I'll endeavour to stay out of this one, but thought it should be brought up.By Robert Burns
ASSOCIATED PRESS
2:32 p.m. January 13, 2005
WASHINGTON – The Pentagon may never publicly declare that its new missile defense system is fully ready to defend against long-range missiles aimed at the United States, but it already has a limited capability against a small-scale attack, a Pentagon official said Thursday.
The Bush administration's goal was to activate the system by the end of 2004.
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"We haven't made a declaration that we are now hereby operational," said Larry Di Rita, spokesman for Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld. "I don't know that such a declaration will ever be made."
Even so, "We have a nascent operational capability," Di Rita said, adding that the focus is on testing and evaluating the system as it is improved and expanded and eventually put on 24-hour alert.
"It's limited," he said. "It's not what everybody wishes it may be, perhaps. But some capability exists, while you continue to improve upon the capability of that system."
Asked whether that emerging capability satisfies President Bush's goal for missile defense at this stage, Di Rita replied: "The system is what it is. And it will get better over time."
The spokesman did not explain why the Pentagon might never publicly declare the system fully ready. At some point the interceptor missiles will be placed on permanent alert – a condition in which they will be capable of being fired from their silos at any time of day or night, on short notice.
Rick Lehner, a spokesman for the Missile Defense Agency, which is managing the program, said the interceptors have not yet been placed on alert, and he did not know when they would be.
The most recent test of the system, on Dec. 15, encountered a last-minute problem. The interceptor missile that was to be launched in pursuit of a target missile carrying a mock warhead was never fired. Di Rita said that setback had nothing to do with the decision not to declare the system "operational."
Air Force Lt. Gen. Henry A. Obering, director of the Missile Defense Agency, told reporters on Wednesday that the Dec. 15 test will be redone in mid-February, and additional tests in April, July and September will proceed as planned.
The missile defense system will initially rely on interceptors based in underground silos at Fort Greely, Alaska, and Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif., as well as radars in Alaska, California, at sea aboard ships with Aegis radars, and in orbit.
Pentagon May Never Declare NMD Finished
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Pentagon May Never Declare NMD Finished
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I'm having trouble deciphering what is being said here.
What is being put across in the article sounds like, we have a nuclear missile defense system in place, we just don't put much faith in its ability to shoot down nuclear missiles.
Are "long range missiles" reporterspeak for ICBMs, or a bad proxy for Nuclear Blitzkrieg?
What is being put across in the article sounds like, we have a nuclear missile defense system in place, we just don't put much faith in its ability to shoot down nuclear missiles.
Definitely reassuring. Not even the five hundred dollar screwdriver mafia at the Pentagon would put money on this thing.the Article wrote:WASHINGTON – The Pentagon may never publicly declare that its new missile defense system is fully ready to defend against long-range missiles aimed at the United States, but it already has a limited capability against a small-scale attack, a Pentagon official said Thursday.
Are "long range missiles" reporterspeak for ICBMs, or a bad proxy for Nuclear Blitzkrieg?
Many thanks! These darned computers always screw me up. I calculated my first death-toll using a hand-cranked adding machine (we actually calculated the average mortality in each city block individually). Ah, those were the days.
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It's a precursor to the 'Go Fish' strategy they'll be using when Congressional oversight committees try to make budgetary decisions.
"Has the system advanced to the point where it can distinguish between real warheads and decoys in a MIRV attack, General?"
"Go fish, Senator."
"Has the system advanced to the point where it can distinguish between real warheads and decoys in a MIRV attack, General?"
"Go fish, Senator."
[img=right]http://www.tallguyz.com/imagelib/chmeesig.jpg[/img]My guess might be excellent or it might be crummy, but
Mrs. Spade didn't raise any children dippy enough to
make guesses in front of a district attorney,
an assistant district attorney, and a stenographer.
Sam Spade, "The Maltese Falcon"
Operation Freedom Fry
Mrs. Spade didn't raise any children dippy enough to
make guesses in front of a district attorney,
an assistant district attorney, and a stenographer.
Sam Spade, "The Maltese Falcon"
Operation Freedom Fry
I figure they'll eventually declare the system operational if only for PR, though it'll be awhile until it gets there. Several GBIs have already been emplaced in silos in Alaska but the radars are not completely done yet so it'll take time for full operational capacity.
As for some of the text in that quote, to the best of my knowledge the SPY-1 (the so-called "Aegis Radar") will not be used for NMD and the satellites in orbit use IR or IIR sensors, not radar.
As for some of the text in that quote, to the best of my knowledge the SPY-1 (the so-called "Aegis Radar") will not be used for NMD and the satellites in orbit use IR or IIR sensors, not radar.
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I think the idea here is to create uncertainty in any potential attacker. For instance, Kim Jong-il would now have to ask himself "is this going to work, or not?" if he contemplates launching at us.
