The Official Episode III spoiler thread

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2005-02-01 06:24am

This site had some pretty good pics of ROTS toy, but I found this particular pic interesting as it showed a rather good pic of a Venator class Star Destroyer on a box:

+http://photos.sirstevesguide.com/showph ... 024&page=1

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-02-01 06:43am

I saw a closer up picture of that box:

+http://img79.exs.cx/img79/3113/2republi ... 4mc6rv.jpg

Notice this ROTS LAAT gunship picture:

+http://www.yakface.com/2005/walmart/40.jpg

See how one of them is in ARC Trooper garb? Notice also the pilot uniforms have changed, just like the AOTC:ICS said

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2005-02-01 07:40am

Yes Vympel, that was indeed a better view of the box.

I agree, it does look like an ARC-trooper. Of course, the possibility exists that they've mixed toys from different toylines, but perhaps we'll see a few of them in ROTS anyway, since Lucas reportedly liked Clone Wars (of course, they first appeared in the Republic)?

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-02-01 08:53am

It was funny to see the ARC-170 designation for the clone fighters (even though the acronym was a bit different in meaning), but this seems to either support ARC-troopers in the film, or that commanders now copied their uniforms.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-02-01 08:58am

Mange the Swede wrote:Yes Vympel, that was indeed a better view of the box.

I agree, it does look like an ARC-trooper. Of course, the possibility exists that they've mixed toys from different toylines, but perhaps we'll see a few of them in ROTS anyway, since Lucas reportedly liked Clone Wars (of course, they first appeared in the Republic)?

I've seen troopers in that grab on one of the ROTS comic covers as well, so I'd say it's almost definite they have a place in the film. It being from a different toyline is doubtful- notice he has the ROTS-type Clonetrooper helmet.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-02-01 09:11am

There is a Skytrooper in a Lego-set and in the SW:CW season 3 preview gallery, I believe he had a pseudo-ARC uniform as well. Who knows, they might have become popular over the course of the wars, due to the ARCs heroic exploits.

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2005-02-01 10:59am

Vympel wrote:
Mange the Swede wrote:Yes Vympel, that was indeed a better view of the box.

I agree, it does look like an ARC-trooper. Of course, the possibility exists that they've mixed toys from different toylines, but perhaps we'll see a few of them in ROTS anyway, since Lucas reportedly liked Clone Wars (of course, they first appeared in the Republic)?
I've seen troopers in that grab on one of the ROTS comic covers as well, so I'd say it's almost definite they have a place in the film. It being from a different toyline is doubtful- notice he has the ROTS-type Clonetrooper helmet.

Yes, that is true. It would be good to see them in the film.

Meest · Post by **Meest** » 2005-02-01 02:50pm

That webdoc is leaked on bittorrent (am I allowed to say that?). Was just blown away by the realtime editting/compositing they can do, even if the editted Obi shot looked rushed. The pace of the fights seem upped a level so it's all good.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-02-01 07:09pm

New pic of Chewie.

I like it because it appears that Lucas didn't go back and bring the Bowcaster out of storage from the Archives. I could be wrong, but it looks like an earlier version of Chewie's trademark weapon.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-02-02 08:19am

"Wait!" cries Anakin, grabbing Mace's arm from delivering the final blow. "Don't kill him...you just can't kill him Master. "

"Yes I can," replies Mace, "I have to."

"You came to arrest him. He has to stand trial. "

"A trial would be a joke. He controls the courts. He controls the Senate."

"So are you going to kill all of them too?" asks Anakin. "Like he said you would?"

Mace yanks his arm free. "He's too dangerous to be left alive. If you could have taken Dooku alive, would you have?

Anakin stares at Mace, "That was different."

"You can explain the difference after he's dead," replies Mace sternly.

"I need him alive! I need him to save Padme!" says Anakin to a bewildered Mace.

But Mace just turns and is about to finish his final strike against The Sith when Anakin unleashes his anger and cuts off Mace's saber hand. Sidious suddenly jumps to his feet and unleashes Force lightning of immense power, lifting Mace up and throwing him out of the broken window to his death below.

Once Mace is killed, Anakin pledges his attachment to the Sith Order. Sidious gives him the title DARTH VADER and instructs him in his first mission... sterilization of the Jedi Temple.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2005-02-02 08:29am

I like the hook which seems to be draggin Anakin to the Dark Side, but it seems like Mace went out like a chump.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-02-02 08:55am

Crown wrote:I like the hook which seems to be draggin Anakin to the Dark Side, but it seems like Mace went out like a chump.

