Split from ROTS Revelations

[The Original Nex]

portable/ disposable mini chambers.
each bold shot uses up all the fuel which is then disposed of.
they are clearly not ptorps.

Why would these guns need to do this and not other guns? Why would the guns not be hooked up to the ship's central "fuel" as you call it? Would that not be more efficient than one shot canisters?

And again, you seem to think that I said they're Proton Torps when I NEVER did.

[Alan Bolte]

I find it interesting that the guns in question can be seen in the trailer to produce some sort of flash in one frame, have nothing visible traveling from them in the next frame, and then have a red bolt midway between the ships in the third.

[ali-sama]

portable/ disposable mini chambers.
each bold shot uses up all the fuel which is then disposed of.
they are clearly not ptorps.

Why would these guns need to do this and not other guns? Why would the guns not be hooked up to the ship's central "fuel" as you call it? Would that not be more efficient than one shot canisters?

And again, you seem to think that I said they're Proton Torps when I NEVER did.

the thing is armed with tl, quad lasers, lasers and torpedos. take your pick.

[Crazedwraith]

The Invisble Hand doesn't use Magnetic Containment fields in it's hangers like the OT ships. It had a forcefield that wouldn't let ships through.

[The Original Nex]

the thing is armed with tl, quad lasers, lasers and torpedos. take your pick.

So rather than offer up a solution you simply reiterate what the ICS says?

If I had to pick I'd say torps, because there's not way those are energy beams.

But there's also the possiblity that the ICS left something out. It's not infallible.

[The Original Nex]

The Invisble Hand doesn't use Magnetic Containment fields in it's hangers like the OT ships. It had a forcefield that wouldn't let ships through.

Don't most ships have that? An Atmosphere Containment Field coupled with Deflector Shields?

[VT-16]

I assume he was either to ashamed to even dare go, or he was being nagged by Palps to "go see their new-found treasure".

[Spanky The Dolphin]

It's rather simple: at that point Anakin Skywalker had already been destroyed. The only man remaining was Darth Vader.

Additionally, I think that was the state funeral seen.

[Crazedwraith]

The Invisble Hand doesn't use Magnetic Containment fields in it's hangers like the OT ships. It had a forcefield that wouldn't let ships through.

Don't most ships have that? An Atmosphere Containment Field coupled with Deflector Shields?

Most ships have mag-con fields that keep air in but let ships through. I don't recall any vessels having deflector shields over their hanger specifically. They just shield the whole thing

[The Original Nex]

The Invisble Hand doesn't use Magnetic Containment fields in it's hangers like the OT ships. It had a forcefield that wouldn't let ships through.

Don't most ships have that? An Atmosphere Containment Field coupled with Deflector Shields?

Most ships have mag-con fields that keep air in but let ships through. I don't recall any vessels having deflector shields over their hanger specifically. They just shield the whole thing

That has been the assumption, but has it ever been confirmed?

In ANH after the MF has docked in the DS, an announcement over the Comm says something to the effect of "We are closing all outboard shields" which would suggest that they had to open them in order to let the Falcon in. Clearly these are not the same as the Atmospheric Containment Shields as those remained unchanged, but they may both be generated from the same area on the ship.

[ali-sama]

the thing is armed with tl, quad lasers, lasers and torpedos. take your pick.

So rather than offer up a solution you simply reiterate what the ICS says?

If I had to pick I'd say torps, because there's not way those are energy beams.

But there's also the possiblity that the ICS left something out. It's not infallible.

i alredy gave a solotuin. their portable one shot reactors. makes sence. you can place the guns anywhere. no need to add power lines. just mount the gun and use the shells. why would the torpedo even need cashings. i am quoting the site btw
ali

[The Original Nex]

the thing is armed with tl, quad lasers, lasers and torpedos. take your pick.

So rather than offer up a solution you simply reiterate what the ICS says?

If I had to pick I'd say torps, because there's not way those are energy beams.

But there's also the possiblity that the ICS left something out. It's not infallible.

i alredy gave a solotuin. their portable one shot reactors. makes sence. you can place the guns anywhere. no need to add power lines. just mount the gun and use the shells. why would the torpedo even need cashings. i am quoting the site btw
ali

Place them anywhere? How many different places on a ship can move guns to? They have a few gun ports for the guns and that's the only place you can put them. You'd still need power lines to connect them to the Main Reactor. And you can see the "shell" feed going from the guns and into the ceiling where the "shells" would be kept. All in all, they wouldn't make very efficient portable guns. And the whole idea of portable guns in this case is idiotic as it is.

why would the torpedo even need cashings.

