Military Has Discharged 26 Gay Linguists

[dr. what]

link

SAN FRANCISCO - The number of Arabic linguists discharged from the military for violating its "don't ask, don't tell" policy is higher than previously reported, according to records obtained by a research group.

The group contends the records show that the military — at a time when it and U.S. intelligence agencies don't have enough Arabic speakers — is putting its anti-gay stance ahead of national security.

Between 1998 and 2004, the military discharged 20 Arabic and six Farsi speakers, according to Department of Defense (news - web sites) data obtained by the Center for the Study of Sexual Minorities in the Military under a Freedom of Information Act request.

The military previously confirmed that seven translators who specialized in Arabic had been discharged between 1998 and 2003 because they were gay. The military did not break down the discharges by year, but said some, but not all, of the additional 13 discharges of Arabic speakers occurred in 2004.

Aaron Belkin, the center's director, said he wants the public to see the real costs of "don't ask, don't tell."

"We had a language problem after 9/11 and we still have a language problem," Belkin said Wednesday.

The military's "don't ask, don't tell" policy allows gays and lesbians to serve in the military as long as they keep their sexual orientation private and do not engage in homosexual acts.

"The military is placing homophobia well ahead of national security," said Steve Ralls, spokesman for the Servicemembers Legal Defense Network, a nonprofit group that advocates for the rights of gay military members. "It's rather appalling that in the weeks leading up to 9/11 messages were coming in, waiting to be translated ... and at the same time they were firing people who could've done that job."

But others, like Elaine Donnelly of the Center for Military Readiness, a conservative advocacy group that opposes gays serving in the military, said the discharged linguists never should have been accepted at the elite Defense Language Institute in Monterey in the first place.

"Resources unfortunately were used to train young people who were not eligible to be in the military," she said.

In the fiscal year ended Sept. 30, 543 Arabic linguists and 166 Farsi linguists graduated from their 63-week courses, according to a DLI spokesman. That was up from 377 and 139, respectively, in the previous year.

Experts have identified the shortage of Arabic linguists as contributing to the government's failure to thwart the Sept. 11 attacks. The independent Sept. 11 commission made similar conclusions.

Ian Finkenbinder, an Army Arabic linguist who graduated from the Defense Language Institute in 2002, was discharged from the military last month after announcing to his superiors that he's gay. Finkenbinder, who said his close friends in the Army already knew he was gay, served eight months in Iraq (news - web sites) and was about to return for a second tour when he made the revelation official.

"I looked at myself and said, `Are you willing to go to war with an institution that won't recognize that you have the right to live as you want to,'" said Finkenbinder, 22, who now lives in Baltimore. "It just got to be tiresome to deal with that — to constantly have such a significant part of your life under scrutiny."

The Servicemembers Legal Defense Network last month sued the government on behalf of 12 other gay former military members seeking reinstatement. They argue that "don't ask, don't tell" violates their constitutional rights.
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I don't get it.

Very few of these linguists would not have been on the front lines--so you couldn't have used that 'bad for morale' arguement--these people would have been sitting in little cubicles somewhere listening to hours and hours of tapes and wotking on a laptop. Who cares who they're banging--as long as they're doing their job?

It's nice that they've increased the number of graduates in their programs--but you had 26 people here who've had the training and experience and are volunteering their services--where's the logic in forcing them out?

[Enforcer Talen]

they broke the contract they signed.

however, that being a widget on part of the enlistment contract makes little sense to me, for cases such as above.

[Illuminatus Primus]

That military efficiency and professionalism.

[Stormbringer]

Jeez, you'd think with the critical demand for such linguists that the Army would at least have the sense to ignore that damn policy. Damn shame, one would hope that they get a job some place like the CIA.

[Durandal]

That's This Man's Army's Policy, folks. We're either going to defend the country and stabilize Iraq with good, God-fearing, heterosexual men or not at all.

[Chmee]

Would they have faced the same problem if they were cunning linguists?

*ba-dumCHING*

I love our 'don't think, don't win' approach .....

[Durandal]

Would they have faced the same problem if they were cunning linguists?

Oooooh, well-played, sir.

[Howedar]

FUQable.

[Mayabird]

I'll bet the people who think gay marriage is a threat to homeland security would be dancing the happy jig now if dancing wasn't a sin, too.

[Patrick Degan]

So, while in the middle of one war in a time when it seems we're spoiling for another war on top of it, we're dismissing from service expert linguists because they prefer speaking-in-tongues with their fellow men...?

[Enforcer Talen]

yep. welcome to fighting the war with the army we have, not the one we want.