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In 1966 the Soviets find something on the dark side of the Moon. In 2104 they come back. -- Red Banner / White Star, a nBSG continuation story. Updated to Chapter 4.0 -- 14 January 2013.
I'd like to think that it meant that they were going to continuously upgrade it... but heh.
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SPY-1 doesn't have the performance for the job by a long shot. I suspect whoever wrote the article is either just very confused over the various BMD programs the US military has, or they directly confused AEGIS with the sea based X band radar, which is part of NMD program. That radar is a giant phased array, and SPY-1 is X band, but the two don't have much of anything besides that in common.phongn wrote: As for some of the text in that quote, to the best of my knowledge the SPY-1 (the so-called "Aegis Radar") will not be used for NMD and the satellites in orbit use IR or IIR sensors, not radar.
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OK, so tell me why we would want Kim Jong-Il to have to wonder about whether or not the thing will work. If it has flaws, and he decides, "Eh, it must not work," and a few birdies slip through, we're proper fucked. I don't see why we just shouldn't say "Oh, it fucking works, and if we even see some odd-looking blimps sailing towards California, you're gonna be fucking nicked."
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"The Wire" is the best show in the history of television. Watch it today.
So, as controversial as it is, large-scale acquisition of the Raptor is less important than some problem-ridden ABM shield?
Crusader and Commanche I can see but an ABM shield? How is this not a "cold war relic?"
I remember a USAF officer defending the Raptor in a discussion, saying how many billions of dollars do we spend every year on missiles and anti missile defenses. ABM and Patriot and an airborne laser and the new Aegis-based ABM (granted, in the launch phase only). All of these are researched and funded at no small cost and eventually procured just in case we need them. There is no gaurantee we ever will.
But then you have the Raptor, something that takes the fight to the enemy, and you know that during any conventional conflict you will use it.
Sorry for the thread hijack / gratuitous rant. It had to come out and this was the best subject I've seen recently without digging up a week old one on the Raptor.
Crusader and Commanche I can see but an ABM shield? How is this not a "cold war relic?"
I remember a USAF officer defending the Raptor in a discussion, saying how many billions of dollars do we spend every year on missiles and anti missile defenses. ABM and Patriot and an airborne laser and the new Aegis-based ABM (granted, in the launch phase only). All of these are researched and funded at no small cost and eventually procured just in case we need them. There is no gaurantee we ever will.
But then you have the Raptor, something that takes the fight to the enemy, and you know that during any conventional conflict you will use it.
Sorry for the thread hijack / gratuitous rant. It had to come out and this was the best subject I've seen recently without digging up a week old one on the Raptor.
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Think of it sort of like the Israelis refusing to confirm or deny that they have nuclear weapons.HemlockGrey wrote:OK, so tell me why we would want Kim Jong-Il to have to wonder about whether or not the thing will work. If it has flaws, and he decides, "Eh, it must not work," and a few birdies slip through, we're proper fucked. I don't see why we just shouldn't say "Oh, it fucking works, and if we even see some odd-looking blimps sailing towards California, you're gonna be fucking nicked."
The threshold for inclusion in Wikipedia is verifiability, not truth. -- Wikipedia's No Original Research policy page.
In 1966 the Soviets find something on the dark side of the Moon. In 2104 they come back. -- Red Banner / White Star, a nBSG continuation story. Updated to Chapter 4.0 -- 14 January 2013.
In 1966 the Soviets find something on the dark side of the Moon. In 2104 they come back. -- Red Banner / White Star, a nBSG continuation story. Updated to Chapter 4.0 -- 14 January 2013.
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The costs of the programs are far far less than cleaning up after aPFC Brungardt wrote:There is no gaurantee we ever will.
nuclear initation by a hostile state on our troops or territory.
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Uh...I don't get that either, except that the Israelis get the benefits of nuclear deterrence without having to deal with any pesky regulators or anti-nuclear organizations/treaties.Think of it sort of like the Israelis refusing to confirm or deny that they have nuclear weapons.
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Or the ROK or Japan's territory. I honestly didn't consider this at first. (strange too b/c I often joke to my friends that I'm gonna be nuked)MKSheppard wrote:The costs of the programs are far far less than cleaning up after aPFC Brungardt wrote:There is no gaurantee we ever will.
nuclear initation by a hostile state on our troops or territory.
Your position is superior and now that I think about it, my fear that the Raptor is going to be a silver-bullet weapon (due to its limited quantity) is exactly what these hostile states likely to use nukes have -- a silver bullet. If we make these weapons useless then all the better.
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Japan has signed onto AEGIS BMD and the SM-3 program, they'll getPFC Brungardt wrote:Or the ROK or Japan's territory.
it at sea in about 2007. Having North Korean ICBMs sailing over you
wakes you up mighty quick.
"If scientists and inventors who develop disease cures and useful technologies don't get lifetime royalties, I'd like to know what fucking rationale you have for some guy getting lifetime royalties for writing an episode of Full House." - Mike Wong
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944