Note that its Mace's "final strike". We know he fights Sidious before this. That's good enough for me.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2005-02-02 08:58am

Vympel wrote:
Crown wrote:I like the hook which seems to be draggin Anakin to the Dark Side, but it seems like Mace went out like a chump.
Note that its Mace's "final strike". We know he fights Sidious before this. That's good enough for me.

Yeah but Sidious is 'playing to the crowd' at this point isn't he? Recording everything to latter use as evidence agains the Jedi as being enemies against the Republic ... it all depends on when he turns off the recording device.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-02-02 11:28am

"HELP HELP! MURDER! TREASON!!!" *lightsabre-noises*

*Procedes to kill Agen Kolar and Sasee Tiin*

*Winks at Windu and Kit, makes "Shhh"-gesture, turns off recording device*

*Kills Kit, fights Windu*

*Anakin arrives, watches Palpatine and Windu fight on edge outside broken window, Palpatine is seemingly defeated, Anakin and Mace argues*

*Windu gets hand lopped off, is electrocuted, falls to his death*

I wouldn´t say that´s too shabby an exit.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2005-02-02 12:26pm

We'll see.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-02-02 01:46pm

If this is true and while some might be dissapointed at Anakin not being the one to take Mace out, it does ties into what Lucas has said recently in instances like the Bonus DVD about Anakin and his drive for power.

Anakin is someone who has a hard time letting. His line in Episode I "I don't want things to change" and Shimi's response, "But you can't stop the change," both foreshadow his actions and mindset as the saga progresses.

Anakin can't accept the change and sets out to acquire the power necesssary to make everything the way he wants it. This is why he joins the Jedi Order, so he can acquire the power necessary to free his mother, an act that fails when the Tuskens kill her. So Padme is next in line as he seeks to become more powerful in the Order so as to do whatever he wants, in this case, marrying Padme.

This culminates with Episode III with Anakin's dreams showing Padme dying and Palpatine offering the power to save her through the Dark Side. As we can infer, he fails and Padme will likely die by the end of ROTS and by then, it's too late for Anakin. He's made a deal with the devil and has been consumed by the power that he thought was his tool.

Now we head into the Classic trilogy and this desire's impact on Episodes IV-VI. With Padme dead, that desire for power reaches new heights as he is now the right hand man of the most powerful man in the entire galaxy. Even at this point, it's still not enough that you have a hand in controlling the known universe; he wants more. Like the tradition of the Sith, he seeks to overthrow his master and take the entire sabbac pot.

Then Luke enters from stage left and this changes everything.

His desire for this greater power is put into conflict with his earlier desire of having the family that the Jedi Order denied him. He wants Luke as his ally, not the Emperor's. Luke is in his initial viewpoint another tool and insturment of power to Vader in his quest for even more power. Combined, the two Skywalkers have the necessary power to overthorow Palpatine and take the sabbac pot. Vader want's to have his cake and eat it.

Palpatine, of course, knows this, but also knows that he can't just off Vader; he needs Vader for running the Empire and maintaining order. This is where Luke enters in the Emperor's book. Just as with Anakin and Dooku in ROTS, have Luke kill Vader to test his worthiness. By killing his father, Luke would take the first step down the dark path and Palpatine could mold that into a new, better, subservient apprentice than Vader.

But as we know, Luke is wired differently. Luke's near turn to the Dark Side in ROTJ, like anakin in ROTS, is motivated to save the ones he loves, those on and above Endor. But it's not quite the same. Luke has genuine love for Leia, Han, Chewie, Lando, and the others. Anakin's loyalty to the Jedi was always strained because of Qui-Gon.

Qui-Gon was the one who told him that because of his great power he could be the Chosen One. This planeted the seeds of ego and pride in Anakin, who by the time of AOTC, thought that because he was more powerful than the other Jedi, he should progress father and have greater access to the aforementioned power.

But with Luke, it's different. Luke was never told the truth about his father (being a Jedi, mind you, from Owen Lars) and Obi-Wan never stated how powerful Anakin was in the Force to Luke in ROTJ. Even with the destruction of the Death Star, the seeds of ego and pride did not plant themselves in him as they did in his father. The simple fact is Luke never wanted that power.

