Good Buy for College PC?

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-07-30 02:07pm

Okay, since my asshole parents have yanked my trusty old laptop, I've been on the market for a compy. Upon the enthusiastic recommendation of my roomie, who's a Dell fanwhore (though arguably with reason, as if one's to believe him his computer has never given him a bit of trouble over two years of use), I did a little shopping and built a Dell online. It's a bit low-end, but I'm hoping it'll be adequate for these purposes....

1. Basic gaming
2. Schoolwork

I'm down to less than $400 due to purchasing this, so I'm stuck with what it's got at the moment, but feel free to suggest any updates that I might consider getting...

1 Dimension 5100 Series,Intel Pentium 4 Processor 521 with HT Technology (2.8GHz) $1,158.92

1 512MB DDR2 SDRAM at 400MHz $0.00

1 Wireless Keyboard and Mouse Desktop Solution $0.00

1 17IN(16.0IN VIS)E773c Monitor,Midnight Grey,Dimension $0.00

1 256MB ATI Hyper Memory PCI-Express X16 (DVI/VGA/TV out) Radeon
X600 SE $0.00

1 160GB Serial ATA Hard Drive (7200RPM) $0.00

1 No Floppy Drive Requested $0.00

1 Microsoft Windows XP Professional,Service Pack 2, English $0.00

1 Image Restore $0.00

1 Dimension Dell Support $0.00

1 Dell Media Experience 3.0 Basic $0.00

1 Windows Media Player 10 $0.00

1 Dell Owners Manual installed on your system,click on icon after system set-up to access $0.00

1 Mouse included in Logitech Wireless Package $0.00

1 Intel Pro 100M Integrated PCI NIC Card $0.00

1 56K PCI Data Fax Modem $0.00

1 Adobe Acrobat Reader 6.0 $0.00

1 16X DVD+/-RW Drive $0.00

1 PowerDVD Software Decoding forDVD Drives $0.00

1 Integrated Audio $0.00

1 No Speaker Requested $0.00

Comments? Opinions? Ace already trashed the video card, but that was the best option available after the GeForce 6800...

And I was quite astounded to find out that they offer a 1-TB hard drive. One fuckin' TERABYTE!!!!!!!!

And I thought 500 gig was a lot..........

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-07-30 02:25pm

Dell?

Anyway, here's what you can get at iBuyPower.

$1,128.00

Very cool see through case with blue neon lights and a temperature gauge

Athlon 64 3000+

Foxconn WinFast NF4K8MC-ERS nVidia nForce4 Chipset w/LAN, 5.1 Sound, IEEE-1394, USB 2.0 PCI-E Motherboard (it's got FireWire apparently, few Dell's do)

Windows XP Pro SP2 (if you get Home it's $60 less)

512MB DDR-400 PC3200 Memory Module

Floppy drive

6-in-1 media card reader

Geforce 6600 GT (outperforms Radeon X700 Pro in Tomshardware benchmarks)

160 GB hard drive

16x DVD-ROM drive

16X Dual Format/Double Layer DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Drive

(that's right; it has a DVD-ROM drive, AND a dual format DUAL LAYER DVD burner; put a DVD in one slot, burn in the other, perhaps?)

3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard

Cintre RW-6510 5.1 Surround Sound Speakers + Subwoofer

(surround sound speakers AND a subwoofer, vs "integrated audio" and no speakers on the Dell)

ViewSonic 17" E70F Perfect Flat CRT .21H DPI Color Monitor

Combo: Logitech Cordless Desktop LX700 (LX 700 Keyboard + Click! Plus Rechargeable Optical Mouse)

Other than not having the "Dell Media Experience" preinstalled, it looks like a better deal to me. You get a better graphics card, surround sound speakers (vs none on the Dell), a subwoofer (vs none on the Dell), a DUAL LAYER DVD burner (vs a normal one on the Dell) and a second DVD drive, an Athlon 64 (vs a Pentium 4 on the Dell), Firewire, a floppy drive, a media card reader, a MUCH nicer case with neon lights and a temperature gauge, all other specs about equal, and save about $20 in the process.

