SW.com Databank Update: Sith Vengeance

Cykeisme · Post by **Cykeisme** » 2005-07-31 01:30pm

Wasn't he using the saber to block the lightning?

I understand there's a camp that believes that Sidious wasn't being hurt by his lightning, and was faking getting hurt by it, or something, but I don't know much about that. If that was true then I suppose he could just turn up the power till Windu gets knocked out the window anyway.

It looked to me like he was hurting himself quite badly even with the half-powered lightning, though.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-07-31 01:59pm

He was using the sabre pretty much as a focal point while absorbing/dissipating the lightning, like Obi-Wan did against Dooku in AotC. Note though that Yoda was able later to absorb/dissipate Dooku's lightning directly using his hand as a focal point (much like Vader does to Han's blaster fire in ESB), so I would assume that it's easier to a/d Force lightning the way Windu and Kenobi did it versus how Yoda did so.

For the record, I am in that camp, specifically believing that Palpatine's "injuries and disfigurement" was actually his Force disguise being destroyed/dropped, revealing his true appearence. I wouldn't outright say that Palpatine wasn't hurt at all by the reflected lightning, but I would stand by the assertion that he wasn't seriously hurt and was mostly faking the severity of it, which makes sense considering that within a couple minutes of claiming to be too weak he was able to deliver a near-fatal shot of lightning (along the lines of what Vader recieved in RotJ) and Force throw Windu out the window, then get up and dust himself off like nothing happened.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-07-31 02:16pm

As long as that pretty purple saber was firmly in his grasp, ol' Mace woulda been fine

My question is: at what point would the lightning-streaks start to overwhelm the sabre and run past it? Lightning has a nasty tendency to branch out, and if some of those tendrils started running across the shaft, Mace would have a harder time keeping it together.

Didn´t Palpatine´s lightning-streaks spread out when he was lifted into the air by Vader at the end of ROTJ? Even though most of them hit himself, he caused enough damage to the man behind him to eventually kill him. The guy´s got two hands, it´s not as if he has to concentrate all power on a single point.

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2005-07-31 03:01pm

I thought Sidious' lightning was more to keep Windu from running him through than to kill him. As long as Windu has to block Sith lightning with his sabre, he can't kill Sidious with it.

I also thought Palpatine's transformation was the effect of using every last bit of the Force he had, like a starving person burning up the fat in his own bone marrow and internal organs. All that lightning to hold off Windu just sucked the life Force right out of him.

Windu had him beat. He should have run him through instead of talking -a failing more common to villains than heroes in most movies.

Cykeisme · Post by **Cykeisme** » 2005-07-31 03:09pm

"I have you now, Mr. Bond!"

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2005-08-02 07:53pm

Windu had him beat. He should have run him through instead of talking -a failing more common to villains than heroes in most movies.

The novel makes clear why he hesitated- before he could kill Palpatine, Anakin entered the room, and Windu sensed that Anakin was a HUGE shatterpoint. That's probably why he didn't simply kill Palpatine; he had to make sure Anakin didn't swing along the wrong fault line.

Pcm979 · Post by **Pcm979** » 2005-08-02 10:40pm

He did such a good job at that, too.

Admiral_K · Post by **Admiral_K** » 2005-08-02 10:42pm

FTeik wrote:
Cykeisme wrote:
Pcm979 wrote:Woo! Windu is officially dead!
WHAT NO!!!
WELL.. AT LEAST AAYLA IS STILL ALIVE!!

The two entered into a spectacular duel -- a contest between the most powerful practitioners of the Force's light and dark sides. The Emperor proved too powerful to defeat. Though Yoda held his own for much of the duel, in the end, the Sith bested him.
Eh, was there ever any doubt about this whatsoever?
Or has there been a "Yoda-was-faking" camp that's cropped up somewhere now?
The point is, if Yoda and Palpatine are the two most powerful, Mace isn't.

In that case he couldn't have defeated Palpatine (of course this ignores such things as the difference between raw power and skill, if Mace managed to deflect Palpatine's own power back against him the later emperor can still be the most powerful force-user without gaining ground against the BMF).

Simply being more powerful doesn't guarantee victory. See Anakin/Obi Wan duel.

Medic · Post by **Medic** » 2005-08-02 10:52pm

Simply being more powerful doesn't guarantee victory. See Anakin/Obi Wan duel.

Anakin hasn't shown a propensity to plan things out years in advance like Palpatine though.

Palpatine more than likely knew he had Anakin as his trump card whereas Anakin always -- even as a Jedi -- acted brashly. His raw skill and luck finally failed him against Obi-Wan.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2005-08-03 01:34am

Windu had disarmed Sidious and cornered the treacherous Sith Lord into the frame of his expansive office window. Fearing that Sidious was too powerful to take prisoner -- the Dark Lord still had control of the Senate and courts -- Windu moved to deliver a deathblow. Torn between his loyalties, and needing Palpatine alive to fulfill his quest for arcane knowledge to preserve the life of his beloved, Anakin acted. In an emotionally charged action, Anakin ignited his lightsaber blade and sheared off Mace Windu's weapon hand before he could strike Palpatine.

Defenseless, Windu was bombarded with Sith lightning as Sidious unleashed a torrent of deadly energy at the Jedi Master. The forked bolts of lightning penetrated Mace's body, illuminating his form from within. The final blast bodily lifted him into the air, sending his form hurling into the Coruscant skies, to crash lifelessly somewhere in the vast cityscape below.

