Best Trek Captain in the Imperial Navy

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

Let's suppose <insert your favorite omnipotent: Q, Beyonder, etc> fucks up with time-space continuum, so various universes and their history are all altered.

The result is Kirk, Picard, Sisko & Janeway live in Star Wars universe instead of Trek.
- they all live in the same time period.
- they all become ISD Captain & accompanied by their respective crew. So Kirk has Spock, Bones, Scotty, etc; Picard has Riker, Data, etc; etc (yeah I know it's weird but let's assume that Vulcan, Klingons, Betazed etc live in Star Wars universe).
- they all are in their prime (Kirk is in the same age when he was in TOS, Picard when in TNG, etc).

Those four Captains has exactly the same trait like when they live in Trek universe. They're all also loyal to the Empire, just as they're loyal to the Federation in Trek universe.

So, who will make the most successful career in the Imperial Navy? Will he/she be Kirk, Picard, Sisko, or Janeway? Who will be the first who failed miserably?


Also, here's some twist to the main scenario:

1. If Kirk, Picard, Sisko and Janeway are part of Darth Vader's Death Squadron at TESB, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- make the most stupid mistake during Battle of Hoth
- contribute the most to Imperial victory and even alter the outcome of Battle of Hoth
- Succeed in capturing Millenium Falcon
- Being the first to get chocked by Darth Vader ("apology accepted, Captain <Kirk? Picard? Sisko? Janeway?>")

2. If they are all present at Battle of Endor, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- be the first to lose his/her Star Destroyer
- helping alter the outcome of the Battle

3. If after Endor, they all become part of Grand Admiral Thrawn's task force, each commanding their own ISD, who will eventually replace Palleon at Thrawn's side? Who will be the first to be executed?

4. Suppose Endor never happens, and Empire continues to its glory, who will make the most successfull, long-term career in the Imperial Navy?Who will eventually make it to the rank of Grand Admiral?
(IIRC in TOS Kirk eventually retired at age 35 with the rank of admiral, and start rock-climbing as hobby. If he lives in Star Wars universe, could he achieve the same? Or even be more successfull?)

[Gandalf]

I think Sisko, he's willing to do nasty things to get the job done.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

Also, here's some twist to the main scenario:

1. If Kirk, Picard, Sisko and Janeway are part of Darth Vader's Death Squadron[/i] at TESB, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- make the most stupid mistake during Battle of Hoth
- contribute the most to Imperial victory and even alter the outcome of Battle of Hoth
- Succeed in capturing Millenium Falcon
- Being the first to get chocked by Darth Vader ("apology accepted, Captain <Kirk? Picard? Sisko? Janeway?>")

2. If they are all present at Battle of Endor, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- be the first to lose his/her Star Destroyer
- helping alter the outcome of the Battle

Gah, the bolds are all fucked up. Could any mod fix it? It's suppose to be like this:

1. If Kirk, Picard, Sisko and Janeway are part of Darth Vader's Death Squadron at TESB, each commanding their own ISD, who will:

..... etc

[Gandalf]

Sorry, forgot to respond to the scenarios.

1. Sisko quite possibly has the best chance of capturing the Falcon. As for the battle victory, I would think Kirk, he knew enough to use artillery in Arena. I would think Janeway would be the first one to be choked, mainly becauseYesterday's Enterprise shows Picard make a decent commander in battle.

2. Kirk would be the first one to run into battle against the Rebellion, unfortunately this costs him his ISD. For the outcome, I would think either Janeway or Picard.

3. Maybe Sisko, he was Adjutant to Adm. Ross for some time.

4. Kirk, he's made Admiral before, and he had to be forced into retirement.

[Lord Revan]

Of the ones given, I think Sisko would make the most succesful career as he's closest to typical imperial captain, but of all trek captains I think Archer would make the best imperial captain.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

2. Kirk would be the first one to run into battle against the Rebellion, unfortunately this costs him his ISD. For the outcome, I would think either Janeway or Picard.

