Anyone want to get together with me to put a stop to this?

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2002-11-21 11:18pm

WASHINGTON — A massive database that the government will use to monitor every purchase made by every American citizen is a necessary tool in the war on terror, the Pentagon said Wednesday.

Edward Aldridge, undersecretary of Acquisitions and Technology, told reporters that the Pentagon is developing a prototype database to seek "patterns indicative of terrorist activity." Aldridge said the database would collect and use software to analyze consumer purchases in hopes of catching terrorists before it's too late.

"The bottom line is this is an important research project to determine the feasibility of using certain transactions and events to discover and respond to terrorists before they act," he said.

Aldridge said the database, which he called another "tool" in the war on terror, would look for telltale signs of suspicious consumer behavior.

Examples he cited were: sudden and large cash withdrawals, one-way air or rail travel, rental car transactions and purchases of firearms, chemicals or agents that could be used to produce biological or chemical weapons.

It would also combine consumer information with visa records, passports, arrest records or reports of suspicious activity given to law enforcement or intelligence services.

The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency is home to the Pentagon's brightest thinkers -- the ones who built the Internet. DARPA will be in charge of trying to make the system work technically.

Rear Adm. John Poindexter, former national security adviser to President Reagan, is developing the database under the Total Information Awareness Program. Poindexter was convicted on five counts of misleading Congress and making false statements during the Iran-Contra investigation. Those convictions were later overturned, but critics note that his is a dubious resume for someone entrusted with so sensitive a task.

Aldridge said Poindexter will only "develop the tool, he will not be exercising the tool." He said Poindexter brought the database idea to the Pentagon and persuaded Aldridge and others to pursue it.

"John has a real passion for this project," Aldridge said.

TIAF's office logo is now one eye scanning the globe. The translation of the Latin motto: knowledge is power. Some say, possibly too much power. "What this is talking about is making us a nation of suspects and I am sorry, the United States citizens should not have to live in fear of their own government and that is exactly what this is going to turn out to be," said Chuck Pena, senior defense policy analyst at the Cato Institute.

Pena and others say the database is an even greater violation of privacy rights than Attorney General John Ashcroft's nixed proposal to turn postal workers and delivery men into government tipsters. No matter what protections Congress requires, Pena fears a database big enough and nimble enough to track the entire nation's spending habits is ripe for abuse.

"I don't think once you put something like this in place, you can ever create enough checks and balances and oversight," Pena said.

But proponents say big business already has access to most of this data, but don't do anything with it to fight terrorism.

"I find it somewhat counter intuitive that people are not concerned that telemarketers and insurance companies can acquire this data but feel tremendous trepidation if a government ventures into this arena. To me it just smacks of paranoia," said David Rivkin, an attorney for Baker & Hostetler LLP.

The database is not yet ready and Aldridge said it will not be available for several years. Fake consumer data will be used in development of the database, he said.

When it's ready, Aldridge said individual privacy rights will be protected. But he could not explain how the data would be accessed. In some cases, specific warrants would give law enforcement agencies access, he said. But in other cases the database might flag suspicious activity absent a specific request or warrant, and that suspicious activity could well be relayed to law enforcement or intelligence agencies.

"I don't know what the scope of this is going to be," Aldridge said. "We are in a war on terrorism. We are trying to find out if this technology can work."

**************************

By "stop" I mean with 4,440+ pounds of ANFO.

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-11-21 11:24pm

No problem Shep it will take em roughly six more years even if we wanted it tommrow for a Database like that to get up and working in America

Ted · Post by **Ted** » 2002-11-21 11:26pm

Rear-Admiral John Poindexter.

POINDEXTER???

HAHAHAHAHA

Cal Wright · Post by **Cal Wright** » 2002-11-21 11:27pm

I have a hammer, a bad attitude and a fucking need to break something. Let's do it!!!

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2002-11-21 11:27pm

Mr Bean wrote:No problem Shep it will take em roughly six more years even if we wanted it tommrow for a Database like that to get up and working in America

And then when it's all done, some nutter blows it up ala the TURNER
DIARIES.

Willie Fucking Pierce PREDICTED this in 1970 in that racist trash known
as the TURNER DIARIES.

Post by **weemadando** » 2002-11-21 11:29pm

How much would it cost to bribe a Canadian strike bomber wing?

Stormbringer · Post by **Stormbringer** » 2002-11-21 11:29pm

And it's the wonderful Republicans, the champions over over kill firearms that are doing it. The irony

Post by **Mr Bean** » 2002-11-21 11:29pm

Willie Fucking Pierce PREDICTED this in 1970 in that racist trash known
as the TURNER DIARIES.

Shep you know a Cup of Water on the Power-box outside Works wonders?

Isil`Zha · Post by **Isil`Zha** » 2002-11-21 11:30pm

weemadando wrote:How much would it cost to bribe a Canadian strike bomber wing?

You need to include the cost to actually *build* the bombers...

Post by **weemadando** » 2002-11-21 11:36pm

Isil`Zha wrote:
weemadando wrote:How much would it cost to bribe a Canadian strike bomber wing?
You need to include the cost to actually *build* the bombers... :mrgreen:

Ok then. How much to bribe enough people to get about a dozen F/A-18s loaded with 1000lb LGBs and have them hit that fucking building?

