Kwanzaa - Another example of racial seperation?

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2004-12-26 02:28pm

Well, what do you think about Kwanzaa?

Personally, I think taking an identity as nebulous as "African American" - tying it a particular racial background across the board and attempting to identify all blacks in America with this is destructive. Its another example of misguided black nationalism in a way, in my opinion. The best that blacks could do is integrate, yet this is incomprehensible to most black "leaders." (As it would destroy their power base.)

As a holiday its rather contrived and ridiculous, in my opinion.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2004-12-26 02:32pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:Well, what do you think about Kwanzaa?

Personally, I think taking an identity as nebulous as "African American" - tying it a particular racial background across the board and attempting to identify all blacks in America with this is destructive. Its another example of misguided black nationalism in a way, in my opinion. The best that blacks could do is integrate, yet this is incomprehensible to most black "leaders." (As it would destroy their power base.)

As a holiday its rather contrived and ridiculous, in my opinion.

I have yet to meet anyone who even knows what Kwanzaa is let alone celbrates it(Minus one person I met who had folks who had a heritage name "IE Monica-Squal-Noertea and so on)

Galvatron · Post by **Galvatron** » 2004-12-26 02:50pm

I never understoof Kwanzaa, but commercially correct racial sensitivity dictates that we all treat it like a sacred cow--lest we expose ourselves as intolerant bigots.

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2004-12-26 03:29pm

It might be worth noting that Kwanzaa is a purely American phenomenon - as far as I recall, it is not celebrated in any African countries.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2004-12-26 03:44pm

For those of us who aren't American, what is Kwanzaa? African x-mas?

Peregrin Toker · Post by **Peregrin Toker** » 2004-12-26 04:04pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:For those of us who aren't American, what is Kwanzaa? African x-mas?

Kwanzaa @ Wikipedia

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2004-12-26 04:41pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:For those of us who aren't American, what is Kwanzaa? African x-mas?

Basically it's the most bullshit holiday outside a hallmark store.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2004-12-26 04:49pm

During the radical 60's, a Berkley professor and ex-felon decided to create an authentic african december holiday. So, he bastardized about 20 different african harvest ceremonies, made some shit up, and sold it to the black solidarity movement. Wiki says 1 in 6 blacks celebrate it, but I'd put it at 1 in 60.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2004-12-26 04:55pm

I've just read through the Wikipedia article on it. Seems about as legitimate as "Festivus".

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2004-12-26 05:09pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:During the radical 60's, a Berkley professor and ex-felon decided to create an authentic african december holiday. So, he bastardized about 20 different african harvest ceremonies, made some shit up, and sold it to the black solidarity movement. Wiki says 1 in 6 blacks celebrate it, but I'd put it at 1 in 60.

It depends, a lot of poor urban blacks (and for that matter just plain urban) celebrate it because it's a black holiday; they consider it their duty to just because it's something for black people. A stupid, counter-productive shell over a gooy center of racism but a lot of people do for no better reason.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-12-26 05:42pm

Bah, and its made it's way into 'Old Navy' comercials. It has to go.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-12-26 05:42pm

I don't know about you guys, but my attitude towards Kwanzaa is simply 'meh'.

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2004-12-26 08:12pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:I don't know about you guys, but my attitude towards Kwanzaa is simply 'meh'.

My attitude towards it is to take a few IQ points off those that celebrate it. Same for a lot of bullshit Hallmark Holidays.

Dennis Toy · Post by **Dennis Toy** » 2004-12-26 08:24pm

In my opinion, this whole african-american seperation thing gets on my nerves...and i happen to be black too.

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2004-12-26 08:35pm

http://www.globalgourmet.com/food/holid ... rigin.html

Hey, it happens right after Christmas(Dec 26-Jan 1)! Sounds good(another holiday is always welcome).

The site up there says that supposedly 13 million people celebrate it, which, assuming they are all black, which, using the 35.1 million figure from 1999, means that supposedly 37% of blacks are celebrating it. Smells of bullshit, but, like I said, I'm always in favor of a new holiday, especially if we can bastardize it so everybody can celebrate it!

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-12-26 08:52pm

It is essentially a celebration of being black, since it bears no real resemblence to any actual African traditions. It's like dressing in faux-African clothing and giving your kids "African sounding" Islamic-influenced names; just another way of segregating oneself from the general population of the United States.

It's stupid.

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2004-12-26 08:57pm

iving your kids "African sounding" Islamic-influenced names; just another way of segregating oneself from the general population of the United States.

I'm going to kill the next parent who has the idiocy to name their girl "Chenyse."

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2004-12-26 09:30pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:I've just read through the Wikipedia article on it. Seems about as legitimate as "Festivus".