So Janeway or Picard will help altering the outcome of the battle. In favor of the Empire or the opposite?

[Gandalf]

2. Kirk would be the first one to run into battle against the Rebellion, unfortunately this costs him his ISD. For the outcome, I would think either Janeway or Picard.

So Janeway or Picard will help altering the outcome of the battle. In favor of the Empire or the opposite?

Gah!

I misread the post. I thought you meant help out survivors or something. And when the chips are down, I think Janeway will go all Patton on us.

[Praxis]

Kirk is the most bold and does what needs to be done- he once threatened to wipe out a planet if he wasn't released. He'd make the best Imperial, since Imperials can't be whining about the civilians.

Sisko would be next best, because when he's mad he'll get drastic (for example, poisoning a Maquis colony and forcing everyone to evacuate just to capture one man), and he has a good grasp on strategy (Dominion war), but at the end of the day he'll always sit down, read casualty reports, and nearly bore the viewer to death with his whining lectures about the horrors of war.

Picard would do okay- he has a good grasp on strategy and can resist interrogation, BUT for an imperial captain he's overly worried about civilians.

Janeway would suck. She's willing to sacrifice her ship to save a colony of little people she barely knows (Caretaker) or a planet she's never heard of (the episode with the Dreadnaught). Plus, the Empire gives a disadvantage to women- women have to be especially good. For example, Daala had higher scores at the academy than almost anyone else, yet was only given command of FOUR Star Destroyers after reaching the rank of Admiral, when she had beaten everyone except Thrawn. She was one of their best tactitions, but because she was a woman they gave her a couple Star Destroyers and assigned her to a backwater research station in the Maw. Janeway isn't especially good, and by the Empire's standards would never make it even if she wasn't a woman- being a woman, it'll be impossible for her to do good in the Empire. She'll be demoted on the first screwup, which will probably happen fast.

Something to notice: Sisko says he couldn't ask his crew to give up their lives for eight thousand or eight MILLION people. Picard is willing to sacrifice his ship to save this many Federation citizens. Janeway is willing to sacrifice her ship and crew to save this many complete strangers. While this is a nice thing to do, it's the LAST thing the Empire would ever want.

[Praxis]

Oh, as to the question about getting choked, and the Battle of Hoth:

Janeway sacrifices her Star Destroyer to save the poor little rebels down on the surface. Vader get annoyed and chokes her.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

Kirk is the most bold and does what needs to be done- he once threatened to wipe out a planet if he wasn't released. He'd make the best Imperial, since Imperials can't be whining about the civilians.

Kirk is a bold captain, and he will do any means necessary to accomplish his goal, but IIRC including breaking the rules if necessary. Would he survive Imperial policy?

A commander like Thrawn would value Kirk highly but will Kirk survive in Vader's Death Squadron (where everybody was overly cautious due to fear of Vader's "chocking policy")?

Correct me if I'm wrong, though.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

Gah! I hate the lack of edit buton.

I just wonder: will Vader tolerate Kirk? How about Admiral Ozzel, which was too conservative, overly cautious, and quite indecisive?

What if Kirk commits some kind of "insubordination" against Ozzel, because he believes that it's necessary to accomplish the goal (such as kicking Rebel's ass), and he's thinking that "the admiral is too slow". And then, the insubordination is discovered by Darth Vader? What will Vader do?

[Kazuaki Shimazaki]

Depends. If it was a failure, definite death. If he succeeds, well, Vader seems to like success, so there's a good chance.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

Sorry, forgot to respond to the scenarios.

1. Sisko quite possibly has the best chance of capturing the Falcon.

Why Sisko?

[Praxis]

Kirk is the most bold and does what needs to be done- he once threatened to wipe out a planet if he wasn't released. He'd make the best Imperial, since Imperials can't be whining about the civilians.

