involved in the attack, but who's now claiming he didn't actually kill anyone during the operation. Why doesn't that sound very good to you?

What sort of Islamic Jihadist pleads for his innocence to the point of blubbering?

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2004-09-06 11:03pm

One who just got his door kicked in by the Russian troops?

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2004-09-07 07:00am

And more stuff from Putin:
Linky

Putin refuses talks with "child-killers"
Tue 7 September, 2004 09:15

MOSCOW (Reuters) - President Vladimir Putin has rejected calls to soften his Chechnya policy after last week's school hostage siege, in which at least 335 people died, and said he would not talk to Chechen separatists.

Putin also ruled out holding a public inquiry into the storming of the Beslan school after a three-day stand-off with rebels demanding Chechnya's independence ended in carnage. Half the victims were children.

"Why don't you meet Osama bin Laden, invite him to Brussels or to the White House and engage in talks, ask him what he wants and give it to him so he leaves you in peace?" Putin was quoted on Tuesday by the Guardian newspaper as saying.

"You find it possible to set some limitations in your dealings with these bastards, so why should we talk to people who are child-killers?" said Putin, who spoke to foreign journalists and academics late on Monday.

The authorities have been quick to blame Russia's bloodiest hostage crisis of recent years on international terrorists, linking the siege at School No.1 in the North Ossetian town of Beslan with bin Laden's Al Qaeda network.

But there have been pointed calls from countries like France for Russia to explain its get-tough policy in Chechnya, which human rights groups say has led to an escalation in atrocities by both Russian forces and rebels.

Putin said he would hold an internal investigation into the tragedy.

"I want to establish the chronicle of events and find out who is responsible and might be punished," he said, warning that any parliamentary probe could become "a political show".

And he vowed no change of course on the restive North Caucasus region, saying Chechen rebels should not be given a chance to take power.

"Just imagine that people who shoot children in the back came to power anywhere on our planet. Just ask yourself that, and you will have no more questions about our policy in Chechnya," Putin said.

The Kernel · Post by **The Kernel** » 2004-09-07 07:07am

It's nice to see Putin taking a page from GWB's handbook: Use a national tragedy to bolster support for an unpopular conflict through association of an entire region with the actions of a handful of individuals.