Stargate SG-1, taking a poke at Christianity? (Season 9)

[Magnetic]

First of all, Stargate SG-1 is one of my all time favorite science fiction shows out there. I'm not too sure of the new season and actors, but I'll suspend judgement until I see more episodes. So far, though, I find Vala to be an interesting character.

Anyway, to the topic at hand. I have missed a lot of the new season thus far, but was able to catch a rerun this past Friday. The team was, of course, on a planet trying to make the inhabitants understand that the Ori aren't gods.

This is the point of this thread. In that episode, Dr. Jackson is trying to understand why they insist on worshipping a god "who threatens death if you don't worship them". This is kinda the same as Christianity on the more conservative side, that being, if you don't worship God (the God of the Bible), you will die an eventual death of torment.

Do you think it is (or has always been) the underlining idea behind Stargate?

[Dalton]

I think the creators have always been very, very careful not to mention any Christian mythology in the show, aside from the whole Knights of the Round Table thing.

[SirNitram]

The underlying idea behind SG-1 has been 'Sci-fi which is not the norm'. That's it. You can stop hallucinating it's all some huge nine year conspiracy.

Now. The Ori. Yes, one can see some definate parallels. As I said in the review thread of 'Powers That Be', my, but Eternal Salvation has never sounded like such an outright threat before.

But not much is being changed to make it more menacing. Hell, the Christian God supposedly sent down plagues and such. If that seems evil to you when it's an alien with a glowy stick, maybe it's not just the fact it's an alien.

[spikenigma]

Do you think it is (or has always been) the underlining idea behind Stargate?

yes and no

yes -

because in the last episodes of this latest season that is what they are alluding to. When the Orii posessed the main prior he said "we (the Orii) don't require blind faith, only that you see with your eyes what you know to be true" - a sly dig at faith. There have been many other little statements thrown here and there like "the Orii need nothing from us" (probably a bit of a contradiction).

no -

because in the last episode both the General and Mitchell mentioned the Judeo Christian "God entity" probably being above it all in an "even higher" plane of existance. I think this what put in there to side step the entire issue of earthly religions, and the merit of "faith".

that's my take on it anyway...

(and "hallowed of the Orii" - I never get tired of hearing it, very cool)

[SirNitram]

I think the creators have always been very, very careful not to mention any Christian mythology in the show, aside from the whole Knights of the Round Table thing.

There was also a town stolen from Earth in the middle ages by Sokar, but as that was specifically a Gou'ald pretending to be Satan, it's probably excusable.

[spikenigma]

I think the creators have always been very, very careful not to mention any Christian mythology in the show, aside from the whole Knights of the Round Table thing.

Ba'al is mentioned in the bible also...

[Jalinth]

There was also a town stolen from Earth in the middle ages by Sokar, but as that was specifically a Gou'ald pretending to be Satan, it's probably excusable.

The show wants to make a buck, so they avoid pissing off major demographic groups - I can't recall many references to any main stream religious group. Pious Viking or Egyptian worshipers are pretty rare these days, so you might as well slag them.

[Alyeska]

The closest SG-1 has come to Christianity is talking about how Sokar pretended to be Satan.

Anyway, as Jalinth mentioned, the show wants to make money and pissing off the largest demographic isn't going to do that.

Right now the Orri are the closest we will get to looking at Christianity.

Now here is a thought. Jesus could have been an Ancient. Spouts riddle type phrases, heals people with a touch. Then he dies but seemingly is resurrected in light. Ascension.

[Elheru Aran]

The closest SG-1 has come to Christianity is talking about how Sokar pretended to be Satan.

Anyway, as Jalinth mentioned, the show wants to make money and pissing off the largest demographic isn't going to do that.

Right now the Orri are the closest we will get to looking at Christianity.

Now here is a thought. Jesus could have been an Ancient. Spouts riddle type phrases, heals people with a touch. Then he dies but seemingly is resurrected in light. Ascension.

