SW still has such primitive tech?

wolveraptor · Post by **wolveraptor** » 2005-02-20 12:06am

it seems to me that the technology used in star wars still involves a great deal of wires, welding and all sorts of stuff we still use today.

now the universe of SW has a history of more than 25,000 years. the republic alone is that old, and i know there is history before that. and through out all this time, they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

now i can understand that maybe they've reached some sort've peak, but 25,000+years? come on. do they not have scientists any more? is it like the Roman Empire, where they fail to create innovative designs due to overuse of droid slave labor? any one know?

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2005-02-20 12:16am

Just because something requires welding doesn't mean it's low tech. Do you know a better way of joing two pieces of metal?

Mad · Post by **Mad** » 2005-02-20 12:34am

unbeataBULL wrote:it seems to me that the technology used in star wars still involves a great deal of wires, welding and all sorts of stuff we still use today.

Because they work, and they're reliable. And they're easy to repair if they get damaged.

Besides, if writers tried to come up with something more "advanced," there's a big chance it'll be something less reliable. Sure, a force-field security door or plasma conduits may look cool... but lose power or poke a hole in it, and you'll suddenly have big problems on your hands.

Seriously, what do you suggest to replace them?

they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

The concept of diminishing returns. Once you've sufficiently advanced, there will be a point where advancing any further just isn't worth the cost.

now i can understand that maybe they've reached some sort've peak, but 25,000+years? come on. do they not have scientists any more? is it like the Roman Empire, where they fail to create innovative designs due to overuse of droid slave labor? any one know?

You're contradicting yourself. You say maybe they've reached the peak, but then you say they shouldn't have reached the peak. Why wouldn't they have? 25,000 years is just the Galactic Republic. There's plenty of time before that where lots of development took place.

And, yes, there have been advancements during that time. But not by leaps and bounds. Starfighter technology seems to have been advancing a bit over the course of the main era. The old Z-95s are clearly outclassed by the first generation X-wings. And as time went on, the X-wing models were steadily improved. No fundamentally new technology, but putting existing technologies to better use and miniturizing them even more every now and then.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-02-20 01:25am

unbeataBULL wrote:it seems to me that the technology used in star wars still involves a great deal of wires, welding and all sorts of stuff we still use today.

now the universe of SW has a history of more than 25,000 years. the republic alone is that old, and i know there is history before that. and through out all this time, they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

now i can understand that maybe they've reached some sort've peak, but 25,000+years? come on. do they not have scientists any more? is it like the Roman Empire, where they fail to create innovative designs due to overuse of droid slave labor? any one know?

Correction: REALISTIC.

Star Trek makes you think that because one has touchscreens instead of buttons, it's more futuristic, but in reality, sometimes buttons can be PRACTICAL.

Star Wars is much more realistic than ST. In ST, you have schools with touchscreens on their BELLS. It's downright ridiculous. Every single thing in ST must be the most technological solution possible, even if its impractical.

For example, blast doors vs force fields. Blast doors are much more practical because you close them and leave them shut. Force fields require a constant power drain and if power goes down, force fields go off and vacuum kills everyone on board.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2005-02-20 02:29am

now the universe of SW has a history of more than 25,000 years. the republic alone is that old, and i know there is history before that. and through out all this time, they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

What if they discovered all the principles of physics by then, there is no more new tech to develop ?

DoctorPhanan · Post by **DoctorPhanan** » 2005-02-20 03:23am

Praxis wrote: Star Wars is much more realistic than ST. In ST, you have schools with touchscreens on their BELLS. It's downright ridiculous. Every single thing in ST must be the most technological solution possible, even if its impractical.

The Force, yes I know its a nitpick, but I couldnt stop myself. As far as the topic goes however, I think that in the Han Solo Adventures there was mention of Regular Circuitry- Fluidics- Shielded Circuitry. Meaning that for a time, Star Wars did have a non electrical based system, but then moved on to more advanced and efficient technology.

