Chick Tract: The Movie

Pick · Post by **Pick** » 2005-10-14 08:42pm

BloodAngel wrote:The Lake of Fire bit makes me like Satan more than God.

I couldn't agree more

But fundies tend to make me like the whole Satan option.

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2005-10-15 11:28am

While Chick's original stuff is good, the best and most hilarious is the Ctulhu parody of one of his "tracts"... I cried my eyes out laughing...

I mean, there really should be Lovecraftian fundies at some point in history, when some crazy people will eventually forget who Lovecraft was..

WyrdNyrd · Post by **WyrdNyrd** » 2005-10-17 04:35am

You mean, we could get fundies who forgot that the founder of their religion was actually a fantasy/horror/sci-fi author?

Nahh, never happen...

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2005-10-17 06:33am

WyrdNyrd
Tell that to the folks who think "Necronomicon" is real...

WyrdNyrd · Post by **WyrdNyrd** » 2005-10-17 08:04am

Actually, that was a dig at Scientology...

Post by **Kuja** » 2005-10-17 11:53am

"None of them made Jesus their lord and savior! Instead of choosing life, they chose death!"

It's always cool in a movie to see one of the good guys stand up to the evil villain even though they know it's suicide. If there's so many in this one, it must really own.

Magnetic · Post by **Magnetic** » 2005-10-17 02:55pm

Pick wrote:
BloodAngel wrote:The Lake of Fire bit makes me like Satan more than God.
I couldn't agree more

But fundies tend to make me like the whole Satan option.

Just curious. IF the Biblical Hell (fire and brimstone for eternity) were a reality, . . . . . would you still choose that over "God's escape, Christ"? Realize that it would, most likely, hurt a LOT!!

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2005-10-17 05:37pm

Magnetic wrote:
Pick wrote:
BloodAngel wrote:The Lake of Fire bit makes me like Satan more than God.
I couldn't agree more

But fundies tend to make me like the whole Satan option.
Just curious. IF the Biblical Hell (fire and brimstone for eternity) were a reality, . . . . . would you still choose that over "God's escape, Christ"? Realize that it would, most likely, hurt a LOT!!

A truly intelligent diety wouldn't have such black and white thinking and would present more than just the two options of heaven and hell.

Zero · Post by **Zero** » 2005-10-17 06:13pm

Darth Servo wrote: A truly intelligent diety wouldn't have such black and white thinking and would present more than just the two options of heaven and hell.

What makes you say or believe that?

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2005-10-17 06:22pm

Zero132132 wrote:
Darth Servo wrote: A truly intelligent diety wouldn't have such black and white thinking and would present more than just the two options of heaven and hell.
What makes you say or believe that?

Because black/white is a logically fallacy and any sufficiently intelligent being would NOT use such fallacies.

Furthermore, since no two people live the same lives and don't commit the same quantity or quality of "sins", it is completely unjust to assign everyone to one of only two possibilities. While both the bank robber and Adolf Hitler are evil, why should the robber's punishment be the same? If HUMANS can figure out the idea of "let the punishment fit the crime" surely an intelligent deity can.

Spyder · Post by **Spyder** » 2005-10-17 06:36pm

That angel's being a complete cunt.

Zero · Post by **Zero** » 2005-10-17 06:37pm

I'd imagine God's logic on this matter would be closer to "Since I kick so much ass, and I'm smarter then all of you, you all deserve hell, but if you give me verbal fellatio every sunday, and actually believe I exist with no evidence whatsoever, you can be my slave in heaven instead of facing eternal torture and damnation. Sound fun?" Not really logic so much as threats and arrogance, but what value should a being infinitely better then us place on our pains and joys?

Post by **Surlethe** » 2005-10-17 10:18pm

I love how the art in the movie is not quite natural; the proportions are ever-so-slightly off; the perspectives are barely skewed. It really speaks to the subconscious regarding the true nature of the film.

Alliance SpecForceTrooper · Post by **Alliance SpecForceTrooper** » 2005-10-18 07:06am

Stas Bush wrote:I mean, there really should be Lovecraftian fundies at some point in history, when some crazy people will eventually forget who Lovecraft was..

Nah, the funniest parody of Chick was from White Wolf Games, Inc. when they did the parody Demonic Deviltry tract at GenCon in '02 for Demon: The Fallen RPG. Sadly, they no longer maintain www.father-ramos.com anymore, so you'll have to search around for a copy of it. Funny as Hell.

Dooey Jo · Post by **Dooey Jo** » 2005-10-18 07:40am

Alliance SpecForceTrooper wrote:
Stas Bush wrote:I mean, there really should be Lovecraftian fundies at some point in history, when some crazy people will eventually forget who Lovecraft was..
Nah, the funniest parody of Chick was from White Wolf Games, Inc. when they did the parody Demonic Deviltry tract at GenCon in '02 for Demon: The Fallen RPG. Sadly, they no longer maintain www.father-ramos.com anymore, so you'll have to search around for a copy of it. Funny as Hell.

I found it at the Wayback Machine.

Interestingely enough, the second hit from a google search for "demonic deviltry" goes to a Stardestroyer.net thread about Chick...

Alliance SpecForceTrooper · Post by **Alliance SpecForceTrooper** » 2005-10-18 09:39am

Admiral Valdemar wrote:You don't need MST3k for this. It's the motion picture event of the, well, ever! The clips are great, but I want the whole thing. I'm loving the lake-of-fire tosses.

