NMD test goes balls-up

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NMD test goes balls-up

Post by kheegster »

Bush's pet project looks like it's going down the drain....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/4097267.stm
Missile defence shield test fails

The first test in almost two years of the planned multi-billion dollar US anti-missile shield has failed.

The Pentagon blamed the test failure on an "unknown anomaly"
The first test in almost two years of the planned multi-billion dollar US anti-missile shield has failed.

The Pentagon said an interceptor missile did not take off and was automatically shut down on its launch pad in the central Pacific.

A target missile carrying a mock warhead had been fired 16 minutes earlier from Kodiak Island in Alaska.

The Pentagon is spending $10bn a year on the missile system, which was meant to be in operation by the end of 2004.

The Missile Defence Agency said an "unknown anomaly" was to blame for the system shutting down.


A spokesman said officials would now study data from the launch site at Kwajalein Atoll, in the Marshall Islands, to establish what went wrong.

In earlier tests, target missiles have been successfully intercepted in five out of eight attempts.

Wednesday's trial had been put off four times because of bad weather at launch sites and, on Sunday, because a radio transmitter failed.

A Pentagon spokesman told Reuters news agency the test had not been tied to the question of when the national missile defence system would be declared operational.

Philip Coyle, chief weapons tester under former US President Ronald Reagan, told Reuters: "This is a serious setback for a programme that had not attempted a flight intercept test for two years."

The goal, announced by US President George W Bush in 2002, was to have a basic ground-based shield in place by the end of this year.

The last test, in December 2002, failed when the interceptor missile did not separate from its booster rocket.

The programme has been nicknamed "son of Star Wars" after the original Strategic Defence Initiative - or "Star Wars" - outlined by President Reagan in the 1980s.
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Re: NMD test goes balls-up

Post by Stormbringer »

kheegan wrote:Bush's pet project looks like it's going down the drain....
Not hardly. There is a reason it's still being worked on. You do know that right? It's called development; you know the part where they get the thing working.

I think the US has other priorities at this point and I would like to see it cutback seriously. The 10 billion could be better spent properly equipping and paying for our troops in Iraq. So I'm not at all sure that we should be worrying about this right now. At best it's a second tier concern and the primary being very much more so.
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Post by Ma Deuce »

Bush's pet project looks like it's going down the drain....
I remind you that the NMD program was started by Clinton...
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Post by Stravo »

The programme has been nicknamed "son of Star Wars" after the original Strategic Defence Initiative - or "Star Wars" - outlined by President Reagan in the 1980s.
And much like the prequels it sucks too.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

So long as the crises this thing is meant to protect the US from hold off a few decades before the system is finally complete, you'll be okay (though that recernt MIT report on it being covered up as a total fuck-up doesn't lend credence to the system being worthy of a single dime). In the meantime, the gov't has hired more Mack trucks to cart taxpayers' money off to throw at the problem.
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Re: NMD test goes balls-up

Post by kheegster »

Stormbringer wrote:
Not hardly. There is a reason it's still being worked on. You do know that right? It's called development; you know the part where they get the thing working.
AFAIK I know, there hasn't been a succesful realistic test of NMD? Just because something is theoretically possible doesn't mean it's realistic or practical to work on it.
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Post by Patrick Degan »

Oops. 8)
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Post by Ma Deuce »

AFAIK I know, there hasn't been a succesful realistic test of NMD? Just because something is theoretically possible doesn't mean it's realistic or practical to work on it.
Of course, development would be alot simpler if there were no political considerations preventing the US from putting nuclear warheads on the interceptors, like Spartan and Sprint ABMs the US deployed breifly in the '70s, or the Golash ABMs that still protect Moscow (though IIRC the Russians are planning to convert the Golash to a "hard kill" missile).
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Post by The Dark »

