Republic Assistance Scenario

[Darth Fanboy]

The Galactic Republic and the United Federation of Planets enjoy peaceful relations. Simultaneously, in each galaxy, both the Clone Wars and the Dominion Wars break out. While the Republic is holding its own the Federation is getting reamed, the Republic sends a transmission to their Federation friends saying that while they are sympathetic to their plight they have their own problems to attend to, but they offer Starfleet one of the following:

-4 squadrons of Aetherspites (48 fighters in all) and 2 squadrons of LAAT Gunships (24 in all). The Aetherspites do not come with their Hyperspace docking rings and LAATs aren't hyperspace capable, so the Feds will have to come up with their own way to deliver them into battle. Training material and simulators for both craft will be provided so the Feds can train competent pilots of their own. Parts and materials for replacing these ships will only be enough for one year at the normal rate of wear and tear for these ships but technicial holos and manuals will be provided so that repairs can be made. For the Aetherspites, the Droids being used are only useful for running the gunnery and the navigation of the ship. In other words, removing the droids and trying to tamper with them will do either no good or give only a rudimentary look into how SW AI Works. Once the war is over, the Federation may keep what equipment they have but no tech support or fuel will be given to them.

-An army of approximately 10,000 clones, with a fifty speeder bikes, Ten SPHA-Ts, and ten AT-TEs. The clones will be given the materials to maintain their own vehicles and will follow any orders given to them by Federation commanders so long as it does not compromise their own army or the Republic. Included in these 10,000 clones are six ARC troopers and twelve clone commandos. Enough fuel and ammunition will be provided for two years, but that can be extended an additional six months if it is rationed carefully enough. Starfleet is responsible for feeding the clones. Also, while the republic plans to use one of their Acclamators to deliver the clones, they cannot spare the ship and thus Starfleet will have to transport the clones on their own. Once the Dominion war is completed, the clones will be returned

-A Jedi Master and his Padawan. Skylu Amtat is a capable force user on the level of Obi Wan Kenobi and has extensive military leadership abilities as well. His Padawan, Fanboy, is good in a fight and adept with his lightsaber but of little use otherwise as he is still under instruction. Skylu is the ideal Jedi and does not waver towards the Dark Side, which may bring him into conflict at times with hawkish elements of the UFP. When the war is over, Master Skylu has expressed interest in exploring the Alpha Quadrant

-One Hyperdrive system, to be installed on any ship the UFP wants by Republic technicians, plus enough fuel for one year. No weapons or any other tech, the Hyperdrive outfitted will be the standard civilian hyperdrive for a ship of the size it is being placed on, military capable hyperdrives are all needed. After the war the Federation will be allowed to keep what they have but no tech support or fuel will be given to them.

-Components and parts to construct a working HoloNet system, for instantaneous communication across Fed space. If the Feds can build it with the parts and instructions given then they will be allowed to keep it and do as they please with it.


As the SF representative what would you decide and for what resons? Remember you first and foremost goal is win the war with the Dominion as quickly as possible.

[NecronLord]

While the Republic is holding its own

Major deviation from 'reality' there you know. The CIS was hammering them back throughout the clone wars.

[Alexus]

I'd take the Hypedrive. The Feds could leap anywhere and totally fuck up the Dominion. If they use a Tri-Phasic-Multi-Triaxillated-Pulse-Wave Holocloak they could make the Dominion think threy have more than one hypership.

[Darth Fanboy]

While the Republic is holding its own

Major deviation from 'reality' there you know. The CIS was hammering them back throughout the clone wars.

but not to the point where the Republic couldn't turn them back and eventually win (all part of Palpatine's design, but still), the Feds were kaput without their alliances.

[Darth Fanboy]

addon to above post:

Plus I wanted to craft the scenario so it wasn't another "act of a bored Q"

borrrrring

[NecronLord]

but not to the point where the Republic couldn't turn them back and eventually win

Incorrect.