If it comes out as being more than buying a Russian/Chinese ICBM then I'll happily side with economic rationalism.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2002-11-21 11:37pm

Great, now the government will find out that all I buy are DVDs, manga, action figures, and candy.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2002-11-21 11:41pm

Stormbringer wrote:And it's the wonderful Republicans, the champions over over kill firearms that are doing it. The irony

It's not just the Republicans. Democrats are also complicit in the
destruction of our civil liberties. Does anyone remember how Daschle
kept holding up said bill, and when it finally is voted on, ONLY 9 People
voted AGAINST IT?

Daschle is a fucktard hypocrite, him and the Dims too, and the Repukes
are also hypocritical fucktards too...'

Alferd Packer · Post by **Alferd Packer** » 2002-11-21 11:48pm

Welp, if that goes into effect, the only thing I'm buying on credit card is dildos. Lots and lots of dildos. Maybe a sheep or two.

Now THERE would be a priceless reaction.

"GENERAL! WE'VE GOT SOMETHING!"

"What is it? A terrorist?"

"...not exactly. It's....a sheepfucker, sir."

".....get out."

Ah, I make myself laugh more than anyone else, I'd bet.

CmdrWilkens · Post by **CmdrWilkens** » 2002-11-21 11:54pm

MKSheppard wrote:
Stormbringer wrote:And it's the wonderful Republicans, the champions over over kill firearms that are doing it. The irony
It's not just the Republicans. Democrats are also complicit in the
destruction of our civil liberties. Does anyone remember how Daschle
kept holding up said bill, and when it finally is voted on, ONLY 9 People
voted AGAINST IT?

Daschle is a fucktard hypocrite, him and the Dims too, and the Repukes
are also hypocritical fucktards too...'

For some reason, despite agreeing that this is shit that needs to die, all I can think of is George Carlin paraphrased...and now that I think about it Fuck Everybody. Sometimes in politics you have to generalize.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2002-11-21 11:57pm

The NightWatch is watching you ...

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2002-11-21 11:58pm

Darth Wong wrote:The NightWatch is watching you ...

Not for long.......

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2002-11-22 12:01am

weemadando wrote:
Isil`Zha wrote:
weemadando wrote:How much would it cost to bribe a Canadian strike bomber wing?
You need to include the cost to actually *build* the bombers...
Ok then. How much to bribe enough people to get about a dozen F/A-18s loaded with 1000lb LGBs and have them hit that fucking building?

I'm not even sure if the CF-18s are equipped with 1000lb LGBs, or if they have the range to hit that building without refueling

If it comes out as being more than buying a Russian/Chinese ICBM then I'll happily side with economic rationalism.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2002-11-22 12:02am

Make sure it's a neutron bomb on that Russkie ICBM...

I want to keep the artifacts in DC, such as our Constitution, the
Air & Space Museum, the White House, Capitol, etc, but kill off
the fucktard politicians

Stuart Mackey · Post by **Stuart Mackey** » 2002-11-22 12:06am

Mr Bean wrote:No problem Shep it will take em roughly six more years even if we wanted it tommrow for a Database like that to get up and working in America

By which time most will have forgotten about it, and it gets implimented without people knowing or giveing a stuff.

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi · Post by **Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi** » 2002-11-22 10:04pm

It's not going to work anyway.

"An Arabic guy that was found to have 3 aliases and an invalid visa brought several tons of fertilizer from this garden store, and a few hundred gallons of gasoline as well. Should we track him down?"

"That's nothing. This war veteran brought a razor blade. He's surey going to do something bad."

How come ordinary Americans are stopped at security when they have anything remotely resembling a potential weapon, but a guy with a turban and a fuse coming out of his shoe can walk right through?

Post by **Sea Skimmer** » 2002-11-22 10:15pm

phongn wrote:
weemadando wrote:
Isil`Zha wrote: You need to include the cost to actually *build* the bombers...
Ok then. How much to bribe enough people to get about a dozen F/A-18s loaded with 1000lb LGBs and have them hit that fucking building?
I'm not even sure if the CF-18s are equipped with 1000lb LGBs, or if they have the range to hit that building without refueling

If it comes out as being more than buying a Russian/Chinese ICBM then I'll happily side with economic rationalism.

Canada doesn’t have any LGB left. The CAF fired off its entire PGM stock in Allied Force and it has not been replaced. And the planes would not have the range.

Raptor 597 · Post by **Raptor 597** » 2002-11-22 10:32pm

Darth Wong wrote:The NightWatch is watching you ...

And is this why I should take over the System, and destroy it.

Crayz9000 · Post by **Crayz9000** » 2002-11-22 10:46pm

Mr Bean wrote:Shep you know a Cup of Water on the Power-box outside Works wonders?

Just so long as it's not distilled...

Actually, concentrated hydrochloric acid would be much better

Crayz9000 · Post by **Crayz9000** » 2002-11-22 10:50pm

Asst. Asst. Lt. Cmdr. Smi wrote:How come ordinary Americans are stopped at security when they have anything remotely resembling a potential weapon, but a guy with a turban and a fuse coming out of his shoe can walk right through?

After the Oklahoma City bombing, I got stopped for carrying a switchblade comb into a federal building here in California. (It was a source of amusment for everyone else in line, though

)

The funniest part? I had one of those cheap plastic-and-vinyl slingshots in my pocket, and they didn't even notice.

Of course, I was about 13 or 14 at the time.

spongyblue · Post by **spongyblue** » 2002-11-22 11:18pm

Crayz9000 wrote:
Mr Bean wrote:Shep you know a Cup of Water on the Power-box outside Works wonders?
Just so long as it's not distilled...

Actually, concentrated hydrochloric acid would be much better

I say we raid the joint at night with super soalers and sledge-hammers. Take that HAL.