[Durandal]

I'll bet the people who think gay marriage is a threat to homeland security would be dancing the happy jig now if dancing wasn't a sin, too.

Sin of gambling.

[Crown]

Since when do gays speak their own language?


Okay, that was sub-par, but damit the thread title made me interpret it that way!

[HemlockGrey]

Chmee, you rock. That's going in the act.

[Nieztchean Uber-Amoeba]

Would they have faced the same problem if they were cunning linguists?

Probably. The only position that exists in our country is straight sex, missionary-style. All the others got the devil in 'em.

[Medic]

I'm always disguted by this. There is a huge disconnect between American and Army values and reality once religion is brought in to the picture. All of a suddenly freedom is arbitrary and an otherwise honorable service record thrown out the window.

For some blasted reason though, homosexual orientation is the line in the sand where all compromises are out the window. And honestly, if you don't implicate a great many Americans in general for this then you are at fault. Intolerance starts somewhere and no matter how "ingrained" it might be, institutions like religion only explain so much. At some point, the reality truely is that yes, most Americans who oppose the gay community in any number ways, are all at fault.

To HELL with people like Rush Limbaugh who actually explicitly state that liberals are condescending and arrogant enough that, when they lose in the public forum at introducing a new law designed to curb intolerance, they "run" off to the courts, in particular the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, and try to circumvent and supress the people's opinion.

One might note that that is essence their job though; the arbitors and true protectors of the Constitution they are. I salute every "activist" judge because in him is the true spirit of the Constitution

The founding fathers in those papers pimping the Constitution (they are evading me right now; I'll google it after my boots are shined ) always warned of a tyranny of either a minority or a majority. If the majority of Americans favor something un-Constitutional then that's too bad for them. (who was it on this board that said that the Judicial branch was the only one he respected anymore?)

Looks like the Constituion has built in protections against appeals to popularity (like the popular position against gays) and false dilemnas (where in a government, trying to protect minority rights, goes overboard and in turn infringes on the majority's rights?) I believe words to that effect are what I remember reading about... 3 years ago in US History.

[White Haven]

The founding fathers in those papers pimping the Constitution (they are evading me right now; I'll google it after my boots are shined Wink ) always warned of a tyranny of either a minority or a majority. If the majority of Americans favor something un-Constitutional then that's too bad for them. (who was it on this board that said that the Judicial branch was the only one he respected anymore?)

Don't know if itw as me, but that's certainly how I feel. They drop the ball sometimes, but they're the only ones with the stones to stand up to the Christian Right these days.

[Xenophobe3691]

Don't know if itw as me, but that's certainly how I feel. They drop the ball sometimes, but they're the only ones with the stones to stand up to the Christian Right these days.

That's because they don't have to be elected. The forefathers were very, very smart on this kind of stuff...

[Marksist]

Probably. The only position that exists in our country is straight sex, missionary-style. All the others got the devil in 'em.

In all seriousness though, I thought oral sex wasn't allowed in the military? Had a friend that was in the Navy a few years ago tell me that in the rule book it says only the missionary position is acceptable.

[Beowulf]

Probably. The only position that exists in our country is straight sex, missionary-style. All the others got the devil in 'em.

In all seriousness though, I thought oral sex wasn't allowed in the military? Had a friend that was in the Navy a few years ago tell me that in the rule book it says only the missionary position is acceptable.

Anything other than vaginal intercourse is technically sodomy, which violates article 125. It tends to be used when throwing the book at someone though.

[Drooling Iguana]

Chmee, you rock. That's going in the act.

He copied it from the third Austin Powers movie.

"You may be a cunning linguist, but I'm a master debator!"

[Pick]

This seems so... bloody stupid. Anything I could say already has been, but I just get more and more irritated at this kind of situation in my country. "Remember, folks, national security is our foremost priority! Er, except the one about being homophobic jerks."

[Plekhanov]

Chmee, you rock. That's going in the act.

He copied it from the third Austin Powers movie.

"You may be a cunning linguist, but I'm a master debator!"

Not necessarily, I've never seen Austin Powers 3 but I have heard the “cunning linguist” thing previously, for example in a British sitcom set in a barristers chambers can't remember the name of the series, but I'm pretty sure it pre-dated AP3.

It's pretty basic punning and not beyond the realms of possibility for several people to arrive at the same play on words independently.

[Keevan_Colton]

Chmee, you rock. That's going in the act.

He copied it from the third Austin Powers movie.

"You may be a cunning linguist, but I'm a master debator!"

It's ancient material, it predates everything Myers has done. It's just an old fashioned pun.