That was the Athlon 64 Best Buy. Although try the other customizers, you get different prices sometimes.
http://ibuypower.com/mall/amd64-lobby.asp

Of course, it's your choice, but that would be my recommendation.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-07-30 02:31pm

Nice one. This rig was about $1160-1180, don't remember exactly, but with MS Office and shipping prices it came up to $1300. Athlon is *not* what I want, though-- all the descriptions I've seen have it being fairly slow. IIRC the P4 is the better processor out there-- not really ideal, but definitely faster? I could be wrong, of course...

GeForce cards are out of the question till I come by some money and can upgrade, though. Ditto any cutesy additions like extra RAM (512 will be quite adequate for my purposes.... for awhile, anyway

)

Arrow · Post by **Arrow** » 2005-07-30 02:57pm

Elheru Aran wrote:Nice one. This rig was about $1160-1180, don't remember exactly, but with MS Office and shipping prices it came up to $1300. Athlon is *not* what I want, though-- all the descriptions I've seen have it being fairly slow. IIRC the P4 is the better processor out there-- not really ideal, but definitely faster? I could be wrong, of course...

GeForce cards are out of the question till I come by some money and can upgrade, though. Ditto any cutesy additions like extra RAM (512 will be quite adequate for my purposes.... for awhile, anyway )

Actually, for everyday use and for gaming, Althons trash P4s. Yes, Althons have slower clocks, but their architecture allows them to be competitive with much higher clocked P4s. Not to mention they're cheaper.

A hyperthread P4, on the other hand, will feel a bit more responsive, since its pseudo dual-core. One program can dominate the CPU.

I'd go with Praxis' suggestion. Its a much beefer machine for a similar price. And its not using POS hardware (no VIA or SiS chipsets).

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-07-30 03:11pm

Nice one. This rig was about $1160-1180, don't remember exactly, but with MS Office and shipping prices it came up to $1300.

The specs you quoted said, $1,158.92, dunno.
Buy Microsoft Office through your school's education discount! Don't pay the retail price!

Elheru Aran wrote:Athlon is *not* what I want, though-- all the descriptions I've seen have it being fairly slow. IIRC the P4 is the better processor out there-- not really ideal, but definitely faster? I could be wrong, of course...

Methinks you have Athlon 64 mixed up with Athlon XP.

Athlon 64's are MUCH faster than Pentium 4's and regularly kick their pants.
Anandtech benchmarks:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/sh ... i=2149&p=7

The processor in the iBuyPower system I quoted is the Athlon 64 3000+. You'll spot it at 85.3 on the chart. It outperforms the 3.4 GHz Pentium 4 EXTREME EDITION.

The processor in the Dell is the Intel Pentium 4 2.8E (i assume its E). 70.7.

The Athlon's that AREN'T so good are the XP's...the green on the chart.

GeForce cards are out of the question till I come by some money and can upgrade, though.

Don't see why you'd say that. The Geforce 6600 is the same price as the Radeon X600 Pro on Newegg, and that system setup I gave you there is INCLUDING a Geforce 6600GT (which considerably outperforms an X600 SE).

Anyway iBuyPower offers COMPLETE customization, so choose exactly what you want.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-07-30 03:38pm

Er... bit of a problem... I already purchased it

Sorry if that wasn't clear!

I *will* be quite happy to take suggestions regarding upgrades I could make for reasonable prices, though, especially graphics-wise. Incidentally, Dell only offered the Radeon cards, and then the 6800-- they didn't have the GeForce 6600 option. They don't have the Athlon option, either. At least they've got good customer support, according to my roomie...

As far as upgrades go, I intend to buy extra RAM at some point. I'll probably also insert a floppy-disk drive, maybe a 9-in-one for my photo card. I intend to do regular burns to DVD of my HD's contents, and I'm deaf, so music isn't a concern-- 160 gigabytes should be quite sufficient.

