Muslim enclave in your backyard; what do you do?

[Darth Wong]

Here's a hypothetical situation, and it's relevant to politics and current events so I put it here instead of SLAM, but I guess it's a tossup which forum it belongs in.

Anyway, you are the ruler of a small hypothetical city-state. Let's call it "Secularia." And you have a problem: tens of thousands of Muslims have been legally immigrating to Secularia. They have taken up residence in one of the suburbs and have been buying up so much property in one of the new subdivisions that they have created a virtual Muslim enclave, with more than 90% of the population being Muslim. All of this has occurred legally.

They have built mosques, they engage in very open and public observance of their religious rituals and ceremonies, they regularly conduct "student-led" Muslim prayer in majority groups at the local schools, girls who don't wear burquas are becoming social outcasts at the schools, and as a result of this in-your-face Islamic religious behaviour, most of the remaining 10% of non-Islamic families are starting to move out of this neighbourhood, so it will soon become virtually 100% Islamic.

As the ruler of Secularia, what do you do? On one hand, the Constitution of Secularia expressly prohibits religious discrimination. On the other hand, the creation of a growing Islamic self-segregated sub-community within your peaceful city-state gives you much cause for concern. Already they are clamouring for changes to the law, and because of their phenomenal rate of childbirth, your demographics experts are projecting that within a few decades, they will be a powerful political force in Secularia. Already they are agitating for changes in school curricula and local by-laws, and there have been isolated incidents of violence and defacement of Jewish synagogues just outside the Islamic enclave.

Once again, what do you do?

[Kuja]

How intelligent/pollitically aware is the population in Secularia? Is the average citizen a smart college grad who's had plenty of experience growing up in an average neighborhood? Or are most citizens beer-chugging high school dropouts who don't give two hoots about the laws so long as Wal Mart stays open? Is it a highly diversified country like the US or Canada, or is it more homogenous like, say, Japan or Korea?

[Darth Wong]

How intelligent/pollitically aware is the population in Secularia? Is the average citizen a smart college grad who's had plenty of experience growing up in an average neighborhood? Or are most citizens beer-chugging high school dropouts who don't give two hoots about the laws so long as Wal Mart stays open? Is it a highly diversified country like the US or Canada, or is it more homogenous like, say, Japan or Korea?

It's a lot like Canada and the USA, just compressed into a single city-state.

[aerius]

[The Shep] Send them on a magic carpet ride to meet Allah! [/The Shep]

[Darth Wong]

[The Shep] Send them on a magic carpet ride to meet Allah! [/The Shep]

You forgot to include the pictures of the B-52s.

[MKSheppard]

What kind of constitution does secularia have? Just wait until they push a
bit too far and then federalize the National Guard, etc to stomp them.

[Lord Revan]

How intelligent/pollitically aware is the population in Secularia? Is the average citizen a smart college grad who's had plenty of experience growing up in an average neighborhood? Or are most citizens beer-chugging high school dropouts who don't give two hoots about the laws so long as Wal Mart stays open? Is it a highly diversified country like the US or Canada, or is it more homogenous like, say, Japan or Korea?

also Secularia democratic or dictatorial. since a dictator can/will ignore laws he doesn't like.

[Darth Wong]

What kind of constitution does secularia have? Just wait until they push a
bit too far and then federalize the National Guard, etc to stomp them.

Similar Constitution to the USA.

[MKSheppard]

Similar Constitution to the USA.

Ooh goody, we get have some 1800s era fun!

"Hey, you want to play with us, you can't have five wives"

[Stravo]

Time to start investigating my current zoning laws and see if we can't 'tweak' them to break up this enclave. Perhaps start redistricting areas to place merchant and commercial zones in the center of these enclaves to break them up a bit.

We also need some community outreach and try to get some dialogue between these people and the government. People involved with their government will tend to want to keep it alive. Its also easy to hate the faceless beauracrat, not the guy next door or down the street who works in the city counsel.

Also start offering incentives to their children to do one of the other:

Go to school out of the city state. Perhaps a tax incentive to send their children out of state. This will create the following possibile results. College educated people tend to not be terrorists or fundies. They assimilate faster to US culture. Soon we will have these bastards listening to hip hop and calling Allah the holy spook. Secondly, out of state makes them usually want to remain out of state. They are exposed to new ideas and places and probably will not want to come back. Hence I have shuffled my problem off to another community.

Same thing within Seculria, start offering incentives for the kids to go to College (ixnay on the religious eductaion schools. Muslim madastras here in my city state need to be discouraged as best I can without going into full blown discrimination mode) The incentives should not be as strong as the out of state ones, but enough so that those kids that do remain will go to College, tehrefore hopefully creating another convert to Western culture.

The point in the end is that we cannot change the ones that are already here but we steal their children. Western cultire is insidious and outrageously powerful. We will convert them. We've broken up almost every other monolithic immgrant group before them, the muslims will be no different.

Of course most of this is long term.

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

What kind of constitution does secularia have? Just wait until they push a
bit too far and then federalize the National Guard, etc to stomp them.

What happens if they don't do anything illegal?