I've heard that theory before. Another has it that he was a Goa'uld... ask Aya (I absolutely refuse to use his new screenname ) for details, I got it from him. Even though I don't remember too much about it, it did make a rather good amount of sense and was rather fun to boot...

[weemadando]

I would laugh my arse off if they came across a system lord who called himself "Yahweh" or something and his first prime/right hand man "Jesus"...

And then, they would have to own them both. Horribly.

[Darth Wong]

Or better yet, a psychotic separatist terror group led by someone named Moses, with a penchant for the use of biological warfare and infanticide.

[Imperial Overlord]

Or better yet, a psychotic separatist terror group led by someone named Moses, with a penchant for the use of biological warfare and infanticide.

Rogue System Lord.

[Grand Moff Yenchin]

The Go'aulds used fear and benefited from the resources of people.

The Ori so far uses faith or fear and benefits from the faith(?) of people.

I think the show is sort of trying a new step in a consistent direction.

Though I think besides that "higher plane over higher plane" talk, they're also sort of masking it with the "fiery hell description" like saying "devils pretend to be god".

Or better yet, a psychotic separatist terror group led by someone named Moses, with a penchant for the use of biological warfare and infanticide.

Moses has a magical staff. Now we know all the ablilities of the Prior staffs. Obviously they could also change into snakes.

[Lancer]

because in the last episode both the General and Mitchell mentioned the Judeo Christian "God entity" probably being above it all in an "even higher" plane of existance. I think this what put in there to side step the entire issue of earthly religions, and the merit of "faith".

I saw that bit as Landry and Mitchell trying to reconcile what they (now) know with their own beliefs.

[CaptainChewbacca]

Teal'c has a line in some episode how he doesn't think the Christian God could be a Goa'uld, because he is compassionate and merciful. Can't recall the title at the moment, will think about it at work.

[Lagmonster]

Teal'c has a line in some episode how he doesn't think the Christian God could be a Goa'uld, because he is compassionate and merciful. Can't recall the title at the moment, will think about it at work.

I remember that line as well; I remember flinching when I heard it, too. But it certainly is in there somewhere.

[Peregrin Toker]

Teal'c has a line in some episode how he doesn't think the Christian God could be a Goa'uld, because he is compassionate and merciful. Can't recall the title at the moment, will think about it at work.

I remember that line as well; I remember flinching when I heard it, too. But it certainly is in there somewhere.

I also clearly remembering an episode where O'Neill told Bra'tac "Some of us Tau'ri believe in a God, but not one with glowing eyes and a snake in his head."

[Oddysseus]

It is kind of funny to watch them comment on Baptist. They go around the galaxy saying, "No, the guy with the glowing eyes, the ability to raise the dead, and 'live forever' is NOT a god." "No, the fire being, that create human life, live an existence beyond our understanding, can wipe us out with barely a thought, and beyond our ability to touch are NOT gods."

Then they say, "The beardy guy in the sky with the hippy kid who magically made the world and we have no evidence of, but a whole lot of myths and allegories...yeah, he could be a real god." They don't see the irony, but that is how life works, ain't it?

Sure have a sense of a higher power that made the universe. But with all the Goa'uld, Asgard, and Ancient mucking about...come on. Kali is a Goa'uld (I am surprised there was no reaction from any Hindu group to that, since a lot of people got peeved at Xena way back.). Apollo is a Goa'uld. Ra is a Goa'uld. Thor, Loki, Heimdal. etc. are Asgard. Heck, Sokar played at being the "Devil". Holy Trinity makes sense, no question.


But they have to play nice with the fundies, don't they?