Ma Deuce wrote:
AFAIK I know, there hasn't been a succesful realistic test of NMD? Just because something is theoretically possible doesn't mean it's realistic or practical to work on it.
Of course, development would be alot simpler if there were no political considerations preventing the US from putting nuclear warheads on the interceptors, like Spartan and Sprint ABMs the US deployed breifly in the '70s, or the Golash ABMs that still protect Moscow (though IIRC the Russians are planning to convert the Golash to a "hard kill" missile).
Such as the fact that it would EMP the very targets you're trying to defend? (Which is the most likely result of Sprint/Spartan/Golash use), thus making them one-shot systems useless against a salvo? Or the fact that ABM systems are ridiculously easy to spoof with fake warheads, requiring the expenditure of a dozen or more missiles to nail a single enemy warhead, meaning you have the radiation from thirteen nukes rather than one? And of course the fact that those warheads deteriorate at a slightly unpredictable rate (half-life is only an average, not an absolute) means you can never be totally sure your nuclear counter-missile actually has a nuclear warhead rather than a dud...yeah, I can't see why we don't use nuclear countermissiles either :wink: .
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Post by SirNitram »

Oh yes! What a brilliant waste of money this NMD is. None of it seems to work, it's sucking up untold billions that, you know, could be used to actually armour the vehicles our boys are in, and in the end, who the fuck are we defending against?

But hey. It's vital to the 'FEAR! YOU MUST FEAR!' strategy. So I guess we're stuck with it.
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Post by Ma Deuce »

The Dark wrote:*snip*
Hey, I never said it'd be preferable to use nuclear-armed ABMs, just that it'd make development simpler :wink:.
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Post by Illuminatus Primus »

Ma Deuce wrote:
AFAIK I know, there hasn't been a succesful realistic test of NMD? Just because something is theoretically possible doesn't mean it's realistic or practical to work on it.
Of course, development would be alot simpler if there were no political considerations preventing the US from putting nuclear warheads on the interceptors, like Spartan and Sprint ABMs the US deployed breifly in the '70s, or the Golash ABMs that still protect Moscow (though IIRC the Russians are planning to convert the Golash to a "hard kill" missile).
Its retarded. When you're talking about millions dying in a city nuking, all the bets are off, and I don't see why we shouldn't protect against those warheads with nuclear weapons. Especially when the use of nukes is obviously initiated by the enemy.
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Post by Patrick Degan »

The Dark wrote:
Ma Deuce wrote:
AFAIK I know, there hasn't been a succesful realistic test of NMD? Just because something is theoretically possible doesn't mean it's realistic or practical to work on it.
Of course, development would be alot simpler if there were no political considerations preventing the US from putting nuclear warheads on the interceptors, like Spartan and Sprint ABMs the US deployed breifly in the '70s, or the Golash ABMs that still protect Moscow (though IIRC the Russians are planning to convert the Golash to a "hard kill" missile).
Such as the fact that it would EMP the very targets you're trying to defend? (Which is the most likely result of Sprint/Spartan/Golash use), thus making them one-shot systems useless against a salvo? Or the fact that ABM systems are ridiculously easy to spoof with fake warheads, requiring the expenditure of a dozen or more missiles to nail a single enemy warhead, meaning you have the radiation from thirteen nukes rather than one? And of course the fact that those warheads deteriorate at a slightly unpredictable rate (half-life is only an average, not an absolute) means you can never be totally sure your nuclear counter-missile actually has a nuclear warhead rather than a dud...yeah, I can't see why we don't use nuclear countermissiles either :wink: .
In point of fact, this very issue was confronted in 1975 by both Congress and the DoD:
On October 2, 1975 -- one day after the site became operational -- the House voted to inactivate Safeguard. The House decision was based on the argument that the restriction to a single ABM site combined with the recent Soviet development of MIRVs meant the system could not handle the threat. Soviet missiles with multiple warheads would overwhelm the system. This was not the only problem, however. The radars that tracked incoming missiles were extremely vulnerable: they would black out when a nuclear warhead -- including one on a US interceptor missile -- detonated. Once the radars were destroyed, the system would be electronically blind and therefore useless. Safeguard's ability to achieve even its main objective of protecting the North Dakota ICBM site was also limited by the fact that its 100 interceptor missiles were not enough to counter a determined attack.

