Official Presidential Debate Reaction Thread

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:31pm

I'm waiting for Edwards to cream Cheney now.

Cheney is a great debater, but Edwards was a lawyer. It will be interesting.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-09-30 10:32pm

Hmmm, next debate, pages of rules. Last rule is; debate can't go longer than an hour. And must be held before Bush's sleepy time.....er........before late night.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-09-30 10:33pm

Princess Vera wrote:Kerry's ending speech sounded nicer than Bush's. He *sounded* nicer than Bush, for once.

Bush:
"The transformational power of liberty"
"the mighty mountain"
"the valley of peace"

I'm waiting for Edwards to cream Cheney now.

Don't count Cheney out. The man knows his shit, and he's very precise.

Gustav32Vasa · Post by **Gustav32Vasa** » 2004-09-30 10:33pm

So, who won?

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2004-09-30 10:33pm

Hah! Kerry hogged the stage longer, after Bush left! Classic upstaging, and he got away with it to loud applause!

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2004-09-30 10:35pm

Cheney is awhole different story. That will be a debate to watch.

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2004-09-30 10:35pm

Gustav32Vasa wrote:So, who won?

Kery won the debate, IMO. Will be interesting to see how the polls reflect now. Seems to me, most don't expect Bush to be a good speaker. Even so, many "undecideds" will go for Kerry because of this debate.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-09-30 10:35pm

Gustav32Vasa wrote:So, who won?

Kerry.

They both were going at it pretty well at first, perhaps not quite an hour, but Bush just fell apart in the last half hour. So, Kerry.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:37pm

Fred Barnes, Fox News:

impressed by Kerry
Kerry didn't make a good enough case that he had a plan for Iraq
Bush did a good job painting Kerry as a flip-flopper

Mort Kondracke, Fox News:

people got tired after about an hour - (my thoughts exactly)
Bush started out strong, Kerry was nervous
Kerry hit his stride midway through

Bill Kristol, Fox News:

Kerry did well, was forceful and articulate
"global test" business will hurt him

Ceci Connolly, Fox News:

Bush knows Kerry's positions very well
Bush ran out of material 2/3s of the way through
Kerry was great on North Korea

Darth Garden Gnome · Post by **Darth Garden Gnome** » 2004-09-30 10:38pm

I will say this: Kerry's arguement certainly isn't without its flaws, but Bush's complete and utter failure to jump on any number of the weaknessess in it hurt his imagine in this debate.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-09-30 10:38pm

Stravo wrote:Cheney is awhole different story. That will be a debate to watch.

Absolutely. This debate was pretty good, but the vice presidential debates will be damn good. Both Edwards and Cheney know their shit and know how to debate.

frigidmagi · Post by **frigidmagi** » 2004-09-30 10:38pm

Kerry won. This was the most aggressive I've ever seen him to. It's good... For a Start.

Next debate is time for the knives to come out and the blood to flow.

Macross · Post by **Macross** » 2004-09-30 10:40pm

Best Moment: When Kerry told Bush it was Al-Quada that attacked us on 9/11 not Iraq.

Overall it was pretty tame. Though I do think that Kerry should have responded more aggresively to Bush on the whole "changing positions" argument. Bush used it alot tonight, and Kerry didnt address it as aggresively as he should have.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:40pm

Another good point from Fox News - Kerry looked bigger - physically bigger - on the stage. Bush looked like a tiny little guy.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-09-30 10:41pm

Joe wrote:Another good point from Fox News - Kerry looked bigger - physically bigger - on the stage. Bush looked like a tiny little guy.

Kerry looks like one of those talking trees from the Wizard of Oz.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:41pm

Durandal wrote:
Stravo wrote:Cheney is awhole different story. That will be a debate to watch.
Absolutely. This debate was pretty good, but the vice presidential debates will be damn good. Both Edwards and Cheney know their shit and know how to debate.

Edwards is not as good on the attack, though. During his Presidential campaign the best he could do against the Bush administration was some stock crap about Halliburton.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2004-09-30 10:44pm

Joe wrote:Another good point from Fox News - Kerry looked bigger - physically bigger - on the stage. Bush looked like a tiny little guy.

Jack Kennedy effect, I'm telling you. Kerry will probably be declared winner almost solely on that he seemed more impressive up there, no matter what was actually said.

Uther · Post by **Uther** » 2004-09-30 10:45pm

As far as tit for tat, back and forth, general showmanship, Bush started stronger but Kerry more or less came back (and maybe came out on top) in the end.

As far as substance goes, well, I personally really like Kerry's nuclear proliferation and stem cell research stances, but those weren't really featured heavily. I really am not well informed enough to know who's right about North Korea (I'm deeply suspicious that Bush's position is basically "do nothing" while Kerry is at least advocating trying something new).

Ultimately, and unfortunately for Kerry, the two candidates' didn't really differ on how they were going to prosecute/win the conflict in Iraq. It was a lot of "stay the course" versus "it's a disaster!" Now, a large part of the reason I'm not voting for Bush is because I do think the Iraq situation is a disaster, but Kerry's inability to articulate a clear alternatve is not going to help him. The American people just aren't going to vote down Bush simply because Iraq is a mess (although I think they should).

Talon Karrde · Post by **Talon Karrde** » 2004-09-30 10:46pm

I agree, John Kerry won this debate. Bush stumbled a lot, and although many may try to spin it as his style of talking, it doesn't come off looking good. Kerry looked very composed and lived up to his hype as an excellent debator. Winner of the debate: Kerry. Will the polls move because of this? I'm not sure.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2004-09-30 10:46pm

Joe wrote:Edwards is not as good on the attack, though. During his Presidential campaign the best he could do against the Bush administration was some stock crap about Halliburton.

Well, that's different from a prepared debate. If you want someone who will thoroughly research every possible issue and articulate them well, you want a personal injury lawyer.

Gustav32Vasa · Post by **Gustav32Vasa** » 2004-09-30 10:48pm

I agree on that Kerry won but both sides missed many holes in the others dialog.

Gustav32Vasa · Post by **Gustav32Vasa** » 2004-09-30 10:48pm

I agree on that Kerry won but both sides missed many holes in the others dialog.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-09-30 10:48pm

I really am not well informed enough to know who's right about North Korea (I'm deeply suspicious that Bush's position is basically "do nothing" while Kerry is at least advocating trying something new).

I think that bit will actually hurt Kerry.

He's spent alot of time talking about how we need to confer with our allies, then when you switch to Korea, he wants to do Bilateral disscussions (just NK and US).

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:49pm

Tommy Franks on CNN: bin Laden is not in Afghanistan, as Kerry said he was.

If Bush had been a little more informed he could have slammed Kerry with this.

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2004-09-30 10:52pm

He's spent alot of time talking about how we need to confer with our allies, then when you switch to Korea, he wants to do Bilateral disscussions (just NK and US)

And he got away with it, too. Bush really dropped the ball on NK.