[Magnetic]

It would be very interesting to see the reaction, in the United States, if Stargate decided to place the Biblical God into the likes of Goa'uld, Asgard, or Ancient. I bet that there would be an 'outcry', then it would be on the news, which would cause more people to watch the show (out of curiosity, of course), and then we'd see the ratings rise. hehehe

[Lancer]

It is kind of funny to watch them comment on Baptist. They go around the galaxy saying, "No, the guy with the glowing eyes, the ability to raise the dead, and 'live forever' is NOT a god." "No, the fire being, that create human life, live an existence beyond our understanding, can wipe us out with barely a thought, and beyond our ability to touch are NOT gods."

Then they say, "The beardy guy in the sky with the hippy kid who magically made the world and we have no evidence of, but a whole lot of myths and allegories...yeah, he could be a real god." They don't see the irony, but that is how life works, ain't it?

Again, note that the two who were paying lip-service (Landry and Mitchel) both have religious family members who indoctrinated them early on. Their statements can easily seen as some attempt to rationalize and reconcile what they do know with their own personal beliefs.

Daniel and Vala could care less with playing nice with religious beliefs, and I strongly suspect neither Carter nor O'Neil would bother either.

[dworkin]

Watching the show I like to feel the characters treat the whole "Yahweh is a Gouald" thang like the proverbial elephant in the room. It's there, they just avoid thinking about it.

Of course can't upset the viewers by even hinting that their favourite fairy story is just like all the others.

Of course I thought pretty much the same thing Dieties & Demigods came out for AD&D. Stats for Thor, Ra, King Arthur, Hastur and the Grey Mouser but once again the wacky Hebrew Pantheon (and there are more than the Big Three) get left out.

And that was a game the fundies hated anyway.

[Patrick Ogaard]

Watching the show I like to feel the characters treat the whole "Yahweh is a Gouald" thang like the proverbial elephant in the room. It's there, they just avoid thinking about it.

Of course can't upset the viewers by even hinting that their favourite fairy story is just like all the others.

Of course I thought pretty much the same thing Dieties & Demigods came out for AD&D. Stats for Thor, Ra, King Arthur, Hastur and the Grey Mouser but once again the wacky Hebrew Pantheon (and there are more than the Big Three) get left out.

And that was a game the fundies hated anyway.

Strange, that...but at least the first edition had the Cthulhu and Melnibonean pantheons.

Seriously, though, expecting a Jehovah's Witness like EGG, as well as assorted born again folks from the early days of TSR, to include a 400 hit point Jehovah was perhaps expecting too much. Still, the ability to appear in three places simultaneously and automatically use one Wish spell per round per body would be hard to beat.

Which brings up the entirely unrelated question of where the Vanir ended up. The Asgard (Aesir) are accounted for, but what about their relatives. Of course, then one might have to expect the Jotuns to show up, too. Or I just haven't watched enough current SG-1 episodes.

[Solauren]

Kali is a Goa'uld (I am surprised there was no reaction from any Hindu group to that, since a lot of people got peeved at Xena way back.)

Actually, there complaint was on there dieties depicited behaviour, not the behaviour of beings that are lying and claiming to be a god.

I mean, come on, if you complain about a someone that claims to be your god's behaviour, your really, really uptight.

[fgalkin]

He can also be beaten up by a Jewish guy.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Grand Moff Yenchin]

1st season, "Politics"

KINSEY
There is only one God, sir. And I do not believe for one moment He will allow what you are trying to tell me to come to pass. We are after all, One Nation Under God.
O'NEILL
And you think God is going to save us?
TEAL'C
The Goa'uld believe they are Gods. And your beliefs will not dissuade them.


3rd season, "Demons"
TEAL'C
I know of no Goa'uld capable of showing the necessary compassion or benevolence that I have read of in your Bible.
O'NEILL
You read the Bible, Teal'c?
TEAL'C
It is a significant part of your Western culture. Have you not read the Bible O'Neill?
O'NEILL
Oh yeah, yeah, not all of it. Actually, I'm listening to it on tape. Don't tell me how it ends.


Sounds to me like O'Neill's sarcasm....?