In fact, the DOD had already reached the same conclusion and had decided in 1974 to shut down the Grand Forks site on July 1, 1976. Although the Senate initially rejected the House position, and approved Safeguard funding, once the DOD's decision was brought to their attention, they agreed to terminate the program. The bill the Senate passed in November 1975 allowed operation and testing of the site's perimeter acquisition radar but closed down the remainder of Safeguard.
Even assuming the radars would be hardened against EMP damage to the hardware, the problem of heavy ionisation of the atmosphere which would scramble outgoing radar signals remains.
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Post by Ma Deuce »

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Its retarded. When you're talking about millions dying in a city nuking, all the bets are off, and I don't see why we shouldn't protect against those warheads with nuclear weapons. Especially when the use of nukes is obviously initiated by the enemy.
While we're on the subject of collateral EMP from nuclear ABMs, there's also the scenario of someone deliberatly detonating one or more low megaton-range ICBMs exoatmostpherically over the continental US for the express purpose of creating EMP disruptions: look at the effects of the "Fishbowl" test in 1962, in which a 1.4MT warhead was detonated at an altitude of 250 miles over the Pacific, causing EMP effects (including power blackouts) up to 800 miles from the test: while the damage caused by the EMP was relativly minor and quickly recovered from, that was before the days of the widsporead use of miniturized, solid-state circuits, so if the test was duplicated today, or worse, if the same warhead was detonated at the same altitude over the American west coast, the effects would be devastating to say the least, and the only electronics in the area of effect that would escape intact are the ones specifically hardened against EMP.

OTOH, The effects of even multiple single-digit kiloton range ABMs going off over the Pacific would pale in comparison to the aforementioned scenario. Of course, if it's possible to develop a hard-kill system that can reliably shoot down small numbers of incloming ICBMs, I'd say it would be preferable, but if not, then I'd have no objection to nuclear ABMs...
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

The original Star Wars project would've overcome some of these shortcomings. Unlike the new NMD where a handful of kinetic kill missiles will be used with national EW radar systems, the original had an extremely complex and more widespread system.

For instance, the lasers in orbit would've been effective enough to replace this system unless enemy vessels or aircraft got close enough to launch ASATs. I believe MIRACL was powerful enough, but too big to implement. You'd avoid the EMP problem if you had the radars and lasers in orbit around the US and plinked the warheads flying over before they detonated. At the very least, you'd still have a system ready if a few nukes slipped through and caused an EMP in the stratosphere taking out land based systems. The main problem, aside from the tinkering with lasers, railguns, radars on land, sea and air platforms and so on was the programming of the network which, from what I recall, would've taken a team of scientists a few thousand years to complete.

Course, that is a lesser problem today, but a problem all the same. I'd add cost as a factor against it, but given the cash they threw at the original project, I doubt the DoD gives a shit about fiscal concerns.
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Post by MKSheppard »

Patrick Degan wrote:Even assuming the radars would be hardened against EMP damage to the hardware, the problem of heavy ionisation of the atmosphere which would scramble outgoing radar signals remains.
*snorts*

Page 226 of Shield of Faith
Another breakthrough occurred outside the ABM program. An
attacker will try to beat the defense by going for its soft spot. In
July of 1940, the Luftwaffe very nearly knocked out British air
defense with repeated raids on the radars themselves, and failed
only because of a lack of persistence. Under the conditions of nuclear
attack, traditional radars were pathetically vulnerable. Two pounds
per square inch of blast could knock most of them over. The elab-
borate spiderweb of the Zeus Acquisition Radar would not last out
the first barrage. The problem was addressed and partially solved,
at least on paper, by phased-array radar.