Yea? Nay? Suggestions? Recommendations?

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-07-30 03:58pm

ooooh. Okay. Well, it's a fine system. Athlon 64 would be better, but it's still plenty. Dell doesn't have Athlon processors, because Intel gives them discounts if they make sure ALL of their computers use Intel. AMD is suing Intel for doing that, actually.

Does the Dell have PCIe? If so, I'd recommend a Geforce 6600GT. Overclock it and it can outperform a 6800 GT. It's one of the most overclockable cards around today.

Although really, the X600 should be sufficient for now. You should be able to play ANY game on the market right now (not max settings on the high end games though).

I'd wait for the next gen before you upgrade the graphics card, really, unless you're a hardcore gamer. The Geforce 7800 is out. Maybe when a Geforce 7600 comes...

160 GB is plenty.

Floppy isn't that big a deal, a 9-in-one card reader would be a good upgrade.

Only upgrades I can think of is a gig of RAM at some point in the future, and a better graphics card at some point in the future, other than that, you're pretty well set.

Oh, and rip the Dell logo off, it's a blemish

I do have a suggestion. You've got a pretty big HD there. Rip your favorite game disks to .iso disk images, then install Daemon Tools and mount them (I do this with my 120 GB drive). Then you never need to put a disk in again, and it's entirely legal, and you don't have to worry about the bugginess of no CD cracks.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2005-07-30 06:26pm

Does the Dell have PCIe? If so, I'd recommend a Geforce 6600GT. Overclock it and it can outperform a 6800 GT. It's one of the most overclockable cards around today.

Uh, no. Maybe a basic 6800, but not the 6800 GT; the 6800GT has four more pipelines and twice the video memory.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-07-31 03:23am

Sorry, you are correct, I added two letters too many.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-07-31 03:52pm

Hmm... nice suggestions.

Question-- why not a floppy? I need something I can transfer Word files on for essays and stuff to print out in computer labs and shit if my printer borks. Don't have the money even for a cheap flash drive. At least I've got a decent, if slightly crappy at times, webcam... I don't have but the single SD memory card from my camera. Be a bit of overkill for me to get a 8-in-1 drive for just that single card, wouldn't it?

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-07-31 04:05pm

Well...

http://www.pcuniverse.com/product.asp?p ... 81&m_id=32

$16 gets you a 64 MB USB drive. A floppy disk is 1.4 MB. I'd consider that a better solution, but if you want the floppy, go ahead and get it.

Alternatively, you could buy one of these SD card readers...

But if every computer in your school has a floppy drive and that is what you intend to use it for, go ahead and get one. But you won't find any use for it outside your school, be warned.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-07-31 04:14pm

You win. Thanks, bud...

Kurgan · Post by **Kurgan** » 2005-08-02 03:33pm

Yeah, I hate that that Dell (and maybe other) Laptops now don't come with floppies. Floppies are cheap and work in every pc you'll find on a campus (other than iMacs in those net cafes).

They expect you to shell out for a USB memory stick (128 megs for like $50 or something?), or burn CD's/DVD's every time you want to transfer files? It's not like you can use the wireless internet for everything. ;P

Stupid decision by them. Dell sucks. We got two laptops from them for my younger bro & sis in undergrad. Neither had floppies (you had to buy an external, which is cumbersome) and you're forced to use Win XP Home Edition (lame).

I was thinking about getting a laptop, but definately not from them unless they change their stupid policies. I'll probably just haul my 2 year old big rig and get a new lcd screen to replace my monster crt and a dvd-burner, that should hold me for awhile. Good luck!

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2005-08-02 07:17pm

I for one hope that floppies die and go away as quickly as possible; they are slow, unreliable, antiquated technology that has no place in a world of USB flash sticks and optical burning technology.

They expect you to shell out for a USB memory stick (128 megs for like $50 or something?)

256MB USB Flash Drive - $16.50.