Once again, I never said they were Torpedos, I said that, given only the weapons mentioned by the ICS, Torps are the only projectiles in the bunch, therefore, the only logical fit, however, the ICS (as I said) is not infallible and could have easily left something out.

i am quoting the site btw

What site? This site? Be more specific.

[ali-sama]

Place them anywhere? How many different places on a ship can move guns to? They have a few gun ports for the guns and that's the only place you can put them. You'd still need power lines to connect them to the Main Reactor. And you can see the "shell" feed going from the guns and into the ceiling where the "shells" would be kept. All in all, they wouldn't make very efficient portable guns. And the whole idea of portable guns in this case is idiotic as it is.

lets say they are less reliant ona central power reactor which coudl go criticla via feedback loop..

why would the torpedo even need cashings.

Once again, I never said they were Torpedos, I said that, given only the weapons mentioned by the ICS, Torps are the only projectiles in the bunch, therefore, the only logical fit, however, the ICS (as I said) is not infallible and could have easily left something out.

A modern torpedo, historically called a self propelled torpedo, is a self-propelled guided projectile that (after being launched above or below the water surface) operates underwater and is designed to detonate on contact or in proximity to a target. Torpedoes are weapons that may be launched from submarines, surface ships, helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft, and from unmanned naval mines.

if that had been a casing for a projectile. this would be really bad. as it would say that ke wepaons can and do dammage to hulls/shileds. enouigh that they woudl use them prominantly.

i am quoting the site btw

What site? This site? Be more specific.

sw.com what ekse.

[Admiral_K]

Then why wouldn't she have asked "What do you mean, my real mother" or something?
The fact remains that Luke stressed that he was asking about her real mother, and Leia answered that question with it's special emphasis without batting an eye.

How can this not show that she understood exactly what he was talking about?

If you want to pick apart semantics, I could point to the fact that luke said "Do you remember our real mother?".

The reason he didn't is because he hadn't revealed at the time that Leia was his sister, therefore she would still believe that Bail Organa's wife was her mother. If Bail's wife died at a young age, and he remarried, or Leia was raised by nannys etc.

Lucas may have originally intended for Leia to be remembering their actual mother, but I think at the time he was also intending for her to have lived with leia for a short time before dieing. However, given the scenario that actually went down, the most logical explanation is she is referring to Bail's Wife. I'd find that highly more likely than her somehow remembering a mother who was alive for about 10 minutes after she was born.

That involves adding speculation that does not jibe with the storyline.
If she was remembering her adoptive mother, and if she ignored, or was ignorant of, the implication of "your real mother", then that makes the entire exchange between Luke and Leia nonsensical.

Thanks to Lucas' bungling, we're left with yet another inconsistancy to interpret.
Given the information we have; Leia being a Force sensitive she must somehow have fragmented memories from birth of Padme.
This does not require added speculation involving nannies or the Organas, and it fits the dialogue.

We've seen no evidence that the force does anything to allow infants the ability to remember things they could not. You are also assuming that Leia was told she was adopted when we don't know if she was or not.

Further, you don't know if leia's "memories" are real memories, or imagined ones based on what she thinks her mother was like. Given the fact that a newborn infant would have memories shortly after her birth is unprecidented, you'd have to question her memory force or no force.

At any rate, my original point in this was to dispell the notion that Leia somehow was more "force sensitive" than luke because she claimed she remembered her mother.

[Lord Revan]

BTW what's up with the six sublight drives in the Eta-2 hyperspace ring.

[The Original Nex]

lets say they are less reliant ona central power reactor which coudl go criticla via feedback loop..

So give the whole gun bank a subsidiery reactor. That makes more sense than a one shot "mini-reactor" you're proposing.

A modern torpedo, historically called a self propelled torpedo, is a self-propelled guided projectile that (after being launched above or below the water surface) operates underwater and is designed to detonate on contact or in proximity to a target. Torpedoes are weapons that may be launched from submarines, surface ships, helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft, and from unmanned naval mines.

if that had been a casing for a projectile. this would be really bad. as it would say that ke wepaons can and do dammage to hulls/shileds. enouigh that they woudl use them prominantly.