From the beginning of radar, the transmitting and receiving de-
vice, the antenna, had taken the form of a large mesh screen, either
rectangular or the familiar round scoop. The array of wires had to
be light in order to be elevated and rotated in the direction of the
target; because it was light, it was inherently soft. A better idea
evolved slowly in incremental steps by Bell Labs, Bendix, Sylvania,
and others: aim the radar electrically rather than mechanically. The
array of receiving wires was fixed, but the screen could be made to
scan by adjustment of the current through the array of wire in
phases—thus, "phased-array radar."

To be sure, the radar could not scan all points of the compass:
the limit was less than 180 degrees; to get all-around coverage, four
such arrays had to be blocked together. It was a complex and ex-
pensive system, and initially its performance was not up to that of
the wonderfully sensitive ZAR, but phased array had two advan-
tages which drove all the other drawbacks into insignificance: Phased-
array radar was much harder; it could survive a nuclear blast an
order of magnitude higher than the traditional design. And phased-
array could change its aim at almost the speed of light, as fast as
the electricity coursed through the computers and the radar itself.
Phased-array was the answer to the traffic-handling problem of hit-
ting hundreds of bullets with hundreds of bullets. Bell Labs was
slow to recognize the desirability of the innovation, but was forced
into it.
page 211 of Shield of Faith
A rococo elaboration was the "ladder-down" attack. The offense would explode a warhead
just inside the atmosphere to blind the defender's radar; then a second warhead would drop
through the blob of the first and be fired; then subsequent warheads would repeat the
sequence, climbing down to the target, which would be nailed by the final blast. Well, no
attacker would believe that warheads could be located and exploded with such split-second
precision at intercontinental range. Even if he could, high virtual attrition had been imposed
on him. And defensive tactics were easy: Early-warning radars would identify the attack,
and exoatmospheric interceptors would break it up in space. A ladder-down attack in the
atmosphere would be foiled by firing an interceptor with proximity fuse through a blob to kill
the successor warhead. Although taken seriously by some consultant scientists circa 1960,
ladder-down tactics were merely a curiosity of the paper wars.
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Post by Kreshna Aryaguna Nurzaman »

Probably they should re-consider Star Wars (Ronnie's, not Lucas')
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Post by MKSheppard »

Page 319 of Shield of Faith
An ARPA/IDA study in 1966 concluded that blackout would seriously degrade VHF radar performance, so UHF was recommended.
So the solution to blackout is to go to a different band.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

You could also try millimetric if you had a fast scan rate and numerous detectors around the area most likely to be launched at. Far harder to jam and better at aiming and guiding munitions, of course, it has the problem of being less able to cover an area like longer wavelengths, but phased-arrays solve that problem.

But to completely avoid this, put the systems in space as well and attached to a rather large laser with IR, UV or whatever as backup detection systems. The enemy would then have to take out those sats first, likely giving time to form a counterattack or use the land based system.
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Post by Patrick Degan »

MKSheppard wrote:
Patrick Degan wrote:Even assuming the radars would be hardened against EMP damage to the hardware, the problem of heavy ionisation of the atmosphere which would scramble outgoing radar signals remains.
*snorts*

Page 226 of Shield of Faith
Another breakthrough occurred outside the ABM program. An
attacker will try to beat the defense by going for its soft spot. In
July of 1940, the Luftwaffe very nearly knocked out British air
defense with repeated raids on the radars themselves, and failed
only because of a lack of persistence. Under the conditions of nuclear
attack, traditional radars were pathetically vulnerable. Two pounds
per square inch of blast could knock most of them over. The elab-
borate spiderweb of the Zeus Acquisition Radar would not last out
the first barrage. The problem was addressed and partially solved,
at least on paper, by phased-array radar.

From the beginning of radar, the transmitting and receiving de-
vice, the antenna, had taken the form of a large mesh screen, either
rectangular or the familiar round scoop. The array of wires had to
be light in order to be elevated and rotated in the direction of the
target; because it was light, it was inherently soft. A better idea
evolved slowly in incremental steps by Bell Labs, Bendix, Sylvania,
and others: aim the radar electrically rather than mechanically. The
array of receiving wires was fixed, but the screen could be made to
scan by adjustment of the current through the array of wire in
phases—thus, "phased-array radar."