Actually, funny enough, someone did an MST3K of Dark Dungeon. Figured some of y'all might like to read it.

Magnetic · Post by **Magnetic** » 2005-10-18 03:44pm

So, . . . . would you still really choose the Biblical Hell over the acceptance of Christ?

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2005-10-18 04:39pm

Magnetic wrote:So, . . . . would you still really choose the Biblical Hell over the acceptance of Christ?

What happened to the Biblical teaching of judging/rewarding every man according to his works?

Post by **Surlethe** » 2005-10-18 05:22pm

Magnetic wrote:So, . . . . would you still really choose the Biblical Hell over the acceptance of Christ?

No. Heaven, definitely, over hell; I don't know any rational person who would choose an eternity of suffering over an eternity of bliss. But first, you have to prove to me they really exist.

Magnetic · Post by **Magnetic** » 2005-10-19 11:30am

Surlethe wrote:
Magnetic wrote:So, . . . . would you still really choose the Biblical Hell over the acceptance of Christ?
No. Heaven, definitely, over hell; I don't know any rational person who would choose an eternity of suffering over an eternity of bliss. But first, you have to prove to me they really exist.

I'm not here to provide proof, nor would I be able to. My purpose is to see whether people would actually choose Hell over Christ. Reason being is that I hear constantly (from Christians) that people either choose to follow Christ, or they choose Hell. I say, as you did, that no sain/rational person WOULD choose Hell. However, they SAY they would choose Hell because of the vandictiveness of God, . . . the events of the OT.

But what if they got it wrong. I mean, what if those early Jews were completely off when it came to their understanding of God, choosing to see their positive events as "the favor of God", or their negative events as "God's punish of some wrong behavior". I mean, what would God care where the Jews settled? How is that area of Israel that much better than a LOT of areas in that part of the world? Is it lush? Does it have all sorts of edible plant life to sustain a healthy people? What is the greatness of that land that would be the catalyst for the countless deaths of people groups on the way?

I'm getting off target and rambling now. Sorry.

Bottom line is, no one choose Hell of their own free will.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2005-10-19 11:36am

Magnetic wrote:So, . . . . would you still really choose the Biblical Hell over the acceptance of Christ?

That depends on what your definition of "suspension of disbelief" is. Without necessarily suspending disbelief, one could easily interpret the Bible as a piece of statist propaganda made by the propaganda bureau of a totalitarian dictatorship which is run by God and his offspring. Satan and his freedom fighters would be the rebels, and Christ's crucifixion would be a staged event which means nothing since he wasn't really human anyway, and it was all just for show (after all, the guy was supposedly capable of resurrecting the dead and living after his own death; he should have been able to suppress pain).

"The assassination by the Romans left me scarred, and deformed. But I promise you, my resolve has never been stronger! The remaining infidels will be hunted down and defeated! The world will be reorganized into the first Holy Empire!!!!"

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2005-10-19 01:49pm

Magnetic
Depends on how you view it [the Bible].
If Christ was a decent teacher, but his words were later distorted by others to conform to their view of reality, which was in turn distorted by their surroundings and goals in life (and of course induced the ever-Churchian motto: "Promise Heaven, scare with Hell - subjugate the People well")... And if "Biblical Hell" is nothing more than a wretched mind's imagination of God's punishment... then I would definetely accept the best of Christ and his teachings, and try to follow it.

If, however, we suppose that everything is correct and "literally inerrant", then the whole "accept or burn" is just a terror-based rule, which is rather unacceptable.
I think even human-based terror-rule is MORE acceptable than God's, because humans do die and DO change... while God, according to the Bible, never changes, so his terror-rule would be eternal and unchanging. What a grim perspective!! Although we know from the Bible good ol' God has sudden changes of mood, so everything might not be so bad afterall...

Magnetic · Post by **Magnetic** » 2005-10-19 03:19pm

Stas Bush, thank you for your answer. I've lived under the latter (stated in your first paragraph) all my life. I would hope that the former (stated in your first paragraph) is more correct and that Christiandome has been wrong about the whole God thing. There are too many people (outside Christianity) that think the 'terroristic God' is unacceptable. A being that is supposed to be "perfect" wouldn't exhibit characteristics as described in the OT, even if the being "can't accept the presence of sin". A "perfect" being would think of a more "perfect" plan than the one offered in the Bible. I would think, anyway. But then, who am I?

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2005-10-19 11:27pm

Magnetic
You're welcome. Seems you are kind of confused about Christian beliefs, right?
But then, who am I?
It's important to understand that "who are you", even by a Bibilical inerrantist's standards - you are an "image of god", who has "become like him (us)" through the knowledge of "good and evil". So whenever someone tries to bring up "who are you" and "how can clay dare up to speak to a potter", you should retort with "people are not things, but children of god", who have "knowledge of good and evil" - that usually works, at least works good enough for me.

And then, my guess would be the most useful thing what Christ said was "And as ye would that men should do to you, do ye also to them likewise" (LK 6:31). So whenever someone tries to press his beliefs on you (like, constant proselytizing to the point where it become annoying...), you should ask that person whether he would like some other person to force beliefs on him in such a way. I bet not. Or just retort with "if you're without sin, throw the stone" - that usually gets them on the defensive, just like the pharisees of Jesus' time.

LordShaithis · Post by **LordShaithis** » 2005-10-20 03:16am

It's over, Adam! I have the high ground!