The shields on that Star Destroyer were clearly failing, if not gone in most areas. Again, these weapons needed necesarily be torps, but they aren't turbolasers either.

sw.com what ekse.

Hmmmm, I don't know, maybe one of the many other SW sites out there. . .

I'd appreciate a quote or link to the relevent information rather than just your say-so.

[Frank Hipper]

We've seen no evidence that the force does anything to allow infants the ability to remember things they could not. You are also assuming that Leia was told she was adopted when we don't know if she was or not.

I'm unaware if the Force affects memory at all; but something must explain this turd of a problem Lucas has lain at our feet. I think the way that does it while incoporating on-screen evidence and the least additional specualtion is best.
We know Padme died on the delivery table, we know most humans don't have much in the way of memory before age 3 or 4, we know Leia admits to having memories of her mother, we know that Leia is Force sensitve.

As to adoption, she answers a question about her "real mother" without reacting to it, if she didn't know by the time of ROTJ that she'd been adopted, how could she be so blase about such a revelation?

Further, you don't know if leia's "memories" are real memories, or imagined ones based on what she thinks her mother was like. Given the fact that a newborn infant would have memories shortly after her birth is unprecidented, you'd have to question her memory force or no force.

What we do know is that Leia candidly revealed that her memories were vague impressions; the fact that she admitted that she has memories of her mother immediately after birth must be reconciled with what we have to go on.

At any rate, my original point in this was to dispell the notion that Leia somehow was more "force sensitive" than luke because she claimed she remembered her mother.

Leia being more Force sensitive than Luke is not something that I ever implied. Luke could have forgotten, never gotten an impression of Padme, or got knocked on the head as a child and forgotten.
Be that as it may, what stands is that a pivotal sequence in ROTJ contains an admission by Luke that he has no memory of his mother, and Leia's own admission that she does.

[Shroom Man 777]

Leia could've just been bullshitting, thinking that she indeed remembered being with her mom while actually recalling old pictures she saw when she was very young.

[Oskuro]

An alternate hypothesis on the Leia memory debate could be that Leia had precognitive visions of her mother, much like Anakin had precognitive visions of both Padme and Shmi dying. (Ok, it would actually be "postcognitive")

She could have had these "dreams" while an infant too, so the "newborns don't have memory, or eyesight for that matter" issue wouldn't matter...

Or maybe it was Qui Gon showing up as a ghost and poking little Leia saying "Guess who was your father?". Of course, since Leia was too busy afterwards being too much like Padme (Senate duty and all), he probably gave up and went on to pull Luke's curiosity away from Bantha herding and on to piloting ships and thinking of getting out away from Tatooine.

Yes, that last part wasn't serious.

[FTeik]

Obi-Wan defeating Anakin.

Obi-Wan has the high ground, so that is already bad.

Anakin can't simply jump to the shore because - as we discover a little later - the ground isn't solid and because of the danger of getting barbequed because it is so close to the magma. Anakin has also to look out, that Obi-Wan doesn't use a force-push while he jumps sending him into the lava, explaining him jumping low enough to get his arm and legs cut of by Obi-Wan.

[hypnosifl]

A small technical thing--in A New Hope, it was said that since the thermal exhaust port on the Death Star was "ray-shielded", they would have to use proton torpedoes. This seemed to imply that "ray shields" block energy weapons but not solid objects (also, it's hard to see how thermal exhaust could escape if the shields blocked massive particles). But in RotS, Obi-Wan and Anakin are trapped in a force-field while aboard General Grevious' ship, and it is referred to as "ray shields":

60 INT. BRIDGE-TRADE FEDERATION CRUISER

BODYGUARD: General, we found the Jedi. They're in hallway 328.

GENERAL GRIEVOUS: Activate ray shields.

61 INT. HALLWAY-TRADE FEDERATION CRUISER

They run down the hallway. Suddenly, ray shields drop around them, putting them in an electronic box in the middle of the hallway.

ANAKIN: Ray shields!

So it seems that at least some types of "ray shields" can block matter (perhaps the proton torpedoes and thermal exhaust could only get through because of their high velocity?)

[Firefox]

No, matter can pass through the shields, it just can't be unprotected living matter.

[Lord Revan]

snip

ray shields cause heat interaction with objects passin thru them (for torp or ship this is not problem, but it would burn a human alive)

[Imperial Overlord]

To clarify, they can go through the ray shields if they don't mind being fried.

[hypnosifl]

OK, thanks, that explains it. What's the source for that info?