To be sure, the radar could not scan all points of the compass:
the limit was less than 180 degrees; to get all-around coverage, four
such arrays had to be blocked together. It was a complex and ex-
pensive system, and initially its performance was not up to that of
the wonderfully sensitive ZAR, but phased array had two advan-
tages which drove all the other drawbacks into insignificance: Phased-
array radar was much harder; it could survive a nuclear blast an
order of magnitude higher than the traditional design. And phased-
array could change its aim at almost the speed of light, as fast as
the electricity coursed through the computers and the radar itself.
Phased-array was the answer to the traffic-handling problem of hit-
ting hundreds of bullets with hundreds of bullets. Bell Labs was
slow to recognize the desirability of the innovation, but was forced
into it.
page 211 of Shield of Faith
A rococo elaboration was the "ladder-down" attack. The offense would explode a warhead just inside the atmosphere to blind the defender's radar; then a second warhead would drop through the blob of the first and be fired; then subsequent warheads would repeat the sequence, climbing down to the target, which would be nailed by the final blast. Well, no attacker would believe that warheads could be located and exploded with such split-second precision at intercontinental range. Even if he could, high virtual attrition had been imposed on him. And defensive tactics were easy: Early-warning radars would identify the attack, and exoatmospheric interceptors would break it up in space. A ladder-down attack in the atmosphere would be foiled by firing an interceptor with proximity fuse through a blob to kill the successor warhead. Although taken seriously by some consultant scientists circa 1960, ladder-down tactics were merely a curiosity of the paper wars.
I see you still scoff at the laws of physics while endlessly whipping your skippy over the ABM sales-pitch. How very predictable.

Your first quote has nothing whatsoever to do with the issue of radar blinding through atmospheric ionisation and your second quote a) deals with assumptions pre-MIRV and as is pointed out in the very passage b) based on assumptions which were purely speculative on paper. The observed effects of the Starfish test in 1963 made them unviable. Yet more of the many Red Herrings you've dragged forth in every discussion regarding NMD and its white-elephant predecessors.

Oh, and BTW, Bell Labs were among the first people who tried to pull out of the ABM programme in the 1970s precisely because of their misgivings over the technical problems of the system. If you'll note:
Kissinger and Nixon received more bad news about the ABM in April. These memoranda, prepared by NSC staffer Laurence Lynn, show his surprise when top officials from AT&T's Bell Laboratories, the ABM's chief contractor, revealed their deep misgivings about the ABM program. Lynn knew that Bell was uncomfortable with public criticisms of its role in defense contracting, but he did not expect that its scientists believed that ABM was technically unworkable. Lynn claimed that the specific criticisms were unremarkable but the very fact that Bell Labs was making them had "potential for disaster." Significantly, one of Bell's criticisms paralleled one that is made of today's NMD program and which the Verification Panel had also noted: that it would not be able to differentiate RVs from balloon decoys and other devices designed to confuse the defense.
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Take particular note of the quote at the top of page four of the memorandum: "They (Bell Labs engineers) said the Minuteman defense could be overwhelmed or defeated by blacking out the radars".

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So you can keep quoting from Shield Of Faith or High Frontier or whatever as much as your little heart desires and I'll just keep laughing in your face. Because the engineers and physicists of the period all say you don't know what the fuck you're talking about.
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People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
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Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
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Post by Patrick Degan »