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2005-02-20 03:51am

DoctorPhanan wrote: The Force, yes I know its a nitpick, but I couldnt stop myself. As far as the topic goes however, I think that in the Han Solo Adventures there was mention of Regular Circuitry- Fluidics- Shielded Circuitry. Meaning that for a time, Star Wars did have a non electrical based system, but then moved on to more advanced and efficient technology.

It was supposedly some sort of hydraulics-powered system. For some reason it got installed aboard the Falcon and Han hated it from the moment it got put in to the moment it finally got taken out and regular circuitry reinstalled.

I do have the book, just not in hand at the moment, and I've forgotten the exact reason why it had to get installed in the first place.

DavidVCSAndersen · Post by **DavidVCSAndersen** » 2005-02-20 04:21am

I think that even if everything the Empire and other big known organizations use in the Star Wars movies are not what would seem like state of the art equipment, it would not mean that better stuff didnt exists in the sw galaxy.

Our own earth history has also shown many times, especially in the ancient times, to have invented stuff and devices that would later be lost over time. I think the same thing happens all the time on a galactic civilization scale. (Take the cloaking device in mind!)

Sure the TIE fighters and X-Wings may not be the best the starfighters evolution has to offer in 50.000 years - But I would bet they are constructed with a financial budget in mind. Why should they make super starfighters for the price of 10 X-Wings if 10 X-Wings could take that same fighter out with only few casualties?

ST vs. SW Why should "advanced" stuff like teleporters not have been invented sometime in the SW galaxy? It would be unrealistic if there was no teleporters as we on earth now already have ideas and theories about how to construct them. I don't see anything "advanced" in ST that could not be in SW.

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2005-02-20 05:20am

unbeataBULL wrote: now the universe of SW has a history of more than 25,000 years. the republic alone is that old, and i know there is history before that. and through out all this time, they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

Blasters have improved. When they first appeared (during the time of Xim the Despot IIRC) they were less powerful and you had to where a big heavy rig that generated the power. Fast forward to "present times" and you have blasters that you can hold in one hand and blo holes through concrete with.

Since hyperdrives have different classes of speed i would assume they have seen advancements since first being invented, but i have nothing concrete.

Overall the general idea seems to be "If it ain't broke and it still works good, don't fix it."

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2005-02-20 07:18am

unbeataBULL wrote:it seems to me that the technology used in star wars still involves a great deal of wires, welding and all sorts of stuff we still use today.

Because such things work.

This would be like saying why are they using guns instead of insta kill pods.

now the universe of SW has a history of more than 25,000 years. the republic alone is that old, and i know there is history before that. and through out all this time, they're still using blasters, they don't come up with a more efficient hyperdrive, and there are generally no huge tech breakthroughs.

I don't think you quite understand what a breakthrough is.

There could've been many but none of them replaced or caught on like regular. This is much like a flying car argument. Until something is deemed viable, it is nothing more then at best a curiosity.

And their progress is the same as any society, until the needs demand such. Small but subtle changes.

Just because we haven't seen the curiosities simply going "They are stagnant" is a gross generalization.

now i can understand that maybe they've reached some sort've peak, but 25,000+years? come on. do they not have scientists any more? is it like the Roman Empire, where they fail to create innovative designs due to overuse of droid slave labor? any one know?

You contradicted yourself quite poorly here. So which are they?

Peaked or not?

Trytostaydead · Post by **Trytostaydead** » 2005-02-20 11:00am

There is always ongoing research in Star Wars. Hence we see Leviathans, Star Destroyers, etc.

As for weaponary itself, come on, how many hundreds of years have we been "perfecting" the art of killing by hurling projectiles at great speeds?

I forget where I read it, but it seems like in SW no one quite understands hyperdrive itself. They can tinker with it and coax more speed out of it, but not yet understand what makes the mechanism itself work. Or hyperspace itself for that matter as evidenced by the R&R group attached to the Black Sword Command.