Or Christmas. Or Easter. Or any other holiday. All holidays are made-up bullshit because gods, witches, giants, leprechauns, demons and wizards are all bullshit made-up things. So some black American made up a new one... How long until his holiday gets some cred? Christmas was pretty much ignored or scorned until the early 19th century.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-12-26 09:37pm

Most 'legitimate' holidays are based off an important event such as 4th of July, Thanksgiving, Super Bowl, etc. While others are to honor those who were/are important, such as Memorial/Veterans Day, Presidents Day, Mothers/Fathers Day, MLK Day, Labor Day, and to an extend Christmas and Easter. Kwanzaa was just a pathetic example of me-tooing by the black community.

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2004-12-26 09:48pm

The "events" celebrated on Christmas and Easter have about as much basis in reality as Jar Jar Binks. Even the dates are bogus, being cribbed (along with the trappings) from the pagans. Christmas is a Greek version of a Persian mystery cult of the sun, Jewish messiah lore, Germanic imagery and various Celtic and Roman decorations thrown in for good measure. Easter is also a hodge-podge. And people get uptight about Kwanzaa?

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2004-12-26 09:49pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:Most 'legitimate' holidays are based off an important event such as 4th of July, Thanksgiving, Super Bowl, etc. While others are to honor those who were/are important, such as Memorial/Veterans Day, Presidents Day, Mothers/Fathers Day, MLK Day, Labor Day, and to an extend Christmas and Easter. Kwanzaa was just a pathetic example of me-tooing by the black community.

Is the elevation of Hannukah "me-tooing" from Jews?

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2004-12-26 09:53pm

Elfdart wrote:Is the elevation of Hannukah "me-tooing" from Jews?

I don't know enough about that holiday to make any sort of judgement. What do you think about it?

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2004-12-26 09:58pm

The "events" celebrated on Christmas and Easter have about as much basis in reality as Jar Jar Binks. Even the dates are bogus, being cribbed (along with the trappings) from the pagans. Christmas is a Greek version of a Persian mystery cult of the sun, Jewish messiah lore, Germanic imagery and various Celtic and Roman decorations thrown in for good measure. Easter is also a hodge-podge. And people get uptight about Kwanzaa?

The difference is that the entire purpose of Kwanzaa is to celebrate the fact that your skin is a different color than someone else's skin, and as such it is a thoroughly racist holiday, not even mitigated by being an authentic cultural tradition.

Glocksman · Post by **Glocksman** » 2004-12-26 10:23pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:
Elfdart wrote:Is the elevation of Hannukah "me-tooing" from Jews?
I don't know enough about that holiday to make any sort of judgement. What do you think about it?

A Gentile's Guide to the Jewish Holidays

The most important thing to remember about Chanukkah is that it is not Jewish Christmas, no matter what the card shops and toy stores want you to believe. Chanukkah is a very minor holiday. It's not about joy to the world and peace on Earth and presents galore for everyone you've ever met; it's about lighting candles and playing games for chocolate coins and eating potato pancakes. Many Jewish parents give their children gifts during Chanukkah because they don't want their children to feel left out of Christmas, but Chanukkah gift-giving rarely extends much beyond one's own children.

Most American Jews feel a sort of ambivalence about Chanukkah. On the one hand, most of them know that Chanukkah is not a big deal, and they don't want to make a big deal about it. On the other hand, Christmas is everywhere, unavoidable and overwhelming, and Jews want something of their own to counterbalance it. This is the primary motivation behind elaborate Chanukkah decorations and enormous Chanukkah menorahs in public areas: Chanukkah is not very important, but asserting our Jewish identity and distinctiveness and existence in the face of overwhelming pressure to conform to a non-Jewish norm is important. Pressuring Jews to conform to that norm or to participate in Christmas events if they don't want to is inconsiderate at best.

Knife · Post by **Knife** » 2004-12-26 10:59pm

Elfdart wrote:The "events" celebrated on Christmas and Easter have about as much basis in reality as Jar Jar Binks. Even the dates are bogus, being cribbed (along with the trappings) from the pagans. Christmas is a Greek version of a Persian mystery cult of the sun, Jewish messiah lore, Germanic imagery and various Celtic and Roman decorations thrown in for good measure. Easter is also a hodge-podge. And people get uptight about Kwanzaa?

You know, I started writting a post to dissagree with you, but the further I got into my post to more BS it seemed to be. The origins are crap and as long as everyone gets to party hardy in the general time frame then fuck it. Good for em.

That said, and on the other side of the coin, any minority or even majority that wants the time period to be devoted entirely to themselves are assholes. This goes for the 'black' holiday and the moronic 'reason for the season' numbnuts.

Drink or don't drink. Party or sit in a church and learn dumb shit. Do what you will with a holiday and enjoy.

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Kwanzaa - Another example of racial seperation?

Kwanzaa - Another example of racial seperation?

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