MKSheppard wrote:Page 319 of Shield of Faith
An ARPA/IDA study in 1966 concluded that blackout would seriously degrade VHF radar performance, so UHF was recommended.
So the solution to blackout is to go to a different band.
Oh really:
Radar Blackout was a serious problem for Safeguard, particularly for its PAR radars, whose UHF frequencies were strongly absorbed by ambient ionization, fireballs from intercepts or salvage fusing, and remote regions. Ionization due to auroral effects is strong enough to cause radar degradation in certain seasons. Fireballs are generally ionization regions centered on the explosion. Remote regions involve beta rays (electrons) and fission fragments from explosions at higher altitudes that deposit at
50–60 km, where they produce enough ionization and absorption to affect radar and communication systems. Although they can deposit at lower altitudes than the explosions that produce them, they have similar system impacts, so Appendix D treats them together. Low-altitude nuclear bursts in the Sprint engagement altitude and yield region produce fireballs a few
kilometers in diameter that quickly achieve pressure balance, radiate to temperatures of a fraction of an electron volt. Their initial absorption at radar wavelengths is very strong and is maintained for several minutes. They are essentially black to UHF and lower frequency radars throughout structured attacks lasting a few minutes. However, such fireballs need not completely block radar operation. The fireball from a MT burst at sea level is about 1 km across, as is that from a Sprint-sized KT range explosion at 45 km, which would exclude a solid angle of about (1 km/45 km)^2 = 0.001 sr. Unless there were dozens of bursts in the radar’s field of regard, performance should not be severely degraded. However, a MT explosion at that altitude would produce a fireball initially about 10 km across, which would block about (10/45)^2 = 0.05 sr. A dozen large explosions could block the radars for endoatmospheric intercepts and reduce the flexibility of those for exoatmospheric intercepts. The uncertain coupling of energy into the low density ambient air at high altitudes by exoatmospheric explosions produces 10- to 100-fold uncertainties in predictions of the size of the regions affected by blackout and refraction from high-altitude explosions. Reducing these uncertainties would be difficult because of the lack of data. The U.S. detonated seven devices in the 10 to 250 km altitude region to be used for Safeguard defenses, but only two exoatmospheric nuclear tests relevant to Spartan. Neither tested the key coupling issues in those altitudes or the multi-burst phenomenology that would cause the greatest degradation and uncertainty in expected scenarios. Measurements were made of radar and communication degradations at various frequencies and ranges from the burst, but not of fireball interior ionization and absorption.

Page 31
Missile Defense for the 21st Century
15

22
The tests were recorded photographically with films only sensitive in the visible; thus, there is little basis for IR background predictions. Megaton explosions at altitudes of 150–250 km create hot, ionized fireballs 100s of kilometers across. Most ambient air molecules are stripped of some or most of their electrons, producing initial electron densities n o of about 10^9 to 10^12/cc. At early times, the fireball would form a reflective region of a solid angle of about (300 km/600 km) 2 = 0.3 sr. Placed in front of a PAR, an excluded angle that large would mask the trajectories of subsequent RVs the PARs would need to detect and track in 10s of sec onds. Such obscurations would be unacceptable against attackers spaced at short intervals. As affordable basing allowed little overlap in coverage between adjacent PARs, these obscurations could not be overcome by internetting PAR measurements. After a few 10s of seconds, the fireballs’ temperature should cool by radiation to temperatures of a few thousand degrees. As the fireball cools, the electron density falls. After that, the principal mechanism for the removal of ionization is radiative recombination, which is quadratic in electron density with rate coefficient C
R= 10^–12cc/s.

Recombination causes the electron density n e to fall as 1/CRt. After a time of about 300 s, the electron density drops below the critical density n c
of about 3 x 10^9/cc that would cause complete reflection at PAR’s UHF frequency. Even later, when the fireball is no longer reflecting, absorption losses could still be unacceptable. When electron-ion interactions are the dominant source of collisions, the absorption coefficient α(db/km) is approximately 0.1(n e/f)^2.

Figure D.1 shows absorption as a function of time after a high-altitude explosion for frequencies of 0.5, 2, and 10 GHz. At the PAR frequency of 0.5 GHZ, absorption is over 1,000 db at short times. By 200 s, it drops to about 10 db/km, which would produce losses in propagating through a 100 km thick fireball of about 100 km x 10 db/km or 1,000 db, which is quite opaque. The losses drop to about 0.4 db/km by 1,000 s, but even that would give a one-way loss of 40 db, or 10^4, which is unacceptable. Thus, PAR would not recover during an attack executed over 10 minutes.

