Why didn't the Alliance use Battledroids?

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2005-05-01 08:05pm

We've seen that a single well maintained foundry can build a virtual army of battledroids. The Alliance obviously has some manufacturing capabilties (X-wings, B-Wings, Mon Cals) so why not set up a droid foundry somewhere out on the Rim or similarly out of the way place and start pumping out droids?

Even if the rebels don't have the funds or resources to field armies think of the chaos they could create with some suicide battallions of droids striking at Imperial targets throughout the galaxy. Some of their manpower issued could be quickly solved with droid crewmen and foot soldiers. Think of the higher securoty of Alliance HQ if the vast majority of ground troops were battledriods instead of humans. Imagine how the storming of the Tantive IV would have gone with a few Droidekas or Super battle droids to buy more time, the Battle of Hoth with an entire battledroid division added to the Alliance troops there, etc.

So what are the reasons for not using battledroids?

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-01 08:09pm

It'd be painting themselves with a sign saying "make unfavorable propaganda about me more credible". Separatist stigma, I'd say. It was battle droid armies that had cut a swath through the galaxy killing billions in the Clone Wars.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2005-05-01 08:14pm

Vympel wrote:It'd be painting themselves with a sign saying "make unfavorable propaganda about me more credible". Separatist stigma, I'd say. It was battle droid armies that had cut a swath through the galaxy killing billions in the Clone Wars.

Do we have any evidence (ROTS Spoilers aside please) that the Clone Wars killed any civilians in huge numbers? I get the impression the cost of the wars was carried by the clones and battledroids. Palpy could have taken a big popularity bounce if he limited casulaties to clones - essentially making it a bloodless war for the Republic civilians and making it easier for him to seize power because he kept things bloodless for the civies. This is of course sheer speculation on my part.

Jim Raynor · Post by **Jim Raynor** » 2005-05-01 08:19pm

Isn't there a lot of prejudice against droids in the SW galaxy? The cantina in ANH even had a droid detector installed at the entrance, and the bartender said "We don't serve their kind here." I think a lot of people could be distrustful of droids after the Clone Wars. Bad publicity would be very bad for a rebel group that's seeking legitimacy, and often portrayed as terrorists by Imperial propaganda.

The Original Nex · Post by **The Original Nex** » 2005-05-01 08:22pm

Using droid forces would still be immensely unpopular and certainly would cause any prospective rebel recruits to think twice before joining. I highly doubt the Rebellion wanted to be at all associated with the old CIS. Given that they already had minute ammounts of support in the masses of loyal Imperials, to use droids would simply open the window for further Imperial propaganda against them. It's bad PR.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-01 08:28pm

Do we have any evidence (ROTS Spoilers aside please) that the Clone Wars killed any civilians in huge numbers? I get the impression the cost of the wars was carried by the clones and battledroids. Palpy could have taken a big popularity bounce if he limited casulaties to clones - essentially making it a bloodless war for the Republic civilians and making it easier for him to seize power because he kept things bloodless for the civies. This is of course sheer speculation on my part.

I just won't say anything.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-05-01 09:40pm

How about a statement from the novel and ROTS ICS that has nothing to do with the plot of the movie, and is just part of the description of a secondary character?

Here it goes: Grievous is said to have slaughtered billions and conducted multiple BDZs.

Pretty good reason for a stigma.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2005-05-02 02:51am

Didn't Lando and Wedge jump into giant droids in Dark Empire II and attack the empire on the ground?

The other thought that occurs, is that the Rebellion as depicted in the OT is a guerilla organisation with an assymetrical fleet (heh, thanks Kaz for that term. I'm not sure I'm using it the right way though). So... why do they need a massive land army when they don't have 'thousands of systems yearning to separate' from the big bad empire?

Besides, I fully expect the Rebels to have battledroids anyway, just not in the 'lets invade this world' fashion. More like 'we need to guard our bases, so lets use droids'. If anything I'd think the Empire could live without droids while the Rebellion DEPENDS on them. The Empire's frontline starfighter, the TIE, in fact every TIE model except the TIE Droid one, is manned without an astromech. Meanwhile, the Rebellion's most famous starfighter - the X-wing - needs a droid copilot. The X-wing's replacement, the E-wing, not only needs an astromech, but it needs a top-of-the-line R7 series astromech.

The Empire has battledroids, but they're just disposable warriors. Same as the stormtroopers. They can afford it. The Rebels can't - they have to pick their battles carefully because they're fighting an assymetrical war. Even battledroids cost money. Money that could have been used to buy another proton torpedo for the x-wing hit-and-fade strike against that crucial Imperial convoy.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-02 03:10am

Stofsk wrote:Didn't Lando and Wedge jump into giant droids in Dark Empire II and attack the empire on the ground?

Those were Imperial (or a faction thereof, I'm not at home so I can't check) War Droids- post Endor, to boot.

wautd · Post by **wautd** » 2005-05-02 03:50am

Maybe the Rebellion simply lacks the recources to churn out a massive droid army.

