NJO Worth Picking up?

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-05-30 09:29pm

Stravo wrote:One thing that would big the shit out of me is if Luke is completely wussified in this series. In my opinion Luke should be a fucking Force using monster by this point. His worries about falling to the Darkside should be behind him as he has faced the ultimate test in ROTJ.

Well he comes and goes. He attacks a bunch of Vong warriors before anyone else had fought many and with two lightsabers and a whirlwind of Force-proppelled rocks, savages a half dozen warriors all armed with amphistaffs and lightsaber-resistant armor. But after this short burst, he's almost to total exhaustion and has to lean on his nephew.

In Star by Star his piloting expertise is up with Anakin circa ROTS. Its in the final book he finally cuts loose and turns into a real monster.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-05-30 09:42pm

Stravo wrote: One thing that would big the shit out of me is if Luke is completely wussified in this series. In my opinion Luke should be a fucking Force using monster by this point. His worries about falling to the Darkside should be behind him as he has faced the ultimate test in ROTJ.

He is until the end, when he finally figures out (thanks to Vergere and Jacen) that he WON'T automatically become evil if he stops a bunch of genocidal mass murderers from killing people then goes on a rampage through Vongified Coruscant murdering Vong.

The final battle is just awesome. Despite being attacked by force resistant, genetically modified Vong soldiers far stronger than normal ones, and being in a room in a building swaying side to side as an entire army is assualting it, he utterly mops the floor with his opponents even killing a few outright with just the force.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2005-05-30 09:52pm

Praxis wrote:
Stravo wrote: One thing that would big the shit out of me is if Luke is completely wussified in this series. In my opinion Luke should be a fucking Force using monster by this point. His worries about falling to the Darkside should be behind him as he has faced the ultimate test in ROTJ.
He is until the end, when he finally figures out (thanks to Vergere and Jacen) that he WON'T automatically become evil if he stops a bunch of genocidal mass murderers from killing people then goes on a rampage through Vongified Coruscant murdering Vong.

The final battle is just awesome. Despite being attacked by force resistant, genetically modified Vong soldiers far stronger than normal ones, and being in a room in a building swaying side to side as an entire army is assualting it, he utterly mops the floor with his opponents even killing a few outright with just the force.

Now that description is precisely what I'm talking about. So essentially I have to wade through an entire series to see Luke kick ass? Hmmmm....that sucks.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-05-30 10:37pm

Luke also has a few moments earlier in the series, although they're usually as a pilot. There is one instance where he uses the force to make a Vong ground combat carrier eat itself with its own singularity.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-05-31 01:18am

Stravo wrote:
Praxis wrote:
Stravo wrote: One thing that would big the shit out of me is if Luke is completely wussified in this series. In my opinion Luke should be a fucking Force using monster by this point. His worries about falling to the Darkside should be behind him as he has faced the ultimate test in ROTJ.
He is until the end, when he finally figures out (thanks to Vergere and Jacen) that he WON'T automatically become evil if he stops a bunch of genocidal mass murderers from killing people then goes on a rampage through Vongified Coruscant murdering Vong.

The final battle is just awesome. Despite being attacked by force resistant, genetically modified Vong soldiers far stronger than normal ones, and being in a room in a building swaying side to side as an entire army is assualting it, he utterly mops the floor with his opponents even killing a few outright with just the force.
Now that description is precisely what I'm talking about. So essentially I have to wade through an entire series to see Luke kick ass? Hmmmm....that sucks.

Dark Tide 1 (second book) is the other one with a few good moments.

Pure Sabacc mentions Luke using the force to make the Vong carrier eat itself. There's another scene where he slaughters three Vong warriors with two lightsabers while pelting them with head-sized rocks.

LMSx · Post by **LMSx** » 2005-05-31 04:36am

The New Jedi Order is a lot more rewarding if (like me) you helplessly bought all the awful books that Bantam crapped out during the 90s so you can go "hey, I recognize that character!" in passing during the course of events. In fact in some cases I'd say it's a bit of continuity porn, but since spiritually it's the culminating book series, it ends up being ok and a welcome goodbye.

Post by **Dalton** » 2005-05-31 05:50am

I'm not too keen on wading through nineteen books to read about yet another "Ultimate Threat". I'll stick with pre-NJO stuff, honestly - especially since my favorite character is missing from the NJO.