(Though, however, it could be argued that he did in order to avenge Obi-Wan, a desire thrown out the window with the revelation of the Bespin duel. His further training in the Force could be argued as an attempt to aquire the power necessary to free Anakin from Vader).

Anyway, this is the key to Luke's maturity vs. Anakin's lack thereof. Luke has the maturity to see as he's standing over Vader both of their artifical hands and realize he's heading down the same road of destruction that destroyed Anakin and thus refuses to play the Emperor's game.

Palpatine is enraged, realizing that it is impossible to repeat on Luke what he did with Anakin, hence his attempt to kill him. This is once again where Vader's thirst for power comes into conflict with his very human desire for a family, with the family winning out and his killing Palpatine, but not for the power that his master's death will bring.

I could be wrong, however. Much of the effect of the classic trilogy will depend on what happes in ROTS to Anakin and Padme.

Meest · Post by **Meest** » 2005-02-02 02:36pm

Though these spoilers are paraphrasing mosty, it doesn't explain how Anakin all of a sudden goes, "hey Palps I'm yours" immediately after killing Mace. Has to be more to it than that. If it is as quick as the spoiler makes it I comes across rushed and stupid.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-02-02 04:45pm

Throughout the first part of the film they´ve been building up his dislike for the Jedi Order, him being used by different parties for their own benefit (even the Jedi) and having a vision of Padme dying (his last human "possession", that he can´t afford to lose).

Even though he kills Mace and turns, he´s starting to plan his own agenda. Palpatine claims to hold the key to eternal life. Anakin wants that and he figures that by doing Palpatine´s dirty work and biding his time, he´ll learn the secret, kill Palpatine and then he and Padme will rule the galaxy as Emperor and Empress.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-02-02 07:13pm

A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.

Hardy · Post by **Hardy** » 2005-02-02 07:22pm

JME2 wrote:A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.

Props to Nick Gillard. That has got to be some of the most complex handwork I've ever seen in a SW movie.

Old Plympto · Post by **Old Plympto** » 2005-02-02 08:18pm

Hardy wrote:
JME2 wrote:A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.
Props to Nick Gillard. That has got to be some of the most complex handwork I've ever seen in a SW movie.

Hey look! Those mushroom control panels from the OT.

YT300000 · Post by **YT300000** » 2005-02-02 08:39pm

Hardy wrote:
JME2 wrote:A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.
Props to Nick Gillard. That has got to be some of the most complex handwork I've ever seen in a SW movie.

First reaction: Wow, shit, awesome, cool, et cetera adinfinitum, culminating in the eventual "shit, I'm gonna see this the day it comes out..."

Second reaction (much like Old Plympto's): Hey, Imperial wraparound control panels like on the DS2!

EDIT: Well, they're different, pedestalled, flashier, etc, but very similar in design.

Hardy · Post by **Hardy** » 2005-02-02 09:24pm

Old Plympto wrote:
Hardy wrote:
JME2 wrote:A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.
Props to Nick Gillard. That has got to be some of the most complex handwork I've ever seen in a SW movie.
Hey look! Those mushroom control panels from the OT.

Heh. It's complete with the metal staircase, "throne", and giant windows. But the Trade Federation design influence is there(like that table in the first few frames, for example).

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2005-02-03 03:13am

Meest wrote:Though these spoilers are paraphrasing mosty, it doesn't explain how Anakin all of a sudden goes, "hey Palps I'm yours" immediately after killing Mace. Has to be more to it than that. If it is as quick as the spoiler makes it I comes across rushed and stupid.

According to spoilers from the same source, Anakin has had visions of Padmé dying in childbirth. Palpatine has also already told Anakin about Plagueis, Darth Sidious's master (it's not known if Palpatine has revealed yet that Plagueis was a Sith). Darth Plageuis taught Palpatine/Sidious how to cheat death, and Sidious reveals to Anakin just as Mace is about to give Sidious the final blow, that the story about Plagueis is real. This should make Anakin's motivations a bit more clear, when you take the events of AOTC in consideration.

Now, I don't know if the spoilers are legit, but I think they make sense.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2005-02-03 04:06am

JME2 wrote:A friend on another board has footage of the Dooku/Anakin rematch here.

Niiiiiiiice!

EDIT :: You can even see Palpy in the background!