RotS Spoilers: That Arsehole Gunray turned all the battle droids off. The Republic was on its last legs at that stage.

[18-Till-I-Die]

but not to the point where the Republic couldn't turn them back and eventually win

Incorrect.

RotS Spoilers: That Arsehole Gunray turned all the battle droids off. The Republic was on its last legs at that stage.

Spoily-spoily:

He did what!? God in Heaven that is a stupid fucking frog looking man. Who...wha...why would he turn them off. What reasoning compelled him to do something that boneheaded?

[Ghost Rider]

but not to the point where the Republic couldn't turn them back and eventually win

Incorrect.

RotS Spoilers: That Arsehole Gunray turned all the battle droids off. The Republic was on its last legs at that stage.

Spoily-spoily:

He did what!? God in Heaven that is a stupid fucking frog looking man. Who...wha...why would he turn them off. What reasoning compelled him to do something that boneheaded?

When the big man says so, you don't go.."Nah"

They give why.

[NecronLord]

Spoily-spoily:

He did what!? God in Heaven that is a stupid fucking frog looking man. Who...wha...why would he turn them off. What reasoning compelled him to do something that boneheaded?

Sidious told him to. Part of the reason Dooku had to be eliminated. There was a distinct possibility of Dooku waltzing up to Coruscant again and saying, "General Grevious. Target the chancellor's office, maximum firepower."

[18-Till-I-Die]

Well thats better.

At least they werent stupid enough to turn them off on purpose, i mean i thought like he was like "Oh well we're winning, i just shut down these droids."

[Praxis]

I'd take the Hypedrive. The Feds could leap anywhere and totally fuck up the Dominion. If they use a Tri-Phasic-Multi-Triaxillated-Pulse-Wave Holocloak they could make the Dominion think threy have more than one hypership.

The hyperdrive would be too difficult to put on a ST ship.


I'd take the warships. As long as I get a stock of torpedoes, since one torp can easily take out a small Jem Hadar warship, the fighters can do some SERIOUS damage.

[Alexus]

The hyperdive is installed. That's the POINT.

[Nick Lancaster]

On a quick glance, I don't see anything that would prevent a trade, though I'm not sure what the Federation has to offer the Republic in return. Would a Soong-type android be of interest to the Republic? Holodeck technology? Bars of gold-pressed latinum?

====

Would the Jedi Mind Trick work on a Founder? Or are they significantly different from 'solids' as to make it irrelevant?

While we've been shown just how kick-ass one Jedi can be, what would he do in the Dominion War? Spend his time carving up Jem'Hadar? Use the Force to move phaser-proof crates out of the way during a firefight? (Though certainly, the lightsaber wins in any expression of the melee weapons fetish found in Trek.)

What would the Federation do if they welcomed a Jedi, allowed them to identify and train others ... and then Palpatine's declaration in ROTS hits the airwaves, labelling the Jedi as 'enemies of the Republic'? Would the Federation throw them in the brig? Deport them? Offer asylum?

[Darth Fanboy]

@Necronlord

you forget the part of my post where I admit that it was all part of Palpatine's design.

@Everyone

the point of the scenario is asking which of the above items mentioned would be the most valuable to the FEderation during the Dominion war. THe Republic realizes the Federation has little to offer and isn't expecting anything in return.

[Ra]

Obviously, the Republic ground army would do wonders for the Federation at AR-558, as everyone saw how poorly equipped Federation "soldiers" are. As Feddie commander, I'd use the Clones to maximum effect.
On the other hand, the hyperdrive-equipped vessel would make an excellent hit-and-run weapon against the Dominion. Equip the USS Sovereign or some other high-end starship with the device, and use her for attacks on strategic targets (shipyards, cloning facilities, and Ketracel White labs), using her above-norm firepower to destroy these targets and get out before Dominion forces can react. Load some Aethersprites into the two shuttle bays to take on any defenders (such as Jemmie bug fighters) that react. The problem with this scenario is launching and retreving the Aethersprites quickly enough, because in any hit-and-run scenario, the Captain would want to escape ASAP. Hard to do if you've got a flight or two of Aethersprites trying to dock, and frankly I've never seen a Federation ship receive more than one shuttlecraft at once. These things aren't aircraft carriers.
That's my take
- Ra

[Ra]

EDIT: It's possible the Aethersprites can be transported back, a la Nemesis, but I doubt even the Sovereign's transporters can beam two flights back at once, and Star Wars tech may include something that's not transportable.

