I was an episode of ST when it mentioned Garth of Izar was a Fleet Captain. I remember that Chris Pike was also a Fleet Captain.
Does anyone know if Fleet Captain was a unique rank or if it was just a senior grade of Captain, like a Line Captain in SW?
Fleet Captains in TOS
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Re: Fleet Captains in TOS
Ok, this is PURELY speculation, but it seems logical IMO.paladin wrote:I was an episode of ST when it mentioned Garth of Izar was a Fleet Captain. I remember that Chris Pike was also a Fleet Captain.
Does anyone know if Fleet Captain was a unique rank or if it was just a senior grade of Captain, like a Line Captain in SW?
A Fleet Captain is something of a inbetween rank from Line Officers and Flag Officers. A Fleet Captain probably has command of a single spaceship, but its a very nice, large, powerful spaceship. He is probably very well known and has some sway even with higher ranking Admirals. When it comes to times of war or crisis a Fleet Captain automatically has rank over standard Captains. A Fleet Captain is also high enough in rank that they can be given temporary command of groups of ships.
Now, IMO Picard is a Fleet Captain, or the equivilant in TNG even if the rank isn't listed. He has the Flagship of the Federation, has commanded fleets, and holds sway with Admirals. IMO you have to achieve Fleet Captain status just to command the Enterprise.
"If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If neither is on your side, pound on the table."
"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
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Re: Fleet Captains in TOS
I agree a fleet captain is in between line and flag officer.Alyeska wrote:[
Ok, this is PURELY speculation, but it seems logical IMO.
A Fleet Captain is something of a inbetween rank from Line Officers and Flag Officers. A Fleet Captain probably has command of a single spaceship, but its a very nice, large, powerful spaceship. He is probably very well known and has some sway even with higher ranking Admirals. When it comes to times of war or crisis a Fleet Captain automatically has rank over standard Captains. A Fleet Captain is also high enough in rank that they can be given temporary command of groups of ships.
Now, IMO Picard is a Fleet Captain, or the equivilant in TNG even if the rank isn't listed. He has the Flagship of the Federation, has commanded fleets, and holds sway with Admirals. IMO you have to achieve Fleet Captain status just to command the Enterprise.
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Commadore was the lowest offical flag rank.Tsyroc wrote:They also had people the rank of Commadore (Decker) which was above Captain.
Here is the TOS/Movie era rankings according to the ST:E
Ensign
Lieutenant J.G.
Lieutenant
Lt Commander
Commander
Captain
Fleet Captain
Commodore
Rear Admiral
Vice Admiral
Admiral
Fleet Admiral
What ST seems to have done is added an extra rank to Line officers and Flag officers and also changed the flag officers around a bit.
Here is how the modern US navy works.
Ensign
Lieutenant J.G.
Lieutenant
Lt Commander
Commander
Captain
Rear Admiral lower half (some times called Commodores)
Rear Admiral upper half
Vice Admiral
Admiral
"If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If neither is on your side, pound on the table."
"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
Commodores aren't used that much anymore, but it used to be that a Commodore was either in control of a small task force, or was the rank used by a Captain when visiting another ship (i.e. only 1 Captain allowed per ship).
Fleet Admiral was probably last used in WWII, just like the 5-star general rank. Essentially, it's meant to be a rank that only 1 individual at a time holds, in this case the military head of Starfleet.
Fleet Captain in some ways reminds me of the "Captain of the List" from David Weber's Honor Harrington series -- which also subdivided the Vice and Rear Admiral ranks into 2 groups (junior and senior). A Captain of the List meant that, barring a court-martial, discharge from the service, resigning your commission, or death/incapacitance, the officer in question was guaranteed to eventually make it onto the "list" -- in other words, become a flag officer of Commodore rank or higher.
For Starfleet (and this is just my VHO), Fleet Captain could be a way to recognize a starship captain whose achievements and ability would normally call for a rise in rank to flag status. However, for whatever reason (lack of a flag slot, officer refuses to accept the promotion, lack of qualified candidates to take over their command post, urgent need to keep the officer on the 'front lines', etc.), they can't promote him to flag rank, they don't really qualify for a medal, and a pay bonus just doesn't do them justice. So, they make them a Fleet Captain, which doesn't really give them that much more responsibility, but allows them in a pinch to command other starship captains.
My bet is that Kirk by the end of their 5-year mission was also a Fleet Captain, if he didn't earn it sometime during the mission. Picard probably is as well.
Fleet Admiral was probably last used in WWII, just like the 5-star general rank. Essentially, it's meant to be a rank that only 1 individual at a time holds, in this case the military head of Starfleet.
Fleet Captain in some ways reminds me of the "Captain of the List" from David Weber's Honor Harrington series -- which also subdivided the Vice and Rear Admiral ranks into 2 groups (junior and senior). A Captain of the List meant that, barring a court-martial, discharge from the service, resigning your commission, or death/incapacitance, the officer in question was guaranteed to eventually make it onto the "list" -- in other words, become a flag officer of Commodore rank or higher.
For Starfleet (and this is just my VHO), Fleet Captain could be a way to recognize a starship captain whose achievements and ability would normally call for a rise in rank to flag status. However, for whatever reason (lack of a flag slot, officer refuses to accept the promotion, lack of qualified candidates to take over their command post, urgent need to keep the officer on the 'front lines', etc.), they can't promote him to flag rank, they don't really qualify for a medal, and a pay bonus just doesn't do them justice. So, they make them a Fleet Captain, which doesn't really give them that much more responsibility, but allows them in a pinch to command other starship captains.
My bet is that Kirk by the end of their 5-year mission was also a Fleet Captain, if he didn't earn it sometime during the mission. Picard probably is as well.