You heard it here first folks. Not only is hypespace so slow that it took days to reach Endor from Sullest but the pilots on the rebel starfighters didn't mind the fact that they had to live in their own shit for several days!
By the way the entry is by Son-of-CCN:
SON-OF-CCN wrote:
Here's a thought related to the Endor-Sullust trip. If hyperdirve is so slow that it's going to take days to reach Endor than why are the fighters deployed when they leave Sullust? Do you expect the crews to shit in their suits and live aboard their ships for days on end?
It could be done. THose fighters had more room the most of our early space capsules. Remember once in hyperspace all caclulations are done and you can sit back and sleep. Or whatever. It wouldn't be uber-comfterable but it could be done.Plus I have heard some idea that there might be a slow-time effect in hyperspace based off of all time was a moment quote.
M1891/30: A bad day on the range is better then a good day at work.
Makes one wonder how hyperspace would effect the ejection of shit from a space vehicle.
*Wedge ejects shit from his X-wing fighter. The shit, not having hyperspace capabilities of its own, drops into realspace. The mass shadow generated by the shit accidentally decapitates Admiral Ackbar*
Isn't it possible that the suit has some sort of means of dealing with waste? I know they're at least working on some sort of system for space suits now.
Not that I'm arguing anything, just pointing it out.
Junghalli wrote:Isn't it possible that the suit has some sort of means of dealing with waste? I know they're at least working on some sort of system for space suits now.
Not that I'm arguing anything, just pointing it out.
I would hope so but I don't recall seeing any tubes leaving the suit or holes for tubes that could evacuate waste from the suit. Maybe it is shuttled to a bag within the suit?
M1891/30: A bad day on the range is better then a good day at work.
Gemini VII lasted exactly two weeks, though as Ire pointed out, X-wings lack any waste disposal facilities. The Gemini was equipped to deal with such problems, however.
And considering the recent thread covering the A-wing size issue, that would have even less space than the Gemini astronauts had available.
Let's see if my memory works here; the Rebel force gets to the front door, the Ewok says there's a another secret enterance, the fleet jumps, the ground force arrives at the back door, enters, gets caught, and the fleet jumps out. And this happens over several days?
The most basic assumption about the world is that it does not contradict itself.
A little real world FYI, if you hang out around military pilots enough, fighter or heavy, you will hear poop stories. It is simply a fact of life in the community.
The most basic assumption about the world is that it does not contradict itself.
Wicked Pilot wrote:Let's see if my memory works here; the Rebel force gets to the front door, the Ewok says there's a another secret enterance, the fleet jumps, the ground force arrives at the back door, enters, gets caught, and the fleet jumps out. And this happens over several days?
Clearly it took several days for the strike force to travel around the base perimeter to reach the back door.
I know, it's fruitless to argue against it, either.
Firefox wrote:Clearly it took several days for the strike force to travel around the base perimeter to reach the back door.
The Luke, Vader, and Emperor encounter on the Death Star must have taken several days also. They were all wearing dark clothing though so if they crapped themselves it'd be hard to notice.
The most basic assumption about the world is that it does not contradict itself.
Interesting use of the Heinleinian "Fresher" in the Thrawn books, if that's true. The great SF author Robert A. Heinlein had developed this concept for an ultra-luxurious restroom, that was fortunately never fully described in detail, but in his typical style, "Freshers" appeared in everything he wrote.
It is conceivable that liquid and solid waste management technologies are superior in the SW universe, so perhaps starfighters could be modified with them for extended duration journeys.
However, in the case of the Battle of Endor, the timeline proposed here is irrelevant anyway, regardless of whether or not the Rebel pilots were benefitting from some futuristic washroom.
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RThurmont wrote:Interesting use of the Heinleinian "Fresher" in the Thrawn books, if that's true. The great SF author Robert A. Heinlein had developed this concept for an ultra-luxurious restroom, that was fortunately never fully described in detail, but in his typical style, "Freshers" appeared in everything he wrote.
It is conceivable that liquid and solid waste management technologies are superior in the SW universe, so perhaps starfighters could be modified with them for extended duration journeys.