The situation was more favorable at the roughly threefold higher frequency of MSR, which would stop reflecting in 30 s and drop to 1 db/km after about 100 s. However, MSR was sized to take tracks from PAR rather than search for itself, so it lacked the sensitivity and range to take advantage of its reduced absorption. X-band radars developed subsequently have critical frequencies 20-fold higher than UHF. Their critical electron densities of 1.2 x 10^12/cc would only be reached only near explosions at 150 km, so x-band radars probably would not be reflected, and their absorption losses would drop below 1 db/km after about 20 s, 0.1 db after 100 s, and 0.01 after 400 s. However, x-band radars were not available during Sentinel and Safeguard, and even those available today are better suited to tracking than to searching large volumes. Potential nuclear environments were complicated by the range of options open to the attacker, who could use precursor bursts to straddle and reduce the PARs’
effective viewing angle, and thereby reduce the value of its tracks to downstream radars and interceptors.
25

22. Bethe, “Countermeasures to ABM Systems,” pp. 130–143.
23. C. Blank, A Pocket Manual of the Physical and Chemical Characteristics of the Earth’s Atmosphere (Washington D.C.:
Defense Nuclear Agency, 1974), p. 147.
24. Ibid., p. 247.
25. Bethe, “Countermeasures to ABM Systems.”
From Missile Defense For The 21st Century by Gregory H. Canavan, published by the Heritage Foundation.
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
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Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
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SirNitram
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Post by SirNitram »

What is Shield Of Faith anyways?
Manic Progressive: A liberal who violently swings from anger at politicos to despondency over them.

Out Of Context theatre: Ron Paul has repeatedly said he's not a racist. - Destructinator XIII on why Ron Paul isn't racist.

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MKSheppard
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Post by MKSheppard »

SirNitram wrote:What is Shield Of Faith anyways?
Written by B-Bruce Briggs, it's a cover-all volume over Strategic
Defenseof America from 1776 to Star Wars. Briggs worked for
Herman Kahn's Hudson Institute for quite a while.
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong

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Post by Patrick Degan »

SirNitram wrote:What is Shield Of Faith anyways?
Well, Amazon.com had this summary of it:
Amazon.com wrote:Editorial Reviews

From Publishers Weekly
In a chatty style that includes occasional gossip from the arcane circles of defense analysis, Bruce-Briggs traces the permutations of strategic-defense policy from the earliest days of air power to the present, from reliance on civil defense and continental air defense, the fights over SALT and ABM, to the politics and technology of Star Wars. Doctrinal disputes in various think-tanks are revealed (as a member of Herman Kahn's Hudson Institute the author was an "insider") in relation to the development of offensive/defensive weapons at the strategic level. As Bruce-Briggs explains, "Much of this book about the defense is about the offense inevitably so, because offense and defense entwine like two lovers embraced in death." Comparing strategic-defense initiatives launched by every administration since Eisenhower's, along with a decade-by-decade account of the worst-case scenario of the day, he concludes that the Reagan administration is no more successful at solving "The Problem" than its predecessors were. The relatively trivial question of which wunderkind was "a pain in the ass" and which colleague had "a pathetic need to be adored" may not be the sort of information serious students of strategic defense will find illuminating; nevertheless such tidbits render the study more lively than most books on the subject.
Copyright 1988 Reed Business Information, Inc.

From Book News, Inc.
A fascinating book that sheds new light on such controversial topics as SDI, MX missile, and deterrence. The author demonstrates the irony that despite huge technological advances, many strategic problems remain unchanged. Annotation copyright Book News, Inc. Portland, Or.
It's a book I suspect Shep is quoting very selectively from and which by its format and scope cannot cover certain aspects of the subject in substantive technical detail —but which in the end doesn't really seem to support his position as much as he thinks it does, if these reviews are anything to go by.
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln

People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House

Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
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