128MB USB Flash Drive - $9.50

So, you can afford a several-hundred dollar laptop, but you can't afford a $10 flash drive? Am I missing something? Come on, a floppy drive and a few disks would probably cost about the same and be far slower, less reliable, and hold much less data.

I applaud Dell for trying to drag people out of the stone-age. The sooner we get rid of floppies permanently, the better.

(However, it should be noted that this decision was probably done not to get people to get with the times, but to save money; a few bucks saved per laptop times thousands of laptops can add up.)

Tokaji Kyoden · Post by **Tokaji Kyoden** » 2005-08-02 07:36pm

Not exactly sure what you want in upgrades, but the best places to get new parts are www.NewEgg.com and www.ZipZoomFly.com. That is where I bought all the parts for my newest computer, cost me about 400-500 less than it would have prebuilt.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2005-08-02 09:54pm

The real problem with floppies in laptops is that they take up SO MUCH SPACE, which is better used for other things. My business just gives out thumb drives to employees. I'm sure that most colleges do the same thing, now, for their students.

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2005-08-02 10:02pm

Master of Ossus wrote:I'm sure that most colleges do the same thing, now, for their students.

Not mine, but between email, network drives, and the infrared every laptop has, who really needs it?

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-08-03 12:25am

I for one hope that floppies die and go away as quickly as possible; they are slow, unreliable, antiquated technology that has no place in a world of USB flash sticks and optical burning technology.

Hear, hear!

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-08-03 07:27pm

Uraniun235 wrote:So, you can afford a several-hundred dollar laptop, but you can't afford a $10 flash drive? Am I missing something? Come on, a floppy drive and a few disks would probably cost about the same and be far slower, less reliable, and hold much less data.

I applaud Dell for trying to drag people out of the stone-age. The sooner we get rid of floppies permanently, the better.

(However, it should be noted that this decision was probably done not to get people to get with the times, but to save money; a few bucks saved per laptop times thousands of laptops can add up.)

Sorry if I gave that impression; I wasn't aware flash drives were *that* cheap. I figured a floppy drive would probably be better as all the computers on campus have 'em, would make it easier to just copy from one to the other if I had to print out anything big... but there being cheap flash drives like that does change the stats. Thanks for the tip, will keep in mind... /thumbsup

EDIT: Holy shit, it's being shipped already?! Didn't think they'd move *that* fast...

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-08-03 08:33pm

Praxis wrote:Very cool see through case with blue neon lights and a temperature gauge

I will never buy a PC with one of those ridiculous see-through cases and blue neon lights. That's as cheesy as those ridiculous little economy cars with the aftermarket spoilers and blue underbody lights.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2005-08-03 09:44pm

Darth Wong wrote:
Praxis wrote:Very cool see through case with blue neon lights and a temperature gauge
I will never buy a PC with one of those ridiculous see-through cases and blue neon lights. That's as cheesy as those ridiculous little economy cars with the aftermarket spoilers and blue underbody lights.

One question.

Would you rather have blue neon lights...

...or a Dell logo and "Made for Windows XP" sticker?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-08-03 10:26pm

Praxis wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:
Praxis wrote:Very cool see through case with blue neon lights and a temperature gauge
I will never buy a PC with one of those ridiculous see-through cases and blue neon lights. That's as cheesy as those ridiculous little economy cars with the aftermarket spoilers and blue underbody lights.
One question.

Would you rather have blue neon lights...

...or a Dell logo and "Made for Windows XP" sticker?

The Dell Logo and the "Made for Windows XP" sticker, anyday. I'm an adult, and the Dell looks professional. A blue neon-light computer looks like a brat's toy.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2005-08-04 02:16pm

Aesthetics debate aside (:P), the thing came today. Didn't expect it to ship that fast...

In any case, set it up, seems to function fine, set up password protection out the yin-yang on both the Admin and my user accounts, and then repacked it right back in the boxes. There's no room for it here, and there's no way in Hell that I'm giving my parents any opportunity to mess with it. The taste of freedom, though... so glorious......