[lPeregrine]

-A Jedi Master and his Padawan. Skylu Amtat is a capable force user on the level of Obi Wan Kenobi and has extensive military leadership abilities as well. His Padawan, Fanboy, is good in a fight and adept with his lightsaber but of little use otherwise as he is still under instruction. Skylu is the ideal Jedi and does not waver towards the Dark Side, which may bring him into conflict at times with hawkish elements of the UFP. When the war is over, Master Skylu has expressed interest in exploring the Alpha Quadrant

Pretty much useless. Lack of travel speed means they can't be everywhere, and a single person isn't going to give a huge advantage in a large-scale war.

-One Hyperdrive system, to be installed on any ship the UFP wants by Republic technicians, plus enough fuel for one year. No weapons or any other tech, the Hyperdrive outfitted will be the standard civilian hyperdrive for a ship of the size it is being placed on, military capable hyperdrives are all needed. After the war the Federation will be allowed to keep what they have but no tech support or fuel will be given to them.

Pretty much useless, as no single starfleet ship is going to be able to swing the war. Huge speed advantages matter a lot less when they aren't matched by firepower and durability.

-Components and parts to construct a working HoloNet system, for instantaneous communication across Fed space. If the Feds can build it with the parts and instructions given then they will be allowed to keep it and do as they please with it.

Interesting from a long-term perspective, since it's the only one that will be a benefit once the war is over. Too bad it won't provide any benefit until then, as getting only the parts leaves the problem of installing it in the middle of a war (no intelligence-gathering benefits, for example).

-An army of approximately 10,000 clones, with a fifty speeder bikes, Ten SPHA-Ts, and ten AT-TEs. The clones will be given the materials to maintain their own vehicles and will follow any orders given to them by Federation commanders so long as it does not compromise their own army or the Republic. Included in these 10,000 clones are six ARC troopers and twelve clone commandos. Enough fuel and ammunition will be provided for two years, but that can be extended an additional six months if it is rationed carefully enough. Starfleet is responsible for feeding the clones. Also, while the republic plans to use one of their Acclamators to deliver the clones, they cannot spare the ship and thus Starfleet will have to transport the clones on their own. Once the Dominion war is completed, the clones will be returned

A good option, but a bit overkill. The ground superiority would be nice, but the gunships can handle that. Considering the lack of challenge from their opponents, heavy ground vehicles aren't really worth the price in starship superiority.

-4 squadrons of Aetherspites (48 fighters in all) and 2 squadrons of LAAT Gunships (24 in all). The Aetherspites do not come with their Hyperspace docking rings and LAATs aren't hyperspace capable, so the Feds will have to come up with their own way to deliver them into battle. Training material and simulators for both craft will be provided so the Feds can train competent pilots of their own. Parts and materials for replacing these ships will only be enough for one year at the normal rate of wear and tear for these ships but technicial holos and manuals will be provided so that repairs can be made. For the Aetherspites, the Droids being used are only useful for running the gunnery and the navigation of the ship. In other words, removing the droids and trying to tamper with them will do either no good or give only a rudimentary look into how SW AI Works. Once the war is over, the Federation may keep what equipment they have but no tech support or fuel will be given to them.

The best option, in my opinion. The fighters can swing the space battles where needed, operating from existing federation carriers for FTL transport. 48 god-like fighters means a decisive advantage wherever they're used.

