Anime Fans Goku vs. Superman

[Guest]

who says I'm angry. I'm actually laughing at your stupidity. Your a waste of space just die. And that's not a joke.

[BlkbrryTheGreat]

Looking at this thread I can see that neither side is willing to admit to the other that the fighter they side with is the physically weaker one. Quite frankly I'm sick of reading threads like this one which seem to drag on forever. I'm going to settle this thread by thinking outside of the narrow conventions that all of you have set for the fight.
Goku would win against either Superman or Doomsday simply because he has instant transmission and they don't. Goku would simply have to teleport Superman/Doomsday to a Blackhole. Since Doomsday cannot fly all Goku would have to do is fling Doomsday towards the center of the blackhole. In a fight against Superman Goku would actually have to fly Superman to Superman's point of no return within the blackhole (which Superman would have simply due to the effect that blackholes have on space/time) After doing this Goku could then teleport out. Goku didn't kill these characters, but if they are inside a Blackhole they are as good as dead. Goku gets 2/2.................. end of story.

[Dalton]

Goku's teleportation is useless if he doesn't have someone familiar to lock on to.

[EDIT] FWIW: Goku is ridiculously overpowered (in fact, I'm sick of the entire DBZ "level up" crap that drags the series through 200+ episodes) so he wins in the whup-ass department. But no superhero, to me, will ever match the ideals embodied in Superman. Besides, he has a better theme song.

[Guest]

Goku's teleportation is useless if he doesn't have someone familiar to lock on to.

[EDIT] FWIW: Goku is ridiculously overpowered (in fact, I'm sick of the entire DBZ "level up" crap that drags the series through 200+ episodes) so he wins in the whup-ass department. But no superhero, to me, will ever match the ideals embodied in Superman. Besides, he has a better theme song.

I think you are right about Goku needing to be familiar with an area when doing Instantaneous Movement, especially when it comes to areas far away and not on the battlefield. But he wouldn't need IM for strategical reasons like Blackberry said, Goku is so uber powerful, that one Kamehameha is enough to kill both Superman and Doomsday.

[Guest]

Looking at this thread I can see that neither side is willing to admit to the other that the fighter they side with is the physically weaker one. Quite frankly I'm sick of reading threads like this one which seem to drag on forever. I'm going to settle this thread by thinking outside of the narrow conventions that all of you have set for the fight.
Goku would win against either Superman or Doomsday simply because he has instant transmission and they don't. Goku would simply have to teleport Superman/Doomsday to a Blackhole. Since Doomsday cannot fly all Goku would have to do is fling Doomsday towards the center of the blackhole. In a fight against Superman Goku would actually have to fly Superman to Superman's point of no return within the blackhole (which Superman would have simply due to the effect that blackholes have on space/time) After doing this Goku could then teleport out. Goku didn't kill these characters, but if they are inside a Blackhole they are as good as dead. Goku gets 2/2.................. end of story.

Yes, I agree, it is getting boring. I am being accused of "rabid fanboydom" because I am heavily biased. Yep I am, but I don't tell people to "die" because I get mad. Hooligan is upset because I called Superman a pussy. Do you find that funny? Anyway, there really is no point to argue this much anymore, since I feel that Goku is the winner. Unless you have other things you want to interject.

[Mr Bean]

Ok thats about it, these threads have degeraded from Debating into Wankism then back to Debating, Then back to Wanking, Back to Moderate Debate.... then Wanking agian

Let me say this very simple for both sides
Goku at any point in time during DBZ after his first fight with Vegetta can take apart Superman, be it via outlasting him, raw energy output or shear physical beat-down as example by that first fight with Vegetta where each where hiting the other so hard they where accerated over 100 MPH just by PUNCHING the other guy, Smashs through roughly all totaled eighty feet of solid rock, and got back up less than five seconds later virtualy unharmed,
Consider that one fokes and then add in they did similar acts a total of seven times....

I'm going to be calcuation the nessary Kenetic energy in terms of a Bus flung at thirty five Miles Pre Hour(Much less than Kal El's normal Bus Throwing speed, he hovers around 20-28) and will get back to you later on exact numbers

[Guest]

Ok thats about it, these threads have degeraded from Debating into Wankism then back to Debating, Then back to Wanking, Back to Moderate Debate.... then Wanking agian

Let me say this very simple for both sides
Goku at any point in time during DBZ after his first fight with Vegetta can take apart Superman, be it via outlasting him, raw energy output or shear physical beat-down as example by that first fight with Vegetta where each where hiting the other so hard they where accerated over 100 MPH just by PUNCHING the other guy, Smashs through roughly all totaled eighty feet of solid rock, and got back up less than five seconds later virtualy unharmed,
Consider that one fokes and then add in they did similar acts a total of seven times....