Post by **Gandalf** » 2005-05-02 04:01am

wautd wrote:Maybe the Rebellion simply lacks the recources to churn out a massive droid army.

Given that there were whole planets openly supporting the Rebellion, I couldn't see it being too farfetched that a Planetary Governor might set aside a factory or two.

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2005-05-02 04:04am

Gandalf wrote:
wautd wrote:Maybe the Rebellion simply lacks the recources to churn out a massive droid army.
Given that there were whole planets openly supporting the Rebellion, I couldn't see it being too farfetched that a Planetary Governor might set aside a factory or two.

Well since Alderaan, the famous hotbed of Imperial discontent and arms supplier to the rebellion, had its planetary mass spread out over space might put a dampener on that idea.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-05-02 05:07am

Well since Alderaan, the famous hotbed of Imperial discontent and arms supplier to the rebellion, had its planetary mass spread out over space might put a dampener on that idea.

And yet, the subsequent destruction of the DS might open up the possibility again. It´s a big galaxy, if Lucas Licensing want to add droids to a story, they can do it.

Murazor · Post by **Murazor** » 2005-05-02 05:44am

Ender wrote: IIRC, Grievous is stated to have conducted the BDZ of one of the funding worlds of the Republic (Humberine, or something like that).

You mean the one hour BDZ?

Spartan · Post by **Spartan** » 2005-05-02 09:28am

You mean the one hour BDZ?

The time frame was stated to one hour long. ROTS:ICS states that Humbarine was a city planet , and that it was depopulated and its crust melted! AOTC:ICS states that Humbarine was a rich industrialized sector, with a defensive fleet comparable to Kuat and Corellia.

So, one would have to guess that the fleet was away for some reason, possibly decoyed away from the planet. In the mean time Grevious' fleet burnt off the planet, undoubtedly at the cost of trillions.

Post by **Kuja** » 2005-05-02 01:27pm

Stravo wrote:Do we have any evidence (ROTS Spoilers aside please) that the Clone Wars killed any civilians in huge numbers? I get the impression the cost of the wars was carried by the clones and battledroids. Palpy could have taken a big popularity bounce if he limited casulaties to clones - essentially making it a bloodless war for the Republic civilians and making it easier for him to seize power because he kept things bloodless for the civies. This is of course sheer speculation on my part.

IIRC, the novel Courtship of Princess Leia mentions entire worlds being depopulated by the Clone Wars.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2005-05-03 09:04am

The Rebels might also lack the logistical tail to keep droid armies on the field. Creatures may require a vast array of neccesities and creature comforts, but these are relatively low tech and easily obtained on the civilian market and etc etc. However, a droid army logistical tail like power droids, oil bath, change in spare parts, maintenance issues etc etc etc might had been prohibitive to a guerilla organisation.

Certainly, we learned that the Rebels were not above using droid traps to sabotage Imperial installations.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-03 10:15am

I think that's kind of stupid, considering they operated guerilla cells from the HQ of a single Mon Calamari warship, unsupported, out in the middle of nowhere.

Cykeisme · Post by **Cykeisme** » 2005-05-04 06:19am

Perhaps battle droids make for poor commandos in the kind of guerilla warfare the Rebellion engaged in?
The Separatists fielded droids in massive armies that engaged in direct combat, using the weight of numbers gleaned from the industrial and financial capabilities of its constituent business alliances, whereas the Alliance was mostly small-unit commando stuff.
I mean, if clones were superior to droids even when the clones are outnumbered (the oft-touted clones' supposed edge in creativity that is never actually demonstrated

), how would droids fair against superior numbers of clones?

If I'm wrong about that, feel free to point it out.. didn't really think all that through.

Mark S · Post by **Mark S** » 2005-05-07 07:10pm

Perhaps droid armies are just not practical for the rebellion. To have anything more than limited intelligence you need to keep them in line with a control ship which would be an easy target. Without that control you either need to maintain regularly scheduled memory wipes or risk the droids eventually developing personalities and opinions and deciding they don't want to fight your war for you. A rag-tag rebellion could get away with a few battledroids here and there but I don't think they could field large numbers.

Even if the above isn't true, large numbers of droid soldiers also make it easier for enemy spies to reprogram large numbers of your soldiers to turn against you.

irishmick79 · Post by **irishmick79** » 2005-05-07 08:16pm

I imagine a lot of the producers of battle droids were allied with Sidious, and probably were either shut down by the Empire after Sidious had the coming out party, or did business with the new government. THey probably would have given the alliance the cold shoulder or happily turned them into the empire whenever alliance operatives showed up to make a deal.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2005-05-07 08:41pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote:I think that's kind of stupid, considering they operated guerilla cells from the HQ of a single Mon Calamari warship, unsupported, out in the middle of nowhere.

The supplies a creature based guerilla cell require may have been less obvious and more easily acquired through legal or black market channels than those required for a droid army.

Actually, its almost a certainty that they are.