Not only that, but the gunships mean complete ground superiority as well. A strafing run or two by the gunships is going to absolutely devastate anything their enemies can threaten them with. Once that's done, the normal federation troops should be enough to finish the job.

[Solauren]

The Hyperdrive is the most useful.

After all, you can tow ships through Hyperspace.

Strap it onto a Sovereign Class, and have it hyperjump with 10 Akira and 20 Defiants in tow into the middle of a Dominion Shipyard behind all the defenses.

They open up with all weapons until the yard defenses start coming to bare, and then hyperjump out

[Karza]

The Hyperdrive is the most useful.

After all, you can tow ships through Hyperspace.

Strap it onto a Sovereign Class, and have it hyperjump with 10 Akira and 20 Defiants in tow into the middle of a Dominion Shipyard behind all the defenses.

They open up with all weapons until the yard defenses start coming to bare, and then hyperjump out

Eh... Can a single Sov tow that many craft simultaneously?

[Solauren]

The question would be if the Hyperdrive is capable of moving that much mass.

Considering there are civilian ships the size of dreadnaughts, and hell even space tugs can pull/push frieghters that dwarf Galaxy Class Starships.....


Actually, this begs the question for the OP:

Can I trade the 48 Starfighters for 48 SpaceTugs? There smaller then fighters but have reasonally powerful hyperdrives.....

[Stofsk]

-A Jedi Master and his Padawan. Skylu Amtat is a capable force user on the level of Obi Wan Kenobi and has extensive military leadership abilities as well. His Padawan, Fanboy, is good in a fight and adept with his lightsaber but of little use otherwise as he is still under instruction. Skylu is the ideal Jedi and does not waver towards the Dark Side, which may bring him into conflict at times with hawkish elements of the UFP. When the war is over, Master Skylu has expressed interest in exploring the Alpha Quadrant

Pretty much useless. Lack of travel speed means they can't be everywhere, and a single person isn't going to give a huge advantage in a large-scale war.

Sisko prevented the reinforcement fleet from entered the AQ. True, he pulled a Deus Ex Machina from out his spinchter, but that's beside the point. One man can make a difference.

Not convinced? Ok...

Dukat, one man, possessed by a pah-wraith or someshit, unleashed bad juju on the wormhole/temple of the gods... and sealed it up. This would have been bad, had not Sisko countered it with good juju of his own. Getting the picture?

Ok, how about Odo - one man - convincing the Founder to stop the war?

How about...

Quark springing Kira and Rom out of the detention cell so they could sabotage the weapons array? Yeah he had help from Ziyal, so technically it was one man and a girl.

Two men - Sisko and Garak - orchestrating events that lead to the Romulans allying with the Federation?

One changeling - almost - wiping out the entire Bajoran sector and the baby steps of the K-F-R alliance? One changeling impersonating a key Klingon general? One Federation ambassador?

This is all from DS9's Dominion War arc. If you want me to go into the entirety of Star Trek, just buzz me. How about Spock - one man - singlehandedly saving the Enterprise from Kahn's wrath? How about Picard and Kirk - two men - together stopping Soran from wiping out billions of people? One android telling an entire Borg Cube to go to 'sleep'? One emancipated Borg called 'Hugh' somehow 'liberating' other Borg to the point where their dormant individuality rises to the surface to assert itself? One other android coming around and taking control of these same Borg? What about one man trying to cheat destiny by proving to Q that we as a species deserve to exist?

Now all these examples put aside for a moment: I may actually agree with you that the Jedi and his padawan are NOT the best option. That does NOT mean however that they would be totally useless and would have no effect. What if the Jedi Master had something like Battle Meditation, and can give the Federation fleet a combat edge, so even if outnumbered it wouldn't matter because they would be more coordinated and more 'in-synch' with each other than the enemy? What if Fanboy infiltrates Cardassia Prime using Force stealth, finds Damar and lops his head off? Five minutes later Weyoun is a goner. After this he gives a signal, and the K-F-R fleets begin a coordinated strike on multiple angles, the Cardassians cry for strategy - only it's not coming since their principal strategists are now dead (I gave Damar and Weyoun as examples, but replace them with Fleet Admirals or the like and see where that gets you). If the Jedi can find the Founders, then even better.

