Old Republic Juggernauts=Alliance Tanks?

Star Wars Fan · Post by **Star Wars Fan** » 2005-10-11 05:39pm

SO,I watched Episode III, Revenge of the Sith. It seems as the Juggernaut is like the Rebel Attack Tank (Assault Mech) from Galactic Batttlegrounds. So, did the Alliance get these mechs by stealing or defections, then convert them?

I'm taking about the big mech with the wheels, not the one with treads.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-10-11 05:44pm

Yeah, that seems to be the case (though they look different due to some weird styling choice of all vehicles in that game).

Managed to steal/salvage a bunch of them. AT-PTs too.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2005-10-12 05:30am

Yeah the Rebel Alliance and other rebel groups (as those probaly do exist), did get a lot of stolen/salvaged/rebuild material from the Clone Wars, just because it's just alot easier to get material that way then to build/design then yourself

(for example the biggest supplier of material for Finland during the Winter war (1939-1940) was the USSR (the country that was attacking us))

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-10-12 06:17am

Which makes me wonder, most Rebel equipment is either stolen from Imperial forces, or forces who defected or even mothballed. But, I've also seen several companies who made things specifically for the Alliance (the Yutrane-Tackata series of tanks, the Incom Corporation X-wings etc.)

So who makes these babies, do they have dedicated factory-worlds?

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2005-10-12 06:22am

VT-16 wrote:Which makes me wonder, most Rebel equipment is either stolen from Imperial forces, or forces who defected or even mothballed. But, I've also seen several companies who made things specifically for the Alliance (the Yutrane-Tackata series of tanks, the Incom Corporation X-wings etc.)

So who makes these babies, do they have dedicated factory-worlds?

more likely several small factories spread across the outer rim, to avoid Imperial dectection and elimination (though Mon Calmari did have large ship yard). That losing one factory won't cripple you.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-10-12 06:40am

Yeah, I thought as much.

Yet, that makes me think, they've got all these hideouts and secret supporters, yet the Mon Cal opposition is right out in the open. What makes the Empire unable to bring that part of the galaxy under its control? (Which they lost to begin with.)

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2005-10-12 07:07am

VT-16 wrote:Yeah, I thought as much.

Yet, that makes me think, they've got all these hideouts and secret supporters, yet the Mon Cal opposition is right out in the open. What makes the Empire unable to bring that part of the galaxy under its control? (Which they lost to begin with.)

The Rebels maintain a large fleet at Mol Calmari, so I think it's just not worth the effort it would take to take over that system.

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2005-10-12 07:08am

I see three possibilites for the Empire sparing Mon Calamari for a time:

a) Companies, that had invested into the system before the empire was forced of demanded a "solution" with as little destruction as possible.

b) the empire wanted to make an example and was waiting for its DeathStar to be complete and then sent it against MonCalamari

c) the empire wanted to make an example and was waiting for the destruction of the rebel-alliance assuming, that the MonCalamari would be far more willing to surrender once that happened.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2005-10-12 07:16am

here's two others

1. the loss of men and material while taking over Mon Calmari would bee too great compared to the things you gain from that operation

2. it would requiver such a large force to take over that anyone who wasn't a)blind b) a total moron c) combination of both would see that the Rebellion was hardly insignifigant.

Star Wars Fan · Post by **Star Wars Fan** » 2005-10-12 10:54am

b) the empire wanted to make an example and was waiting for its DeathStar to be complete and then sent it against MonCalamari

in Dark empire, adm. Ackbar did say that Calamari was on the top of the list of worlds to be destroyed by the DS. the Calamari fleet might also work, as theEmpire didn't want to send a large fleet to the outer rim (but they were able) Curtis Saxton suggests they mined all hyperspace routes to their homeworld

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2005-10-12 11:50am

Star Wars Fan wrote:
b) the empire wanted to make an example and was waiting for its DeathStar to be complete and then sent it against MonCalamari
in Dark empire, adm. Ackbar did say that Calamari was on the top of the list of worlds to be destroyed by the DS. the Calamari fleet might also work, as theEmpire didn't want to send a large fleet to the outer rim (but they were able) Curtis Saxton suggests they mined all hyperspace routes to their homeworld

Curtis Saxton is too generous to the EU.

Hyperspace-routes, my butt ...

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-10-12 02:07pm

Curtis Saxton is too generous to the EU.

Hyperspace-routes, my butt ...

Oh for gods sakes, just because hyperspace routes would seem to be largely unneeded due to the speed of hyperdrive doesn't mean that they don't exist, especially due to their presence in virtually every EU source. At the very least, routes could be corridors free of stellar anomolies that would usually interdict traffic in a specific area. Why couldn't there be such anomolies around Mon Cal space? In fact, even in the most minimalist EU, it is stated that traveling the galaxy is not a matter of velocity, but of finding a safe route.