Patrick Ogaard · Post by **Patrick Ogaard** » 2005-02-20 12:39pm

Shinova wrote:
DoctorPhanan wrote: The Force, yes I know its a nitpick, but I couldnt stop myself. As far as the topic goes however, I think that in the Han Solo Adventures there was mention of Regular Circuitry- Fluidics- Shielded Circuitry. Meaning that for a time, Star Wars did have a non electrical based system, but then moved on to more advanced and efficient technology.

It was supposedly some sort of hydraulics-powered system. For some reason it got installed aboard the Falcon and Han hated it from the moment it got put in to the moment it finally got taken out and regular circuitry reinstalled.

I do have the book, just not in hand at the moment, and I've forgotten the exact reason why it had to get installed in the first place.

It was in "Han Solo's Revenge." The Falcon had got shot up a mite over Rampa while trying to smuggle in 5,000 liters of pure R'alla mineral water, and some of the damaged control circuitry was about to give out when the Falcon limped to Kamar. Kamar's a primitive place, with nationalism the order of the day and the most advanced weapons being nuclear-tipped missiles. Charged particle beams were developed to screw up missile circuitry, and the locals weren't up to producing shielded circuits. Thus, fluidic circuits were developed.

The Falcon ended up loaded with adaptor fittings, interface routers, and gas and liquid fluidic components. As Sonniod, a former fellow smuggler, said: "Fluidics? Solo, dear fellow, I'd rather steer my ship with a blunt pole. Why couldn't you get some decent circuitry?"

No wonder Chewie ended up throwing the fluidic components for distance once suitable replacements could be obtained.

Lord Poe · Post by **Lord Poe** » 2005-02-20 01:43pm

Ask a modern rock band why they don't rely on wireless mike 100% of the time on tour. Or why film crews don't use wireless mikes and do away with boom operators. A hard connecton is more reliable.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2005-02-20 01:44pm

Lord Poe wrote:Ask a modern rock band why they don't rely on wireless mike 100% of the time on tour. Or why film crews don't use wireless mikes and do away with boom operators. A hard connecton is more reliable.

Isn't it also cheaper? I imagine it would be so, but I'm no expert so I'd just be guessing.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-02-20 01:45pm

Lord Poe wrote:Ask a modern rock band why they don't rely on wireless mike 100% of the time on tour. Or why film crews don't use wireless mikes and do away with boom operators. A hard connecton is more reliable.

Exactly, look at wireless. Sure, we can get wireless to go very fast (108 MBps currently), but it is always less than a hard-wired connection (10 GBps anyone?).

Robert Walper · Post by **Robert Walper** » 2005-02-20 01:52pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:Just because something requires welding doesn't mean it's low tech. Do you know a better way of joing two pieces of metal?

Molecular bonding?

DavidVCSAndersen · Post by **DavidVCSAndersen** » 2005-02-20 03:11pm

Robert Walper wrote:
Cpl Kendall wrote:Just because something requires welding doesn't mean it's low tech. Do you know a better way of joing two pieces of metal?
Molecular bonding?

hehe Good one!

avoidingthepo · Post by **avoidingthepo** » 2005-02-20 04:48pm

i think its just because if you weld something together or have some physical object set in place, your done with it and it is there for a damn long time. theres just no sense in using energy fields to hold four walls together in every room

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2005-02-20 07:29pm

Robert Walper wrote: Molecular bonding?

Whats molecular bonding?

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-02-20 08:44pm

Cpl Kendall wrote:
Robert Walper wrote: Molecular bonding?
Whats molecular bonding?

Did you take Chemistry?

Water is an example. Two hydrogen and one oxygen molecules are bonded together.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2005-02-20 08:49pm

Praxis wrote:
Did you take Chemistry?

I failed it, both years.

Water is an example. Two hydrogen and one oxygen molecules are bonded together.