Kirk is a bold captain, and he will do any means necessary to accomplish his goal, but IIRC including breaking the rules if necessary. Would he survive Imperial policy?

If by breaking the rules he slaughters a LOT more Rebels, and it's not Vader's rules he's breaking, he should be fine. Generally, most of Vader's orders made sense (so Kirk would follow orders on Hoth unlike the captain that went too close), and even those that didn't weren't overly stupid (following the Falcon into the asteroid feild was risky, but Kirk ignored risk- he'd be a good corellian). Kirk generally only broke stupid rules.

[Jawawithagun]

Picard would do okay- he has a good grasp on strategy and can resist interrogation, BUT for an imperial captain he's overly worried about civilians.

Actually, that might just be his Federation upbringing. A good imperial military school would have prevented that and made him a pretty decent captain - though one overly concerned with regulations.

[Prozac the Robert]

Picard would be a great imperial captain, in that he would actually believe in the imperial ideals, and be good at imposing order, protecting imperial citizens against the evil rebels etc. On the other hand, he wouldn't be your commander of choice for poisoning rebel worlds or other dirty tricks style missions as he would be fairly likely to deffect if placd under too much pressure.

Also, he blends in naturally due to his accent .

Kirk would probably do well, but might fall foul of regulations. He might end up leading his troops down to hoth, which could be pretty bad for him. (Blasters can kill without ripping his shirt as such. More like disintegrating.)

Sisko is a good commander. Not sure if he is brilliant, but he ought to do ok.

Janeway has Tuvoc to fight her ship for her, so she might not die. But I wouldn't bet money on her doing better than your average imperial commander.

[Stofsk]

So, who will make the most successful career in the Imperial Navy? Will he/she be Kirk, Picard, Sisko, or Janeway? Who will be the first who failed miserably?

Kirk is a highly competent commander and more than a little reckless. He'll either sink or swim. He'd probably join the exploration service of the Navy, and be content with going from world to world making surveys and planetary expeditions. If in doing so he gets involved in skirmishes with rebels, mercenaries or pirates, then assuming he wins he might come to the attention of IMP High Command and be given an ISD to tool around with. But his nature would prevent him from going after the Admiralty.

Picard is highly cautious and respectable; in this he resembles Pellaeon. Picard would also consider the Empire very favourably and I doubt he'd have major gripes about certain policy actions (although Alderaan would probably cause him to have a moral crisis of faith, and if he's ever ordered to perform a BDZ... ). Actually I think Picard would join the exploration service of the Navy - assuming there is one, and why wouldn't there be? - and he'd be quite happy to command a small explorer cruiser than some big heavy warship that goes around and shows the flag. If he does get assigned to an ISD then my thoughts are he would shoot to subdue rather than destroy, and he'd even be more willing to open up a dialogue as behind the ISD's armour and shields you're virtually safe from anything the peons can throw up at you (unless they happen to have an ion cannon of course )

Sisko would get the job done, but not without making a log entry full of melodrama and self-critical monologue for an hour, explaining why he BDZed a particular world secretly in order to get them into a fight on their side of the war, then delete the file after he's vented. Also every decision he makes will go through a debate from the peanut gallery of his officers, until he raises his voice and says "This isn't a debate! Now shut up and shoot those bitches."

Janeway... well fuck, I can see her getting promoted to Admiral over some shithole sector that's out of the way and strategically insignificant. The dilbert principle.

Also, here's some twist to the main scenario:

1. If Kirk, Picard, Sisko and Janeway are part of Darth Vader's Death Squadron at TESB, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- make the most stupid mistake during Battle of Hoth

Hard to say. If Kirk's ISD is the one that get's shot out of commission by the ion cannon I can see him landing with a squad of Stormtroopers and co-ordinating on the ground a strike on the battery. Such an action would be highly reckless and more than a little foolhardy.