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2005-10-12 03:41pm

I should have been more clear:

Considering the amount of hyperspace-routes in the EU they could as well be non-existant and then we're back at the question of speed.

Or, if you look at the so-called official maps, one has to wonder, why a journey took days or weeks time, if a hyperspace-route was nearby.

Spartan · Post by **Spartan** » 2005-10-12 03:42pm

Hmmm. We mulled over the Mon Cal issue what two years ago? The conculsion was that the Mon Cal never openly supported the Rebellion until after the rebel victory at Yavin.

It simply makes the most sense. No matter how well defended the Mon Cal system was it simply could not have withstood even a Sector fleet prior to ANH. If you refer to Publius notes on Dominus Publica you get an idea of the forces that were readily avalible to crush the planet at the time. Vader was able to set up a blockade spanning multiple sectors around Yavin after the DS destruction.

As far as mine fields go the idea is mostly absurd. How could a single planet mine every viable hyperspace route. Minefield weren't all that effective in the NJO, and the Empire is not as stupid as the Vong. Since even the Old republic had mine layers (ref ATOC ICS), one would have to imagine that they and the Empire had minesweepers as well.

The view that the Mon Cal could have somehow withstood the might of the Empire due to there own abilities; rather than the empire being concerned by other issues is flawed. After the destruction of the first DS, many worlds openly rebelled. The Mon Cal were but one of many. If your the Emperor the securing the Core Worlds is vastly more important than crushing the Mon Cal; who are a curb stop at most.

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2005-10-12 05:01pm

It might also be, that we severly underestimate the defenses of Mon Calamari, considering, that the empire needed a DeathStar to overcome the shields of Alderaan.

Not to mention such toys as planetary cannons.

To come back to hyperspace-routes, if we think about how vast space is there shouldn't be many obstacles to traffic.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-10-12 05:08pm

To come back to hyperspace-routes, if we think about how vast space is there shouldn't be many obstacles to traffic.

1) Perhaps the SW galaxy is extraordinairly active
2) Traveling through hyperspace seems to involve a lot of course corrections to avoid gravity sources, and they obviously would increase travel time, so hyperspace lanes are established routes that are typically devoid of many obstructions that could slow travel

Star Wars Fan · Post by **Star Wars Fan** » 2005-10-12 05:59pm

FTeik wrote:It might also be, that we severly underestimate the defenses of Mon Calamari, considering, that the empire needed a DeathStar to overcome the shields of Alderaan.

wouldn't orbital bombardment (for a few days, if necessary) overcome that

Not to mention such toys as planetary cannons.

what about Sabotage?

anyway, the Mon Calamari only had their homeworld, any outposts they had were secret.

now that you mention it, whatwas the Empire's response after Yavin to rebelling worlds in the Outer Rim. Wasn't half of the Imperial fleet held in Reserve in the Core Worlds, the Colonies and Inner Rim?

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2005-10-12 06:01pm

If that was true, there wouldn't be a need for the DS.

Star Wars Fan · Post by **Star Wars Fan** » 2005-10-12 06:11pm

VT-16 wrote:If that was true, there wouldn't be a need for the DS.

wasn't the DS designed for Tarkin's "Doctrine Of Fear" to threaten the worlds in submission?

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-10-12 07:20pm

VT-16 wrote:If that was true, there wouldn't be a need for the DS.

The DS was a quick kill weapon. Jump into a system, vape the planet, and your done. Using conventional fleets, it would take days or even weeks of seige, time during which reserve fleets could be called in and attack the attackers.

Star Wars Fan · Post by **Star Wars Fan** » 2005-10-13 11:33am

Noble Ire wrote:
VT-16 wrote:If that was true, there wouldn't be a need for the DS.
The DS was a quick kill weapon. Jump into a system, vape the planet, and your done. Using conventional fleets, it would take days or even weeks of seige, time during which reserve fleets could be called in and attack the attackers.

but this was a Galactic Empire. They could call in larger warships to do the job, and any reinforcements could be destroyed. They said that it only takes 6 ISDs to take a industralized world.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2005-10-13 01:04pm

Star Wars Fan wrote:
Noble Ire wrote:
VT-16 wrote:If that was true, there wouldn't be a need for the DS.
The DS was a quick kill weapon. Jump into a system, vape the planet, and your done. Using conventional fleets, it would take days or even weeks of seige, time during which reserve fleets could be called in and attack the attackers.
but this was a Galactic Empire. They could call in larger warships to do the job, and any reinforcements could be destroyed. They said that it only takes 6 ISDs to take a industralized world.

There was the Tarkin Doctrine Fear aspect as well. Besides, there always species left to conquer, even at the Empire's height, and Palpatine does seem to enjoy constantly bringing new superweapon toys to the battle. So really, the DS is unesissary, but perfectly in keeping with IMperial philosophy.