Everyone seems to interpret these differently.
Seems to me that Mace was the victor of thier duel, and only Anakin's interference gave Sidious the upper hand. Only when he was "defenseless", or without his lightsaber was he prone to the lightning. Maybe only Yoda, and I guess Anakin at some point, would be strong enough to stop the lightning without sabers.

The Jedi eventually discovered Palpatine's Sith leanings and confronted the Chancellor. Sidious lashed out with blinding speed, brandishing a previously hidden lightsaber blade in a sudden strike that killed all of the Jedi Masters Mace Windu had assembled to arrest the Chancellor. With Anakin Skywalker's help, Sidious was able to defeat Mace, though he was severely scarred by the reflected power of his dark side lightning. To conceal his disfigured visage, Sidious returned to his simple Sith robes.

Here it says that Sisious needed Anakin's help to beat Mace... this one is in Sidious's date base entry, but again we are all going to take what we want from these.

Darth Fanboy · Post by **Darth Fanboy** » 2005-08-03 04:57am

And for skeptics, Plageuis was Sidious' Master.

The Sith wrote:Thus, the Sith quietly continued for centuries, until the time of Darth Sidious. It was Sidious who was responsible for the revenge of the Sith against the Jedi. His measured and carefully engineered plot spanned decades. Sidious was apprentice to Darth Plageuis, a wise Sith Lord whose knowledge of arcane and unnatural arts was reputed to extend to manipulating the very essence of life. By Sith tradition, Sidious killed Plageuis in his ascent to Master from apprentice. This left an opening for the fearsome Darth Maul to become Sidious' Sith apprentice.

Pcm979 · Post by **Pcm979** » 2005-08-03 05:01am

It's in the book. If they won't accept the book as source material, they won't accept the website.

The Original Nex · Post by **The Original Nex** » 2005-08-03 07:06pm

If there's one thing about that update that really pisses me off it's that Pablo says that the Mustafarians actually evolved on Mustafar. How many more idiotic spoutings is he going to come up with through his horrible tenure? Nothing is going to evolve on Mustafar, certainly not any intelligent life or any life that is remotely humanoid. It would have been so simple to justr say that the Confederacy contracted these aliens out to do mining work and they transferred over to Mustafar, but no, they had to be natives of a freaking lava-planet!

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2005-08-03 07:29pm

It's not the first time that's been done in Star Wars, though I don't know of any other intelligent lava planet creatures.

Manus Celer Dei · Post by **Manus Celer Dei** » 2005-08-03 07:39pm

I always thought they were robots untill I read that article.

.

The Original Nex · Post by **The Original Nex** » 2005-08-03 07:52pm

Darth Yoshi wrote:It's not the first time that's been done in Star Wars, though I don't know of any other intelligent lava planet creatures.

Where else has it been done?

I thought the VD established that the mustafarians were not native to that planet.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-08-03 09:00pm

The Original Nex wrote:
Darth Yoshi wrote:It's not the first time that's been done in Star Wars, though I don't know of any other intelligent lava planet creatures.
Where else has it been done?

I thought the VD established that the mustafarians were not native to that planet.

There was a crystaline Lava Slug in Jedi Search by none other than KJA, although it certainly wasnt intellegent.

And I'm more inclined to believe the VD over the databank, although I don't know its canon status.

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2005-08-03 09:20pm

I'm pretty sure Mustafar's actually a moon, judging by the massive cloud-covered planet in its local space. The info I last heard about the workers on Mustafar was they were actually Kubaz, which implies the moon is a mining outpost of theirs and most likely the physical difference is merely extra equipment or a racial variation. Sounds more interesting to me than Yet Another Dual-Species Planet, which they probably wrote up hastily when confusing the identity of the 'Mustafarians'.

President Sharky · Post by **President Sharky** » 2005-08-04 12:41am

Did you read the article? Mustafar is a planet caught in between the gravitational pull of two gas giants. It's this force that makes it geologicaly unstable.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-08-04 12:55am

President Sharky wrote:Did you read the article? Mustafar is a planet caught in between the gravitational pull of two gas giants. It's this force that makes it geologicaly unstable.

That makes no sense. How would they be locked between them often enough to screw up the planet and maintain a stable orbit. Fuck Hidalgo. He's an idiot. The distances in the movie are way too close unless its a moon.

President Sharky · Post by **President Sharky** » 2005-08-04 01:06am

Maybe you should rephrase that, because I have no idea what you're talking about.

The young world of Mustafar is literally being torn in opposing directions, caught in a gravimetric tug of war that keeps it from becoming the moon of a nearby gas giant. Despite the close proximity of massive Jestefad, Mustafar keeps to its erratic orbit, pulled by the distant influence of another giant, Lefrani. The tidal strain heats up Mustafar's molten core, resulting in spectacular geological activity across the entire planet.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2005-08-04 01:16am

How close could the orbits of two gas giants possibly be? Is the whole system in chaos due to some massive rogue or something?

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2005-08-04 01:45am

The different orbits will have different speeds, and I doubt the planet will constantly be in a situation where tidal stresses will be suffered from both gas giants. Moreover, significant tidal stresses mean passing relatively close to the Roche limit, by which distance the planet should be captured. Furthermore, the distance between the closest gas giant and Mustafar as seen in ROTS is way too small for Mustafar to be anything but a moon.

President Sharky · Post by **President Sharky** » 2005-08-04 01:52am

Okay, now it makes sense. Ya, then the databank info's pretty retarded.