- contribute the most to Imperial victory and even alter the outcome of Battle of Hoth

What did the ISD captains do in that battle anyway?

- Succeed in capturing Millenium Falcon

I doubt it'll happen.

- Being the first to get chocked by Darth Vader ("apology accepted, Captain <Kirk? Picard? Sisko? Janeway?>")

Janeway. What the fuck.

3. If after Endor, they all become part of Grand Admiral Thrawn's task force, each commanding their own ISD, who will eventually replace Palleon at Thrawn's side? Who will be the first to be executed?

Picard would be another Pellaeon. Thrawn would take delight in educating Picard on being a strategic sonofabitch, and they can chat about Shakespeare in their off-duty chill out sessions.

Thrawn doesn't seem to execute officers or volunteers, but he does have a thing against conscripts it seems. Janeway probably wouldn't be executed for incompetence, but I can see her getting a shit assignment like commanding a Carrack or something. Sisko I can see being assigned as his adjutant and taken off the combat roster. Kirk... well I dunno.

4. Suppose Endor never happens, and Empire continues to its glory, who will make the most successfull, long-term career in the Imperial Navy?Who will eventually make it to the rank of Grand Admiral?
(IIRC in TOS Kirk eventually retired at age 35 with the rank of admiral, and start rock-climbing as hobby. If he lives in Star Wars universe, could he achieve the same? Or even be more successfull?)

Not everyone can hit GADM. Of the four, I'd put money on either Kirk or Picard, the former would probably hate it though. So would the latter as well. Sisko never progressed that far in the command chain for us to see what kind of ADM he would make, but with his conduct in the SoA duo I would not want to see him lead any fleet engagements. As for Janeway, I repeat what I said earlier: she'll make ADM of some shitstain sector, and will be out of the way so she can't screw up majorly.

[Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman]

1. If Kirk, Picard, Sisko and Janeway are part of Darth Vader's Death Squadron at TESB, each commanding their own ISD, who will:
- make the most stupid mistake during Battle of Hoth

Hard to say. If Kirk's ISD is the one that get's shot out of commission by the ion cannon I can see him landing with a squad of Stormtroopers and co-ordinating on the ground a strike on the battery. Such an action would be highly reckless and more than a little foolhardy.

[/quote]

Will he succeed?

- contribute the most to Imperial victory and even alter the outcome of Battle of Hoth

What did the ISD captains do in that battle anyway?

[/quote]

Sorry, not trying to play Captain Obvious. Of course every ISD captain contributes to the battle. What I mean is who will be the most successful? (ie scoring the most kill, preventing Rebel transport to escape, destroying the ion cannon *before* it hits anything, etc)

- Being the first to get chocked by Darth Vader ("apology accepted, Captain <Kirk? Picard? Sisko? Janeway?>")

Janeway. What the fuck.

HERE I'm playing Captain Obvious

3. If after Endor, they all become part of Grand Admiral Thrawn's task force, each commanding their own ISD, who will eventually replace Palleon at Thrawn's side? Who will be the first to be executed?

Picard would be another Pellaeon. Thrawn would take delight in educating Picard on being a strategic sonofabitch, and they can chat about Shakespeare in their off-duty chill out sessions.

Or Picard painting nudes to please Thrawn....

[Stofsk]

Will he succeed?

Hard to say. He succeeded in the ST universe, so maybe he'll do just as well in the SW universe. Hey, maybe he'll capture Princess Leia and go Klingon on her arse.

Picard would be another Pellaeon. Thrawn would take delight in educating Picard on being a strategic sonofabitch, and they can chat about Shakespeare in their off-duty chill out sessions.

Or Picard painting nudes to please Thrawn....

You're thinking of Data and his witless exploration of humanity.

[Bob the Gunslinger]

And when the chips are down, I think Janeway will go all Patton on us.

What, you mean killed by a runaway Ewok ox-cart?

