Some reflections on the election

[HyperionX]

According to the exit polls, Bush won heavily on "Moral Values." WTF? That didn't even show up in any of the polls til right up until the election. Poll credibility -1. Given Bush's slight less than honest buisness background I serious doubt Bush was the more moral of the two (perhaps the "Kerry is a war criminal thing worked?") Appeal to the heart apparently beats appeal to the mind.

Suffice it to say, this was a total party line/ideological divide vote, with very little middle ground if you look at the divide between all the other reasons. Bush merely turned out more people for him over Kerry, perhaps over there self interests. Next I would think we would need someone who can really charge up the base and forget about the middle if this election is any indication.

Also, the polls where in fact, on the whole, very accurate, despite any misses they made. Most were predicting a 1-3 point win by Bush and that's exactly what we got. So I guess we can't delude ourselves on the so called Incumbent's Rule, as apparently that's just bull. Next time the winner is the one who wins in the polls.

Last, I don't feel all the depressed. Disappointed yes but not down. Is it just me or do everyone here feels that Bush's ideology is still simply wrong? I'm certainly he'll screw just as badly in the next four years as he has in the last four years. I'm prepared to oppose him every step of the way for another four years, and I'm sure that someday, we'll win, a real and lasting win.

[Darth Wong]

When American right-wingers say "moral values", it has nothing to do with any system of ethics whatsoever. It's all about sex, and their terrible fear that someone out there might be doing it differently than them and enjoying it.

[HyperionX]

When American right-wingers say "moral values", it has nothing to do with any system of ethics whatsoever. It's all about sex, and their terrible fear that someone out there might be doing it differently than them and enjoying it.

Really? And I thought it was just an excuse in order to vote for Bush.

[Darth Wong]

When American right-wingers say "moral values", it has nothing to do with any system of ethics whatsoever. It's all about sex, and their terrible fear that someone out there might be doing it differently than them and enjoying it.

Really? And I thought it was just an excuse in order to vote for Bush.

Nope, it's always been that way. For more than a hundred years, secularists have joked (accurately) that for puritans, "morality" starts and stops in the bedroom.

[Jalinth]

Also, the polls where in fact, on the whole, very accurate, despite any misses they made. Most were predicting a 1-3 point win by Bush and that's exactly what we got. So I guess we can't delude ourselves on the so called Incumbent's Rule, as apparently that's just bull. Next time the winner is the one who wins in the polls.

Last, I don't feel all the depressed. Disappointed yes but not down. Is it just me or do everyone here feels that Bush's ideology is still simply wrong? I'm certainly he'll screw just as badly in the next four years as he has in the last four years. I'm prepared to oppose him every step of the way for another four years, and I'm sure that someday, we'll win, a real and lasting win.

The Incumbent rule apparently only applies to "undecided" - weren't too many of those based on what I've read. Also, remember that Nader and other 3rd party candidates are also "challengers" - the undecided apparently broke to them fairly heavily (as I said, they didn't # that many to begin with).

My biggest problem with Bush is competence. I don't loathe all his policies - some have valid points. But his execution is terrible. For an avowed "free market" president, his record is terrible - protectionism everywhere.

For a tax cutter, he's allowed the US tax code to worsen its ungodly complexity (he might like simple things, but sure as hell didn't for the tax code).

Then Iraq - he won the military campaign - fast, quick, painless. But he didn't ensure that a plan existed for "what next". He doesn't have to design it (he's president, not a diety) but should have directed the military and other agencies by saying "after victory, what do we?". Anything would have been better. A 10 year protectorship (the US runs the place for a decade, establishes the infrastructure for stable government - start with small elections (local), then gradually build-up to full national elections.) might have worked - just have a plan beyond "hope and pray".

For a person from a "small government" party - he's created what I'd have sworn was an oxymoron - big government Republican. The "big government" has different goals than a Democratic version, but still is just as obstrusive.

[Shaidar Haran]

When American right-wingers say "moral values", it has nothing to do with any system of ethics whatsoever. It's all about sex, and their terrible fear that someone out there might be doing it differently than them and enjoying it.

Really? And I thought it was just an excuse in order to vote for Bush.

Nope, it's always been that way. For more than a hundred years, secularists have joked (accurately) that for puritans, "morality" starts and stops in the bedroom.

Don't forget that there's more than just sex. There's also keeping one's self in the proper state of Christian ignorance. And of course shutting down the Evil Atheist Conspiracy (read: kill any scientific advance not in line with the harshest interpration of the Bible).