However, in the case of the Battle of Endor, the timeline proposed here is irrelevant anyway, regardless of whether or not the Rebel pilots were benefitting from some futuristic washroom.
'fresher in Star Wars simply stands for refresher unit. Sorta like 'droid is short for android. It's a fancy name for a bathroom, and they aren't necessarily luxurious. I don't think they're related to Heinlein's mega-bathrooms.
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Civil War Man wrote:Makes one wonder how hyperspace would effect the ejection of shit from a space vehicle.
*Wedge ejects shit from his X-wing fighter. The shit, not having hyperspace capabilities of its own, drops into realspace. The mass shadow generated by the shit accidentally decapitates Admiral Ackbar*
Objects released in Hyperspace always remain in Hyperspace, because exiting Hyperspace requires a hyperdrive.
Cpl Kendall wrote:Whats this Ewok Pit Problem they keep bringing up? And thanks for the Thrawn book tidbit Noble Ire.
According to the ROTJ novelization, an AT-ST toppled over after having stepped into a pit that had been digged by the Ewoks. Some of the pro-Trek debaters argues that the time needed to dig those pits by the Ewoks would've taken days (together with the other preparations that was made before the Ewok attack).
Mange the Swede wrote:
According to the ROTJ novelization, an AT-ST toppled over after having stepped into a pit that had been digged by the Ewoks. Some of the pro-Trek debaters argues that the time needed to dig those pits by the Ewoks would've taken days (together with the other preparations that was made before the Ewok attack).
And the Ewoks couldn't have simply prepared all of this in advance? That's the impression I got from the movie. Obviously their industrious little critters.
M1891/30: A bad day on the range is better then a good day at work.
Mange the Swede wrote:
According to the ROTJ novelization, an AT-ST toppled over after having stepped into a pit that had been digged by the Ewoks. Some of the pro-Trek debaters argues that the time needed to dig those pits by the Ewoks would've taken days (together with the other preparations that was made before the Ewok attack).
And the Ewoks couldn't have simply prepared all of this in advance? That's the impression I got from the movie. Obviously their industrious little critters.
Yes, I tried to point that out in the thread "Situation the Federation could do (Copy of SD.net thread)" (Vympel also did that, and he is a much, much better debater than me) but I would've had more success talking to a brick wall. The answer I got was that it was "unreasonable" and that the Ewoks, as a stone-age people, would never move against the Imperial forces and that it would've been impossible for the Ewoks to carry out the preparations without being detected. The pro-Trek debaters stretched it to two weeks of preparation:
++http://www.strek-v-swars.net/phpBB2/vie ... weeks#5626
On page 15 on that thread, the range four days to two weeks was then suggested.
RThurmont wrote:Interesting use of the Heinleinian "Fresher" in the Thrawn books, if that's true. The great SF author Robert A. Heinlein had developed this concept for an ultra-luxurious restroom, that was fortunately never fully described in detail, but in his typical style, "Freshers" appeared in everything he wrote.
It is conceivable that liquid and solid waste management technologies are superior in the SW universe, so perhaps starfighters could be modified with them for extended duration journeys.
However, in the case of the Battle of Endor, the timeline proposed here is irrelevant anyway, regardless of whether or not the Rebel pilots were benefitting from some futuristic washroom.
'fresher in Star Wars simply stands for refresher unit. Sorta like 'droid is short for android. It's a fancy name for a bathroom, and they aren't necessarily luxurious. I don't think they're related to Heinlein's mega-bathrooms.
Fresher is a generic (and kind of appropriately futuristic-sounding) euphemism for a bathroom or toilet facility in SF, particularly SF dating from the '50s and '60s. Just read about any spacefaring Andre Norton SF, for instance. Heinlein, Asimov, Norton et al were, at the time, marketed heavily to juvenile audiences, and it would have been dreadfully immoral, corrupting and downright communist to write that the protagonist went to the toilet before his adventures. Thus the fresher, AKA refresher.
Of course, a useful medication for fighter pilots would be a pair of pills: one to temporarily and hamrlessly stop peristalsis, and one to get it going again when facilities are available.
RThurmont wrote:Interesting use of the Heinleinian "Fresher" in the Thrawn books, if that's true. The great SF author Robert A. Heinlein had developed this concept for an ultra-luxurious restroom, that was fortunately never fully described in detail, but in his typical style, "Freshers" appeared in everything he wrote.