[Rogue 9]

I firmly rebuff any attempt to change the law to make it more Islamic or to resemble Shar'ia, referencing the Constitution of Secularia, which I presume prohibits such things. Those who deface synagogues/churches or who otherwise attempt to frighten/oppress/sabotage others for religious reasons will be deal with to the fullest extent of the law, as are those who attempt to turn public schools into religious institutions.

On the other side of the coin, they are legal residents and citizens, and I cannot simply remove them even if I cared to, nor can I interfere in their religion. They own their property, for better or for worse, and if they someday make up a sufficient percentage of the population to be a political force, then that's their right, for better or for worse. The instant someone does something overtly illegal in the name of/for the sake of/in opposition to the perceived enemies of Islam, they are prosecuted in open court and punished according to their crimes, but until that happens there is nothing I can do. If they turn to terrorism in large numbers and heavily arm themselves then it becomes a concern for the military once it becomes clear that the police cannot handle the situation, but honestly I don't see that as too terribly likely in this situation, though it is still possible.

[Kuja]

Hm. First off, definately crack down on the hate crime. Deport offenders who are not citizens and find other methods of punishing those who are. Let the people know that defacement of another creed's temple, harrasment of people who are of another race, gender, or religion, and other such hate crimes will not be tolerated.

Second, encourage groups or demonstraters who parade the right to free speech, freedom of religion, etc. Make it clear that you fully support these rights and will work unceasingly to defend them. Refuse to change rules in schools to appease the Muslims, and make sure they get the point that favoring their religion, or any other, is against the constitution of the country in which they are residing. If they object, they are out of bounds.

Curb immigration if you have to. Yes, it's cruel, but if you're taking in a sizable portion of people who want to turn your country into Iran, it can be justified.

Encourage bilingualism. You don't have to make it mandatory for everyone to speak a certain language, but reward people who do. Hopefully, this will encourage better communication between different people, as opposed to having one slab of population who speak Arabic and nothing else.

Encourage people to recieve a higher education, especially university, since those who do so will likely be broadened by the experience and not quite as likely to push for religious segregation.


I'm done rambling for now.

[MKSheppard]

What happens if they don't do anything illegal?

They're already vandalizing synagogues. So I can probably federalize the
guard and have the vandals shot on sight, that'll put an end to the vandalization.

[LadyTevar]

What happens if they don't do anything illegal?

They're already vandalizing synagogues. So I can probably federalize the
guard and have the vandals shot on sight, that'll put an end to the vandalization.

And what would you do when the mosques get vandalized as payback?

[Stravo]

What happens if they don't do anything illegal?

They're already vandalizing synagogues. So I can probably federalize the
guard and have the vandals shot on sight, that'll put an end to the vandalization.

And what would you do when the mosques get vandalized as payback?

Fuck that. What will he do when the muslims start rioting about their kids being shot on sight or even worse for Shep, peaceful nonviolent protests like sit ins on his government buildings.

[MKSheppard]

Fuck that. What will he do when the muslims start rioting about their kids being shot on sight

Oh yes, a bunch of people throwing
rocks and trying to burn down a synagogue are innocent.

[Kuja]

Fuck that. What will he do when the muslims start rioting about their kids being shot on sight or even worse for Shep, peaceful nonviolent protests like sit ins on his government buildings.

Massacre them, too. Come on Stravo, you know Shep well enough to see that coming.

[aerius]

Fuck that. What will he do when the muslims start rioting about their kids being shot on sight or even worse for Shep, peaceful nonviolent protests like sit ins on his government buildings.

Clearly, we must declare martial law and begin ethnic cleansing!

[MKSheppard]

And what would you do when the mosques get vandalized as payback?

That's why we protect all of them Don't give them any wriggle
room to claim discrimination! Discrimination!

[MKSheppard]

Clearly, we must declare martial law and begin ethnic cleansing!

Depends. Is Secularia majority Serb?

[Mr Bean]

1. Encourage bilingualism(Kujas idea) that acutal works in my favor, learning more than one language
2. Redraw the municpile lines to split up the ethic distrubition, even if you have to build a couple of new schools to do, try and split the "compound in half or even small chunks. And the best part is they can't complain as your building new schools meaning small teacher/student ratio's which is of course a good thing
So what if it happens to reduce each schools Muslim amount to around thirty percent or less?

Force incoperation down their throats all under the veil of increasing everyones quality of life

[Stravo]

Fuck that. What will he do when the muslims start rioting about their kids being shot on sight or even worse for Shep, peaceful nonviolent protests like sit ins on his government buildings.

Massacre them, too. Come on Stravo, you know Shep well enough to see that coming.

I know, I know, but it's like teasing my cats. You knwo what they're going to do but you just want to see them do it. Besides he might add some nice colorful pictures to his diatribe.

[Marksist]

Hmm.. To me this hypothetical situation sounds a lot like small town America. But, instead of the Muslims of Secularia, you have the Christians of small town America. Change all the occurances of Muslim to Christian in your situation, and that sounds similar to where I grew up.

[Kuja]

Combining Bean's and Stravo's ideas, maybe we could alternatively lower and raise property rates in different areas to keep immigrants jumping to different parts of the state (whatever gives them the most bang for their buck). This would be a perfectly acceptable way to keep them seperate without resorting to such drastic measures as bringing out the national guard. Obviously, this would be a very long-term plan.