[Crom]

Janeway would suck. She's willing to sacrifice her ship to save a colony of little people she barely knows (Caretaker) or a planet she's never heard of (the episode with the Dreadnaught). Plus, the Empire gives a disadvantage to women- women have to be especially good. For example, Daala had higher scores at the academy than almost anyone else, yet was only given command of FOUR Star Destroyers after reaching the rank of Admiral, when she had beaten everyone except Thrawn. She was one of their best tactitions, but because she was a woman they gave her a couple Star Destroyers and assigned her to a backwater research station in the Maw. Janeway isn't especially good, and by the Empire's standards would never make it even if she wasn't a woman- being a woman, it'll be impossible for her to do good in the Empire. She'll be demoted on the first screwup, which will probably happen fast.

Emphasis is mine. Now, .

Seriously, what the fuck are you talking about? I've never heard or seen any evidence that implied that Daala wasn't anything but a total incompetent. The SW Universe equivalent of Janeway.

[Rogue 9]

Janeway would suck. She's willing to sacrifice her ship to save a colony of little people she barely knows (Caretaker) or a planet she's never heard of (the episode with the Dreadnaught). Plus, the Empire gives a disadvantage to women- women have to be especially good. For example, Daala had higher scores at the academy than almost anyone else, yet was only given command of FOUR Star Destroyers after reaching the rank of Admiral, when she had beaten everyone except Thrawn. She was one of their best tactitions, but because she was a woman they gave her a couple Star Destroyers and assigned her to a backwater research station in the Maw. Janeway isn't especially good, and by the Empire's standards would never make it even if she wasn't a woman- being a woman, it'll be impossible for her to do good in the Empire. She'll be demoted on the first screwup, which will probably happen fast.

Emphasis is mine. Now, .

Seriously, what the fuck are you talking about? I've never heard or seen any evidence that implied that Daala wasn't anything but a total incompetent. The SW Universe equivalent of Janeway.

Let's do be fair. Her multiple failures have usually been the result of going up against Jedi and/or those with massive character shields. For only having four Star Destroyers against the entire New Republic, she did pretty good the first time around.

[Crom]

Let's do be fair. Her multiple failures have usually been the result of going up against Jedi and/or those with massive character shields. For only having four Star Destroyers against the entire New Republic, she did pretty good the first time around.

Pretty good? She had 3/4 of her fleet wiped out! Yes, she was up against character shields of incredible proportions, with Anderson writing who is surprised? But still, even then, I don't think her performance was anywhere near a tactician #2 only to Thrawn. That's just plain silly.

[StarshipTitanic]

Let's do be fair. Her multiple failures have usually been the result of going up against Jedi and/or those with massive character shields. For only having four Star Destroyers against the entire New Republic, she did pretty good the first time around.

I thought you said you were being fair? She should have sent out a damn shuttle after being out of communication with the Empire for a decade. It isn't hard to get out of the Maw, even the Death Star prototype managed. She also could have done far better with her fairly impressive fleet, like gather loyal Imperials by reminding them she's the highest-ranking (vomits) officer left in the Empire.

She can't even win when she has a whole SSD at her disposal, but boy is she punny with christening them!

[Lord of the Farce]

Plus, the Empire gives a disadvantage to women- women have to be especially good. For example,
-snip
Janeway isn't especially good, and by the Empire's standards would never make it even if she wasn't a woman- being a woman, it'll be impossible for her to do good in the Empire. She'll be demoted on the first screwup, which will probably happen fast.

Emphasis is mine. Now, .

Seriously, what the fuck are you talking about? I've never heard or seen any evidence that implied that Daala wasn't anything but a total incompetent. The SW Universe equivalent of Janeway.

Let's do be fair. Her multiple failures have usually been the result of going up against Jedi and/or those with massive character shields. For only having four Star Destroyers against the entire New Republic, she did pretty good the first time around.

Information posted by Publius in this thread sheds quite a different light to the gender bias we are told about by Daala.