It is conceivable that liquid and solid waste management technologies are superior in the SW universe, so perhaps starfighters could be modified with them for extended duration journeys.
However, in the case of the Battle of Endor, the timeline proposed here is irrelevant anyway, regardless of whether or not the Rebel pilots were benefitting from some futuristic washroom.
'fresher in Star Wars simply stands for refresher unit. Sorta like 'droid is short for android. It's a fancy name for a bathroom, and they aren't necessarily luxurious. I don't think they're related to Heinlein's mega-bathrooms.
Fresher is a generic (and kind of appropriately futuristic-sounding) euphemism for a bathroom or toilet facility in SF, particularly SF dating from the '50s and '60s. Just read about any spacefaring Andre Norton SF, for instance. Heinlein, Asimov, Norton et al were, at the time, marketed heavily to juvenile audiences, and it would have been dreadfully immoral, corrupting and downright communist to write that the protagonist went to the toilet before his adventures. Thus the fresher, AKA refresher.
Of course, a useful medication for fighter pilots would be a pair of pills: one to temporarily and hamrlessly stop peristalsis, and one to get it going again when facilities are available.
And what about the need of food and water, or do the pilots chew on Jetson type food pills?
Simple; something like our 'energy bar'. Probably its ingredients are chosen so that they basically take a long time to process through the digestive system; as for water/fluids, well, the catheter's a simple enough concept...
Cpl Kendall wrote:Whats this Ewok Pit Problem they keep bringing up? And thanks for the Thrawn book tidbit Noble Ire.
According to the ROTJ novelization, an AT-ST toppled over after having stepped into a pit that had been digged by the Ewoks. Some of the pro-Trek debaters argues that the time needed to dig those pits by the Ewoks would've taken days (together with the other preparations that was made before the Ewok attack).
A man can dig a very big hole in an hour. Several men can dig an huge hole in the same ammount of time.
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Why would the Imperials notiece the Ewoks doing ANYTHING nearby ?? They are animals to the imps heck the stormtroopers could have been looking at them as they dug a pit or two and commented on the "Dumb animals" Nothing noteworthy to report ....
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The X-wing novels say that starfighters don't do combat hyper-jumps of more than a few hours, if they can help it, because of the cramped, uncomfortable nature of sitting in a starfighter for long periods. Also, the novels say that for jumps of more than a few hours starfighters will stay inside their motherships until they either arrive at the battle or launch at an assembly just before the final jump to the battle. The reason the Rebels and NR do this is so the pilots are as sharp, fresh, and rested as possible, which improves their survival because a tired, cramped pilot is going to be at a disadvantage against a fresh pilot. Considering the importance of the Battle of Endor its safe to assume the Rebels would want their pilots in the best condition possible. Which suggests that Sullust was considered close enough to be an assembly point. Which means it should be only a few hours at most from Endor by hyper.
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NRS Guardian wrote:The X-wing novels say that starfighters don't do combat hyper-jumps of more than a few hours, if they can help it, because of the cramped, uncomfortable nature of sitting in a starfighter for long periods. Also, the novels say that for jumps of more than a few hours starfighters will stay inside their motherships until they either arrive at the battle or launch at an assembly just before the final jump to the battle. The reason the Rebels and NR do this is so the pilots are as sharp, fresh, and rested as possible, which improves their survival because a tired, cramped pilot is going to be at a disadvantage against a fresh pilot. Considering the importance of the Battle of Endor its safe to assume the Rebels would want their pilots in the best condition possible. Which suggests that Sullust was considered close enough to be an assembly point. Which means it should be only a few hours at most from Endor by hyper.
I've read the thread in question, and this argument was brought up by the Cpl.
It was countered with the idiotic notion that after sleeping for two weeks in a starfighter cockpit, the loss of performance would be "neglible" or "slight". Obviously, none of these guys have ever took a nine hour aircraft/train/bus trip (which, for all practical purposes, is similar to their concept of "jump into hyperspace, sleep for two weeks". Except that mass transport is more comfortable than a fighter cockpit)