I'm going to be calcuation the nessary Kenetic energy in terms of a Bus flung at thirty five Miles Pre Hour(Much less than Kal El's normal Bus Throwing speed, he hovers around 20-28) and will get back to you later on exact numbers

Of course I agree on everything....but I sure hope I did not do most of the wanking! Don't forget how fast his kamehameha can go....he blasted Kooler into the freakin' sun in a matter of seconds.

[THEHOOLIGANJEDI]

I just want someone to refute what I said before about Mongul II, because that's canon. He stated that if Superman didn't hold back mentally, his powers would be limitless. This is plain Normal power level Superman.

PostCrisis Superman may be lightyears behind PreCrisis, but lately in Superman comics they've been powering Supers up (I hear that there may be another Revamp). I'll further Explain the Whole Kryptonite X thing since very few people know about it. it was

This form of Kryptonite was formed in Superman #82 when the Eradicator blocked a Kryptonite blast from hitting an unpowered Superman. Although, him sheilding Superman was ineffective, he transferred all of his powers to Supes and in the process the Kryptonite was altered and absorbed into Supes body. Now the effect of Kryptonite X are very odd, normally Supes power levels are at a certain level unless he is in close proximity to the Sun(or inside the Sun itself) whereas his powers would increase exponentially in a manner of minutes/seconds. Kryptonite X caused Superman to start uncontrollably absorbing solar rays at a phenominal rate (thus his powers increased so much that he was a danger to Earth). Superman noted that his powers were increasing when he was fighting Cauldron and shot his arm off with heat vision, and realized that his blast was more powerful than he anticipated (ref. Action Comics #695). Second was when he was facing Lobo and he punched him (from Metropolis) into orbit (he would have kept on going if he didn't hook on to a ship). His second huge feat was throwing that ship which had a mass of the Moon, Thousands of lightyears and catching up to it. (ref. Superman the Man of Steel #30)

Well that only a small bit of what happened to his powers when Kryptonite X was introduced into his system. He no longer needed to breath, and was close to PreCrisis power minus some of the really silly powers he had. Supes has also gone up to these levels when he is in Close proximity to a yellow Sun. Read the Trial Of Superman.

Again My point is That Superman is no pansy who has power limits. If you want proof I'll provide it. I really want to end the hostility so I'll take back what I said regarding insults.

OH BULLSHIT, Limitless? Not Fucking Likley! If Pre-Crisis Superman possess Planet Nuking Eye-beams then maybe you'd have a bit more points but so far the best Doomsday has ever been hit with is Kiloton to low megaton AT BEST.

What You think what I've written came from my ass?? Man You are Ignorant of Superman's Abilities and Precrisis Superman. He was rediculously powerful (almost omnipotent )at his height. He could Juggle Planets, Travel through time at will, move at almost limitless speed to name a few. The Superman Movie have some examples of some of those powers
http://www.fanzing.com/mag/fanzing43/feature2.shtml
http://theages.superman.ws/Encyclopaedia/powers.php
A lot of his powers are way way rediculous. That's why I didn't bring him up because it would childish (plus PreC. would win with ease). He was only a reference to what Post Crisis Supes could come close to, powers increased.

As for the Mongul II quote, it's quite true Read Our worlds at War Storyline, Or read a list of comics that I'll post later on regarding Superman's various increases in power.

Although PreCrisis is a non issue I suggest that those who know nothing about how powerful he is read this. Mind the insults. I'd Look at the whole post. And who ever said that Doomsday can't fly he can move extremely fast(he either matches or exceed both Superman and the Flash) and has an incredible leaping ability. Not too sure what a Black hole could do.

[Yogi]

Guys, YOU'RE MISING THE POINT!!
When calculating DBZ, the impressive points are NOT A PL 8,000 Goku being slammed through rock. That's WEAK.

The TRULY IMPRESSIVE feats is when Muten Roshi with PL 179 VAPORISED THE MOON!!! Getting slammed through several miles of rock is nothing to removing the moon, the cnontiuing to fight in the tournament like nothing happened.

Tell me, can Superman vaporise the moon in one blast? Muten Roshi can. Muten Roshi has PL 179. Form II Freiza has PL 1,000,000.

Superman is toast in so many ways it's not funny.

[Guest]

I just want someone to refute what I said before about Mongul II, because that's canon. He stated that if Superman didn't hold back mentally, his powers would be limitless. This is plain Normal power level Superman.

Maybe, maybe not, but I am really not impressed. Many people say many different things. In otherwords, incoherent ramblings of a character who has no clue. We certainly never seen Superman have limitless powers. Where were they when he was killed by Doomsday the first time around? Where are they now? Superman is only uber powerful by DC Comics™ standards and that is not saying much at all and Mogul's statement comes off as a cop-out excuse on why Superman is a pansy. "Well, if he really wanna too, he woulda!" Whatever.

