The Official Episode III spoiler thread

Firefox · Post by **Firefox** » 2005-05-12 01:19am

Assuming that's a real shot and not simply a concept art backdrop (guessing the former), it could lend credence to Saxton's Great Weapon hypothesis, or it's a DSP.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-05-12 01:28am

VT-16 wrote:According to some interview, most of the Coruscant/Rebellion stuff. And it will be on the DVD (as cut-scenes).

Shit. Some of us actually want to see the first stages of the Alliance...

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-12 01:37am

Bah, its in the novel. If it slows down the movie it should be cut without mercy. The Rebellion is already known to start with Bail Organa and Co, so it doesn't matter. Mon Mothma has been cut, IIRC.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-05-12 01:51am

Good point. Blame it on the continuity fairy whispering in my ear at night...

Pcm979 · Post by **Pcm979** » 2005-05-12 06:49am

Hrm. Skinny Vader doesn't float my boat.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-05-12 08:56am

JME2 wrote:
VT-16 wrote:According to some interview, most of the Coruscant/Rebellion stuff. And it will be on the DVD (as cut-scenes).
Shit. Some of us actually want to see the first stages of the Alliance...

There's always the possibility that a few scenes could be reincorporated back into the film for the DVD, such as what was done with TPM and a lesser extent, with AotC.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-12 06:51pm

Yes! Its not the same model as the ANH Death Star.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-12 07:23pm

How can you tell? We don't even know if that picture is even accurate to the film- nor is it necessary that it need begin the same as the Death Star- they might have redesigned it mid-way through construction- which would also go a long way to explaining why the DS took longer than the DS2.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-12 07:27pm

Vympel wrote:How can you tell? We don't even know if that picture is even accurate to the film- nor is it necessary that it need begin the same as the Death Star- they might have redesigned it mid-way through construction- which would also go a long way to explaining why the DS took longer than the DS2.

Vymp, why are you hoping against me? In spite of all our excuses, we all know the Death Star being started in ROTS is stupid. Let's be honest.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-05-12 07:45pm

I still think that it's just the prototype that the CIS was constructing prior to Coruscant and that once completed, then the ANH DS construction begins. True, this means that most of Darksaber has to be retconned (but since it is KJA we're talking about, I don't think many here will shed tears...

)

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-12 07:48pm

JME2 wrote:I still think that it's just the prototype that the CIS was constructing prior to Coruscant and that once completed, then the ANH DS construction begins. True, this means that most of Darksaber has to be retconned (but since it is KJA we're talking about, I don't think many here will shed tears... )

It makes no sense if its completed - than why didn't they use it?

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-12 07:55pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote: Vymp, why are you hoping against me? In spite of all our excuses, we all know the Death Star being started in ROTS is stupid. Let's be honest.

It makes little sense in light of the larger, more powerful DS2 being more than half complete (visually) (the novel says half complete) when it couldn't have taken more than 3 years to build at absolute maximum. However, I'm concerned with preserving what Lucas' obviously wanted, so we have to invent rationalizations for it taking that much longer than the DS2. Saying it's not really what its intended to be just feels wrong.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-12 08:07pm

Vympel wrote:However, I'm concerned with preserving what Lucas' obviously wanted,

Why, for God's sake why? Lucas thinks up all sorts of funky dumbshit. Not to mention he's demonstrably a brazen liar. Like his "everybody is a clone and there are 1.2 million of them." How about, "Generals lead from THE front line with their second-in-command." And how could we leave off "capital ship crewmen must wear field battle armor." Lucas is clearly clueless. I really don't care what he thinks beyond what he explicitly injects into the published canon. He has a lot of bad ideas, and I think people would agree that sometimes its better for the cohension and quality of the SW Saga in itself is GL leaves it alone and shuts up.

Vympel wrote:so we have to invent rationalizations for it taking that much longer than the DS2. Saying it's not really what its intended to be just feels wrong.

Meh, its visually incogruent. The writers for that one Trek episode with the orbital bombardment clearly intended for crust scouring but they ass fucked the visuals. Oh well, so sad.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-12 09:26pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote: Why, for God's sake why? Lucas thinks up all sorts of funky dumbshit.

Irrespective of our opinions of some of his plot developments, its still his story, he's the creator, and he will not be restricted in any way.

Not to mention he's demonstrably a brazen liar.

We all know about the "I always intended" crap. That has nothing to do with it.

Like his "everybody is a clone and there are 1.2 million of them."

He never said there were only 1.2 million individual clones. That's a stupid EU invention, and we both know what happened to it.. It was Lucas, for example, who revealed the Empire was 1,000,000 systems. He wrote that. One can imagine the stupid shit from the EU we'd be subjected to otherwise.

How about, "Generals lead from THE front line with their second-in-command."

It's been done in history before, this is not a big deal.

And how could we leave off "capital ship crewmen must wear field battle armor." Lucas is clearly clueless.

So? Just because we don't like it, that means what? He's still the creator, and its still his universe. Besides, there are rationalizations for that as well.

I really don't care what he thinks beyond what he explicitly injects into the published canon. He has a lot of bad ideas, and I think people would agree that sometimes its better for the cohension and quality of the SW Saga in itself is GL leaves it alone and shuts up.

