BabylonGate5 Atlantis!

TheMuffinKing · Post by **TheMuffinKing** » 2005-10-02 05:03pm

Pardon the confusing title, but how would the Earth Alliance of B5 fare against the Goau'ld or Wraith of Stargate fame?

TheMuffinKing · Post by **TheMuffinKing** » 2005-10-02 05:04pm

Oops, no edit, this is inspired by the Stargate or B5 thread started by Zor.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-02 06:43pm

EF gets utterly annihilated.

A solid argument can be made for SG races being able to duke it out with GT and TT level weaponry.

And if the Atlantis movie is the source, then based of what we've seen the Anchients do, then at their height the Wraith should be capable of ignoring the Death Star.

Crown · Post by **Crown** » 2005-10-02 06:45pm

What Atlantis movie

Jason von Evil · Post by **Jason von Evil** » 2005-10-02 06:48pm

Crown wrote:What Atlantis movie

The Rising, I believe. It was pretty movieish.

Darth Yoshi · Post by **Darth Yoshi** » 2005-10-02 06:48pm

I assume he refers to the series premier.

Ender, what makes you say the Wraith can shrug off the Death Star?

TheMuffinKing · Post by **TheMuffinKing** » 2005-10-02 08:24pm

I wonder how the main enemies of the Stargate universe would fare against the Shadows or vorlons...

Does anyone know enough of Thirdspace aliens to include them?

Nephtys · Post by **Nephtys** » 2005-10-02 08:45pm

TheMuffinKing wrote:I wonder how the main enemies of the Stargate universe would fare against the Shadows or vorlons...

Does anyone know enough of Thirdspace aliens to include them?

Earthforce gets massively wiped out. They're against a foe that absorbs gigaton missiles without breaking a sweat, while the same weapons would be highly effective even against the Shadows.

Thirdspace aliens are hard to quantify. Their ships don't seem notably better than Vorlon or YR Ships, but they have extremely potent mind control powers...

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-02 11:29pm

Darth Yoshi wrote:I assume he refers to the series premier.

Ender, what makes you say the Wraith can shrug off the Death Star?

A cooked off ZPM can destroy a star system. Thats nova level power. As in 10^44 joules low end. These are their BATTERIES. And the Wraith faced this kind of fire down and didn't flinch.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-02 11:31pm

TheMuffinKing wrote:I wonder how the main enemies of the Stargate universe would fare against the Shadows or vorlons...

Does anyone know enough of Thirdspace aliens to include them?

Shadows and Volrons are low MT at best. About Trek level. They get annihilated.

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-02 11:47pm

The Ancients probably didnt blow up too many ZPMs, but I would be very suprised if thier warships werent power by them.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-02 11:51pm

ggs wrote:The Ancients probably didnt blow up too many ZPMs, but I would be very suprised if thier warships werent power by them.

Exactly. Even if the things were meant to run at full power for 10,000 years, and 10^44 is their total energy value, its still higher then the Death Star's peak power.

What they should be able to shrug off and dish out is frankly Culture level. Which makes some bits like Dart firepower and resiliance very strange.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-02 11:52pm

ghetto edit: last sentance should be something along the lines pf "And since there needs to be a rough pairity, it makes later things like Dart firepower and resiliance very strange"

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-02 11:56pm

Ender wrote:ghetto edit: last sentance should be something along the lines pf "And since there needs to be a rough pairity, it makes later things like Dart firepower and resiliance very strange"

Even with 1 to a billion difference in power generation, you are still looking at redicious levels of firepower for the Ancients.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2005-10-03 03:48am

ZPMs don't seem to function this way. Seige 3 gives the time to depletion under bombardment of a single ZPM as fairly low, and wraith firepower isn't all that impressive. With the technobabble power of a ZPM, there's no way to prove that their output over their lifetime is equal to their explosive potential. The 'blast a solar system' is proven to be hyperbole in a nother episode of season two where a power source twelve times more powerful than a ZPM cooks off and only destroys 'most' of a solar system.

Murazor · Post by **Murazor** » 2005-10-03 05:33am

NecronLord wrote:ZPMs don't seem to function this way. Seige 3 gives the time to depletion under bombardment of a single ZPM as fairly low, and wraith firepower isn't all that impressive. With the technobabble power of a ZPM, there's no way to prove that their output over their lifetime is equal to their explosive potential. The 'blast a solar system' is proven to be hyperbole in a nother episode of season two where a power source twelve times more powerful than a ZPM cooks off and only destroys 'most' of a solar system.