[lPeregrine]

Yes, single people have done things like that, but a lot of them are due to character shields and fortunate circumstances. As a military leader not an author with full plot knowledge, that's something you can't count on. It's a huge gamble, hoping that the one person would be in the right place at the right time to make a difference, and if they don't beat the odds, you've just wasted your chance at victory.

The other options give much more consistent usefulness. A large group of godlike ships or ground forces are a guaranteed benefit, and far less dependent on precise circumstances to make a difference.

[Stofsk]

It's a huge gamble, hoping that the one person would be in the right place at the right time to make a difference, and if they don't beat the odds, you've just wasted your chance at victory.

Which is why in my projected scenario, Jedi Master Whats-his-face has BM to affect the outcome of the battle. Put him on the Fed flagship, and you've got a good bonus to your entire combat ability. Add Fanboy in as a kind of infiltrator, or leader of a team of commandos, and you can do massive strategic damage with demigods on your side. It doesn't rely on 'plot knowledge' - Jedi Master says "I can increase your fleet's combat performance with my special abilities, experience, and military knowledge." He doesn't NEED a character shield. Fanboy can assist wherever he fits best. I just assumed he would be like a Darth Maul type, but really he could do anything. Again, it's not a question of 'metagame' thinking or what not. Brief him on the situation, he tells SFC what he can do... work from there.

The thing is, I don't see the Aethersprites being godlike in their capability, and I don't see the Clones being a massive boost either. Sure they would have won AR-90210, but but that won't matter anyway once the Breen show up. As for the Aethersprites, there's only 48 of them, and no way to replace them. And the fuel/supplies only last for a year, under 'normal' wear and tear. Battle attrition can not only decrease the number of fighters you have, but also the endurance of the remainder. If they're all stuck on one GCS, which goes up... then that's all your eggs in one basket. If they're spread out... then they can't concentrate their firepower effectively...

There's also long term goals in mind here... maybe the Hyperdrive is the best because if the war is won anyway the UFP will have a tech that can propel them beyond what any of their enemies can match. Ditto goes for the holonet. The holonet will give fast sensors and communications, faster than anything the Feds have got now. Since intelligence is crucial to a war effort this could be the best option. Intercept Dominion comms, detect a large fleet heading for target x... you don't need to set it up all across the Federation, not right away... just on the frontlines. That's enough to get the benefits for intelligence-gathering.

I just don't think it's as cut and dried as you think.

[Praxis]

Dukat, one man, possessed by a pah-wraith or someshit, unleashed bad juju on the wormhole/temple of the gods... and sealed it up. This would have been bad, had not Sisko countered it with good juju of his own. Getting the picture?

Ok, how about Odo - one man - convincing the Founder to stop the war?

How about...

Quark springing Kira and Rom out of the detention cell so they could sabotage the weapons array? Yeah he had help from Ziyal, so technically it was one man and a girl.

Two men - Sisko and Garak - orchestrating events that lead to the Romulans allying with the Federation?

One changeling - almost - wiping out the entire Bajoran sector and the baby steps of the K-F-R alliance? One changeling impersonating a key Klingon general? One Federation ambassador?

This is all from DS9's Dominion War arc.

And by the time we have all these "one man" things, it actually took two dozen people to win the war

[Darth Fanboy]

Actually, this begs the question for the OP:

Can I trade the 48 Starfighters for 48 SpaceTugs? There smaller then fighters but have reasonally powerful hyperdrives.....

No, the point of that selection was to remove hyperdrive from teh equation otherwise I would have given the Aetherspites their hyperdrive rings.