Can you actually use this to join metal? And is it practical?

wolveraptor · Post by **wolveraptor** » 2005-02-20 09:13pm

well, for one thing, i was expecting nanobots, and a lot more work done on a microscopic level. that's why the R2 series seems rather poory designed. they're a lot bigger targets than if you released a stream of nanobots that traveled throughout the ship, fixing it on a molecular level.
though there was a recent article posted by someone that introduced the Law of Fluctuation, where the smaller a system is, the more likely it is that you will observe deviation from the 2nd law of thermodynamics. still, they've already used nanotech to some extent today.

somehow, i can't grasp the idea that after a 25 millenia, wires are still the best things out there, for their cost.

haven't they been theorizing about DNA-based computers, that use the DNA molecule to store vast amounts of info?

another thing i found absent is extensive genetic manipulation of clones. why weren't they made with the strength of a big silverback gorilla (if they were still known about)? or enhanced reflexes? cost maybe? i'm not so sure. we can already splice the genes of fish and plants, and create plants resistant to certain diseases.

i realize that mapping the genome of numerous species would be very time-consuming, but again, 25+ millenia...

maybe the same sort of advancement taking place now just can't be ascribed to a civilization so far into the future.

Techno_Union · Post by **Techno_Union** » 2005-02-20 09:30pm

unbeataBULL wrote:well, for one thing, i was expecting nanobots,

They do have nanites, it's just in the EU.

and a lot more work done on a microscopic level. that's why the R2 series seems rather poory designed. they're a lot bigger targets than if you released a stream of nanobots that traveled throughout the ship, fixing it on a molecular level.

I assume you're thinking about something like the Borg?
somehow, i can't grasp the idea that after a 25 millenia, wires are still the best things out there, for their cost.

another thing i found absent is extensive genetic manipulation of clones. why weren't they made with the strength of a big silverback gorilla (if they were still known about)? or enhanced reflexes? cost maybe? i'm not so sure. we can already splice the genes of fish and plants, and create plants resistant to certain diseases.

Actually they are enhanced... just not to the point where they're genetic freaks... I suppose the reason behind them not being like that could be some where.

i realize that mapping the genome of numerous species would be very time-consuming, but again, 25+ millenia...

What exactly are you trying to say?

dworkin · Post by **dworkin** » 2005-02-21 02:33am

unbeataBULL wrote:well, for one thing, i was expecting nanobots

Because nanobots are magical tech which for some reason has no disadvantages?

that's why the R2 series seems rather poory designed. they're a lot bigger targets than if you released a stream of nanobots that traveled throughout the ship, fixing it on a molecular level.

We'll just ignore reality where your repairman (bot/droid) is carrying parts to replace the fried/destroyed bits. And can amble outside in the hard radiation. Or mabye the nanobots magic spare matter in as well.

somehow, i can't grasp the idea that after a 25 millenia, wires are still the best things out there, for their cost.

Grasp the idea that a hit from an ion cannon will fuck nanobots and wierd-ass connections six ways to breakfast but only blow some readily replaced fuses. (All worship the mighty fuse!)

another thing i found absent is extensive genetic manipulation of clones. why weren't they made with the strength of a big silverback gorilla (if they were still known about)? or enhanced reflexes? cost maybe? i'm not so sure. we can already splice the genes of fish and plants, and create plants resistant to certain diseases.

Plants don't have exorbiant energy demands. Super muscles, super frames to hold them, even more muscles to drive the frame. Most duper soldiers should realistically depicted gun in one hand, soup spoon in the other.
Anyway's humans (and Rodians, Gungans, things with three eyes) are already bad-ass mother-fuckers. All you really want is a truly BAMF and to clone him off a few hundred thousand times. Oh, they do that.

SW tech is very well refined and built with multiple redundancy and ease of repair built in.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-02-21 02:48am

Robert Walper wrote:
Cpl Kendall wrote:Just because something requires welding doesn't mean it's low tech. Do you know a better way of joing two pieces of metal?
Molecular bonding?

Since metals form special metallic bonds and cooled welds have the same metallic bonding as any other kind of metal, this statement is meaningless.

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SW still has such primitive tech?

SW still has such primitive tech?

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