PostCrisis Superman may be lightyears behind PreCrisis, but lately in Superman comics they've been powering Supers up (I hear that there may be another Revamp). I'll further Explain the Whole Kryptonite X thing since very few people know about it. it was

This form of Kryptonite was formed in Superman #82 when the Eradicator blocked a Kryptonite blast from hitting an unpowered Superman. Although, him sheilding Superman was ineffective, he transferred all of his powers to Supes and in the process the Kryptonite was altered and absorbed into Supes body. Now the effect of Kryptonite X are very odd, normally Supes power levels are at a certain level unless he is in close proximity to the Sun(or inside the Sun itself) whereas his powers would increase exponentially in a manner of minutes/seconds. Kryptonite X caused Superman to start uncontrollably absorbing solar rays at a phenominal rate (thus his powers increased so much that he was a danger to Earth). Superman noted that his powers were increasing when he was fighting Cauldron and shot his arm off with heat vision, and realized that his blast was more powerful than he anticipated (ref. Action Comics #695). Second was when he was facing Lobo and he punched him (from Metropolis) into orbit (he would have kept on going if he didn't hook on to a ship). His second huge feat was throwing that ship which had a mass of the Moon, Thousands of lightyears and catching up to it. (ref. Superman the Man of Steel #30)

Well that only a small bit of what happened to his powers when Kryptonite X was introduced into his system. He no longer needed to breath, and was close to PreCrisis power minus some of the really silly powers he had. Supes has also gone up to these levels when he is in Close proximity to a yellow Sun. Read the Trial Of Superman.

All moot points really. You want me to be impressed with arm hacking heat vision, and throwing around planets? Ok, throwing planets is kinda cool, but in comparison to DBZ levels, it is laughable. Majin Buu destroyed the North, South, and West poritions of the universe absorbing their respected Kiao's and even absorbed the Dia Kiaoshin (God of the Universe). Goku whooped Majin Buu's rear albeit with a little help from the good people of the universe to form the Genki Dama....and this is only at the end of the Buu saga. It is common fact that high level DBZ characters can blow up moons, planets, and galaxies. Again, Superman moving one is only powerful in the DC comic standards and falls far below anything Goku can do.

Again My point is That Superman is no pansy who has power limits. If you want proof I'll provide it. I really want to end the hostility so I'll take back what I said regarding insults.

Ahh but he does have limits, whether they are imposed by himself, or simply because he is weak. You offer an off the wall quote that says "Well if he coulda, he woulda!" Doesn't matter, Goku doesn't either nor do any other Sayin-jins.

OH BULLSHIT, Limitless? Not Fucking Likley! If Pre-Crisis Superman possess Planet Nuking Eye-beams then maybe you'd have a bit more points but so far the best Doomsday has ever been hit with is Kiloton to low megaton AT BEST.

What You think what I've written came from my ass?? Man You are Ignorant of Superman's Abilities and Precrisis Superman. He was rediculously powerful (almost omnipotent )at his height. He could Juggle Planets, Travel through time at will, move at almost limitless speed to name a few. The Superman Movie have some examples of some of those powers
http://www.fanzing.com/mag/fanzing43/feature2.shtml
http://theages.superman.ws/Encyclopaedia/powers.php
A lot of his powers are way way rediculous. That's why I didn't bring him up because it would childish (plus PreC. would win with ease). He was only a reference to what Post Crisis Supes could come close to, powers increased.

As for the Mongul II quote, it's quite true Read Our worlds at War Storyline, Or read a list of comics that I'll post later on regarding Superman's various increases in power.

Mongul II, Mongul II. So what? "Dear Superman, your own mind limits your abilities." This was used to explain the contradictions of his "I can hold my breath in space yes sir I can!" power. One story he would need a mask to breathe, then he would have to hold his breathe for a while, or he didn't need one at all. But here you are trying to pass this off as "Oh my god, superman is like Uber strong and can do anything. He can move planets and and and he can and like he can do ANYTHING because Mongul II says so!

But he can't destroy galaxies, too bad.

In the end, Superman may *seem* like he can do impressive feats, which they probably are in the DC universe, but they pale in comparison to Goku and his extraordinary uber powers. The Genki Dama, Ryuken Dragon Fist, Instaneous Movement, Zanzuken,Kienzan, Kamehameha all have outclassed fighers who far surpass anything in the DC universe; Freezer, Cooler, Cell, all can easily destory planets at their respective LOW power levels. Buu can and has destroyed galaxies, entire systems, and absorbed gods. On top of this, the fused power of Sheron and the Ultimate Dragon Balls just adds insult to injury.


Point Goku.