[Devil's advocate]The Annals of the Curator mention the Wraith cauterization of a planet[/Devil's advocate]

Of course, the on-screen evidence is quite bad for Wraith firepower and the sci-fi site removed those entries (probably after the series started contradicting them). Nonetheless, I will point that someone just posted some apparently solid figures in Spacebattles that put Atlantis' shield in the 8MT/second as a low end using the wave from "The Storm". BTW, do we know the actual meaning of "destroying five sixths of a solar system". Uber-fireball of doom with supernova+ energy levels or just Alderaan style planetary explosion that fucks the orbits of nearby planets?

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-03 06:09am

I would also suggest that the ZPM have a limited power output rate, otherwise there would be no need to run 3 in parallel to power the city. Were the same 3 ZPMs can run one at a time with the city idle.

Also the various weapons see in Stargate (NOT Earth's railguns & stuff) are apparently significantly better at hammering the shield at vastly less energy cost than the brute force energy cost.

This still raises the question of were the hell all the energy they have at thier command is going.

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-03 06:11am

Murazor wrote:BTW, do we know the actual meaning of "destroying five sixths of a solar system". Uber-fireball of doom with supernova+ energy levels or just Alderaan style planetary explosion that fucks the orbits of nearby planets?

However it was destroyed, you dont want to be a few lightyears away on a planet. A super-nova that close would kill your planet, this is at least on that scale.

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-03 06:17am

Murazor wrote:, I will point that someone just posted some apparently solid figures in Spacebattles that put Atlantis' shield in the 8MT/second as a low end using the wave from "The Storm".

link to mentioned calcs

Those look solid, but I want someone with more experiance at doing picture scaling to look at it.

Lancer · Post by **Lancer** » 2005-10-03 07:52am

Murazor wrote:
NecronLord wrote:ZPMs don't seem to function this way. Seige 3 gives the time to depletion under bombardment of a single ZPM as fairly low, and wraith firepower isn't all that impressive. With the technobabble power of a ZPM, there's no way to prove that their output over their lifetime is equal to their explosive potential. The 'blast a solar system' is proven to be hyperbole in a nother episode of season two where a power source twelve times more powerful than a ZPM cooks off and only destroys 'most' of a solar system.
[Devil's advocate]The Annals of the Curator mention the Wraith cauterization of a planet[/Devil's advocate]

Of course, the on-screen evidence is quite bad for Wraith firepower and the sci-fi site removed those entries (probably after the series started contradicting them). Nonetheless, I will point that someone just posted some apparently solid figures in Spacebattles that put Atlantis' shield in the 8MT/second as a low end using the wave from "The Storm". BTW, do we know the actual meaning of "destroying five sixths of a solar system". Uber-fireball of doom with supernova+ energy levels or just Alderaan style planetary explosion that fucks the orbits of nearby planets?

a ZPM's power dumped into a star makes the star turn into a shockwave of plasma.

the Ancient-experiment on zero point energy didn't destroy 5/6ths of the solar system as consume it in a weird, rapidly expanding blue fireball.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2005-10-03 12:42pm

Matt Huang wrote: a ZPM's power dumped into a star makes the star turn into a shockwave of plasma.

What? When did this happen?

Lancer · Post by **Lancer** » 2005-10-03 01:01pm

NecronLord wrote:
Matt Huang wrote: a ZPM's power dumped into a star makes the star turn into a shockwave of plasma.
What? When did this happen?

doesn't happen to my knowledge, but when a 50% depleted ZPM can "destroy the entire solar system" (Sam's exact words), it follows that it should be able to destroy just the star as well.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2005-10-03 01:04pm

Matt Huang wrote:a ZPM's power dumped into a star makes the star turn into a shockwave of plasma.

the Ancient-experiment on zero point energy didn't destroy 5/6ths of the solar system as consume it in a weird, rapidly expanding blue fireball.

similar to how, say, a very hot incandescent surface would look? As in, how it would look if I dumped nova level power into the star system?

Lancer · Post by **Lancer** » 2005-10-03 01:57pm

Ender wrote:
Matt Huang wrote:a ZPM's power dumped into a star makes the star turn into a shockwave of plasma.

the Ancient-experiment on zero point energy didn't destroy 5/6ths of the solar system as consume it in a weird, rapidly expanding blue fireball.
similar to how, say, a very hot incandescent surface would look? As in, how it would look if I dumped nova level power into the star system?

the shape of the explosion is mainly why I called it weird.

while it's probably a brainbug by now (although Stargate's usually pretty good about avoiding em) the planar shockwave was throwing off alarms in my head.

Xon · Post by **Xon** » 2005-10-03 02:06pm

The Zero Point Energy field's expansion was non-linear and non-symeterical who the fuck knows what they would have on the final explosion gfx