Declaring George Lucas to be not competent to run his own saga and riding rough-shod over his clear stated intent is just too far for me. And why? Because of a 20 year time period for building the Death Star? It's not a big deal. There are very good reasons why it would take longer, and they've been mooted before.

Meh, its visually incogruent. The writers for that one Trek episode with the orbital bombardment clearly intended for crust scouring but they ass fucked the visuals. Oh well, so sad.

We'll have to wait for the film to make a final determination.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-12 10:02pm

Vympel wrote:Irrespective of our opinions of some of his plot developments, its still his story, he's the creator, and he will not be restricted in any way.

His off-screen comments are not the same thing as published canon. Would Luke's lightsaber in ROTJ be red if Lucas said so tomorrow? SoD.

Vympel wrote:
How about, "Generals lead from THE front line with their second-in-command."
It's been done in history before, this is not a big deal.

Oh please. Like it makes a lot of sense or logic in SW level warfare?

Vympel wrote:
And how could we leave off "capital ship crewmen must wear field battle armor." Lucas is clearly clueless.
So? Just because we don't like it, that means what? He's still the creator, and its still his universe. Besides, there are rationalizations for that as well.

It means his intent should not be carried against visual contradiction with it.

Vympel wrote:Declaring George Lucas to be not competent to run his own saga and riding rough-shod over his clear stated intent is just too far for me. And why? Because of a 20 year time period for building the Death Star? It's not a big deal. There are very good reasons why it would take longer, and they've been mooted before.

If that image is from the film, than the ROTS Death Star is not the same spaceframe as the ANH Death Star. It is physically impossible.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-12 10:35pm

Illuminatus Primus wrote: His off-screen comments are not the same thing as published canon. Would Luke's lightsaber in ROTJ be red if Lucas said so tomorrow? SoD.

No, it wouldn't be. That doesn't mean that the Death Star isn't the Death Star, especially from such a poor-quality shot that may not be from the film at all.

Oh please. Like it makes a lot of sense or logic in SW level warfare?

The ground combat we've seen in SW level warfare is not incredibly more complicated than say, the level of warfare seen in WW2, when Erwin Rommel would sit within range of enemy tanks and watch his Flak 88s blow them to bits. Yoda in the forward command post is a good example.

It means his intent should not be carried against visual contradiction with it.

If there is a contradiction, we should salvage as much of the intent as possible, as I did above. Its yet another good reason for why construction took that much longer. Others include the Imperial Senate, it being the first series production model, etc etc.

If that image is from the film, than the ROTS Death Star is not the same spaceframe as the ANH Death Star. It is physically impossible.

I guess we'll see.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-05-13 04:16am

Lucas is all about connecting to the OT with this, even if it´s not the same DS or star destroyers we´re used to, it does connect the two trilogies and foreshadow the events in ANH, which is all that was needed, anyway.

Even if Lucas says it was the DS, it still wouldn´t matter if the construction didn´t look like it. He ultimately achieved his goal of connecting the eras, and that´s what mattered.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-05-13 10:28am

IP, please expound on the differences b/t the 2 death stars then, that pic doesn't come in in high enough resolution for me to see anything.

Firefox · Post by **Firefox** » 2005-05-13 01:21pm

The SL dish looks too small for the size of the thing, unless as VT suggested, the outer hull may not be installed.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-05-14 01:35am

new tv ads up, brothers shows a shot of what might be alderaan.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2005-05-14 01:40am

Ender wrote:new tv ads up, brothers shows a shot of what might be alderaan.

That's what I thought to. If so, not too bad; I like. Too bad it's status as a possible retirement location is, how shall we say, no longer possible...

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-05-14 04:42am

In the seven minute clip from C III, they showed several shots of Alderaan´s surface. It was mainly the Tantive IV flying towards a castle in the distance, with a beautiful sunset behind it (the castle). It was in the midst of a mountain-range and really gave me a LOTR-feeling. The second shot is of the Tantive about to touch down on a platform, behind it you could see several traffic-lanes alá Coruscant. It looked very atmospheric.

Post by **Vympel** » 2005-05-14 01:18pm

A full version of the arrest scene (right up to the part where Palpatine reveals his lightsabre) was played on David Letterman (SL Jackson interview). It's since been put up on MF.com. It's very cool. Ian McDiarmid rocks.

"I AM the Senate!"

"Not yet."

El Moose Monstero · Post by **El Moose Monstero** » 2005-05-14 01:36pm

Vympel wrote:A full version of the arrest scene (right up to the part where Palpatine reveals his lightsabre) was played on David Letterman (SL Jackson interview). It's since been put up on MF.com. It's very cool. Ian McDiarmid rocks.

"I AM the Senate!"

"Not yet."

I dunno, I thought it could have done with less of the 'i'll put on a big scary voice to show that I'm evil'. A softer confident tone might have been better, this one just sounds like he's feeling threatened and is responding with tough talk.

Manus Celer Dei · Post by **Manus Celer Dei** » 2005-05-14 01:56pm

The way his robe moves is simply incredible.