Strav, if you hunger for more EU stuff, I suggest everything by Zahn. Also, Tatooine Ghost by Troy Denning.

swaaye · Post by **swaaye** » 2005-05-31 02:19pm

Luke may not be constantly badass. But, when he gets pulled into the action or chooses to cuz he's the best choice, OMG does he lay waste to his enemies. LOL. Vong don't do too well against Luke.

The last book in the series has the best Luke-battle I've ever read really. He is truly a serious Jedi Master in this confrontation. It's just nuts how well attuned this guy has gotten. He seems to be in his own little universe during the whole thing. Jaina was with him and was just struggling to keep up with him. At least I think it was Jaina (been a few months lol).

I recall another time when he had to rescue Jacen (Jacen is the real wimp, until Traitor anyway). Basically, Luke is a lot older and less gun ho!, but he's like Yoda too. Just because he's old, he's not weak.

I don't regret reading all of the books. Some of them were just terrible, but hey, with bunches of different authors trying to pick up where another left off, things are going to go bad occasionally. Overall though I was pretty impressed with the series and there are truly some really great moments in there. Heh, it's all better than Kevin J Anderson's books, lol!

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-05-31 05:54pm

LMSx wrote:The New Jedi Order is a lot more rewarding if (like me) you helplessly bought all the awful books that Bantam crapped out during the 90s so you can go "hey, I recognize that character!" in passing during the course of events. In fact in some cases I'd say it's a bit of continuity porn, but since spiritually it's the culminating book series, it ends up being ok and a welcome goodbye.

I gotta agree here, maybe thats why I liked it so much. There were so many hidden references to the other books that you'd have to read some of them a couple times to catch them all. Except for the few (Dark Journey anyone?) that were so bad you couldn't bear to read them again

Joe · Post by **Joe** » 2005-05-31 06:31pm

Well he comes and goes. He attacks a bunch of Vong warriors before anyone else had fought many and with two lightsabers and a whirlwind of Force-proppelled rocks, savages a half dozen warriors all armed with amphistaffs and lightsaber-resistant armor. But after this short burst, he's almost to total exhaustion and has to lean on his nephew.

Was there any decent explanation given for this? IIRC it was because drawing on the force was supposed to make Jedi tired, but this is total bullshit considering the stuff we see far weaker Jedi do in the prequels.

As for the NJO, I'd recommend Edge of Victory I, which I found to be a highly entertaining action story, Star by Star, the Allston duology, Traitor, and sort of Destiny's Way. The NJO is sort of awkward in that it had a fairly strong middle with the exception of that awful book Dark Journey, but an average beginning and a mediocre-at-best ending. If you actually want to slog through the whole series you'll start noticing as you get midway through the Force Heretic trilogy that the writers clearly had no idea what the fuck they were doing or how they were going to end the NJO. I thought the ending felt incredibly rushed. If you want a good laugh check out the second book in the Force Heretic trilogy for some pretty unbelievable Chiss wanking (they use fucking BOOKS, hardcover BOOKS to store data, and they try and claim this is a GOOD THING).

squidman001 · Post by **squidman001** » 2005-05-31 07:35pm

hey, sorry if its already been stated but i dont have time to read the whole thread, but what is the first book in the NJO?

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-05-31 07:36pm

squidman001 wrote:hey, sorry if its already been stated but i dont have time to read the whole thread, but what is the first book in the NJO?

Vector Prime.

Grandmaster Jogurt · Post by **Grandmaster Jogurt** » 2005-05-31 07:36pm

Vector Prime by R. A. Salvator.

squidman001 · Post by **squidman001** » 2005-05-31 07:52pm

thanks, that sucks because i was gonna start it today while i could check it out at the library but, i didnt know which of the 2 were the first one or even if 1 was the first, and that was one of them.... grrr

Macross · Post by **Macross** » 2005-06-01 03:11am

My take on the NJO... Read Vector Prime but dont bother with the rest of the first half of the series. Skip ahead to Star by Star when things finally begin to pick up. Though I would probably skip Dark Journey.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-06-01 03:17am

squidman001 wrote:hey, sorry if its already been stated but i dont have time to read the whole thread, but what is the first book in the NJO?

Reserve judgement though! Vector Prime is a must read as it is very important in the scheme of things, but the book is horribly written and incredibly minimalistic.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2005-06-01 06:24am

Joe wrote:
Was there any decent explanation given for this? IIRC it was because drawing on the force was supposed to make Jedi tired, but this is total bullshit considering the stuff we see far weaker Jedi do in the prequels.

It's based on a passage in Vision of the Future where basically Mara chews Luke out for actively using the force for everything. Saying it cut him off from the more clairvoyant side of the force.