Vatican Cardinal says we should listen to science

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Akhlut
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Vatican Cardinal says we should listen to science

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A Fox News Article, but, I figured it was more pertinent in this forum. If a mod disagrees, please move it.

Fox News wrote:VATICAN CITY — A Vatican cardinal said Thursday the faithful should listen to what secular modern science has to offer, warning that religion risks turning into "fundamentalism" if it ignores scientific reason.

Cardinal Paul Poupard, who heads the Pontifical Council for Culture, made the comments at a news conference on a Vatican project to help end the "mutual prejudice" between religion and science that has long bedeviled the Roman Catholic Church and is part of the evolution debate in the United States.

The Vatican project was inspired by Pope John Paul II's 1992 declaration that the church's 17th-century denunciation of Galileowas an error resulting from "tragic mutual incomprehension." Galileo was condemned for supporting Nicolaus Copernicus' discovery that the Earth revolved around the sun; church teaching at the time placed Earth at the center of the universe.

"The permanent lesson that the Galileo case represents pushes us to keep alive the dialogue between the various disciplines, and in particular between theology and the natural sciences, if we want to prevent similar episodes from repeating themselves in the future," Poupard said.

But he said science, too, should listen to religion.

"We know where scientific reason can end up by itself: the atomic bomb and the possibility of cloning human beings are fruit of a reason that wants to free itself from every ethical or religious link," he said.

"But we also know the dangers of a religion that severs its links with reason and becomes prey to fundamentalism," he said.

"The faithful have the obligation to listen to that which secular modern science has to offer, just as we ask that knowledge of the faith be taken in consideration as an expert voice in humanity."

Poupard and others at the news conference were asked about the religion-science debate raging in the United States over evolution and "intelligent design."

Intelligent design's supporters argue that natural selection, an element of evolutionary theory, cannot fully explain the origin of life or the emergence of highly complex life forms.

Monsignor Gianfranco Basti, director of the Vatican project STOQ, or Science, Theology and Ontological Quest, reaffirmed John Paul's 1996 statement that evolution was "more than just a hypothesis."

"A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false," he said. "(Evolution) is more than a hypothesis because there is proof."

He was asked about comments made in July by Austrian Cardinal Christoph Schoenborn, who dismissed in a New York Times article the 1996 statement by John Paulas "rather vague and unimportant" and seemed to back intelligent design.

Basti concurred that John Paul's 1996 letter "is not a very clear expression from a definition point of view," but he said evolution was assuming ever more authority as scientific proof develops.

Poupard, for his part, stressed that what was important was that "the universe wasn't made by itself, but has a creator." But he added, "It's important for the faithful to know how science views things to understand better."

The Vatican project STOQ has organized academic courses and conferences on the relationship between science and religion and is hosting its first international conference on "the infinity in science, philosophy and theology," next week.
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I think this is a step for the better. While I'm no longer a Catholic, I've generally thought of it as one of the more intelligent organized religions around that has contributed a lot to science through the years (Gregor Mendel, anyone?). I just wish churches like the Southern Baptists would do the same thing. :?
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Post by DPDarkPrimus »

What does Mendel's religion have to do with his discoveries? Nothing whatsoever.
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Post by Akhlut »

DPDarkPrimus wrote:What does Mendel's religion have to do with his discoveries? Nothing whatsoever.
Did his religion have a direct bearing on the facts? No. Did his religion allow for him to come upon those facts? That one's a bit tougher to answer. By all accounts Mendel was a brilliant man, but would he have done his work on heredity had he not been an Augustine monk? Part of the reason he was able to do his research on a vast number of pea plants was due to the abbey's resources. Further, would he have been as willing to devote some eight years of his life to studying peas had he not been in the relatively cloistered life of monk in an abbey?

Further, one cannot ignore the fact that the Jesuits have opened a great number of well-respected universities. The Jesuits have been a strong force in educating the Catholic laity for over 350 years. To say that Catholicism hasn't had a hand in education of people would be dishonest, at best.
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Re: Vatican Cardinal says we should listen to science

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Fox News wrote:VATICAN CITY — A Vatican cardinal said Thursday the faithful should listen to what secular modern science has to offer, warning that religion risks turning into "fundamentalism" if it ignores scientific reason.
Interesting...very interesting
Cardinal Paul Poupard, who heads the Pontifical Council for Culture, made the comments at a news conference on a Vatican project to help end the "mutual prejudice" between religion and science that has long bedeviled the Roman Catholic Church and is part of the evolution debate in the United States.
It'll be interesting to see what becomes of this
The Vatican project was inspired by Pope John Paul II's 1992 declaration that the church's 17th-century denunciation of Galileo was an error resulting from "tragic mutual incomprehension." Galileo was condemned for supporting Nicolaus Copernicus' discovery that the Earth revolved around the sun; church teaching at the time placed Earth at the center of the universe.
A bit tardy. but the gesture was atleast something
"The permanent lesson that the Galileo case represents pushes us to keep alive the dialogue between the various disciplines, and in particular between theology and the natural sciences, if we want to prevent similar episodes from repeating themselves in the future," Poupard said.
Sure hope this is a step in the right direction
But he said science, too, should listen to religion.
..and Mother Goose too, I imagine
"We know where scientific reason can end up by itself: the atomic bomb and the possibility of cloning human beings are fruit of a reason that wants to free itself from every ethical or religious link," he said.
And we all know where Religon can lead us, Christianity in particular is guilty of some quite abhorrent atrocities
"But we also know the dangers of a religion that severs its links with reason and becomes prey to fundamentalism," he said.
And science by itself leads to 'nasty' things such as technology, medicine, and thoeries such as gravity, evolution, and "the big bang"
"The faithful have the obligation to listen to that which secular modern science has to offer, just as we ask that knowledge of the faith be taken in consideration as an expert voice in humanity."
Go to the US, and tell everyone that, especially in the south
Poupard and others at the news conference were asked about the religion-science debate raging in the United States over evolution and "intelligent design."
Yes, what is the Vatican's position on this?
Monsignor Gianfranco Basti, director of the Vatican project STOQ, or Science, Theology and Ontological Quest, reaffirmed John Paul's 1996 statement that evolution was "more than just a hypothesis."

"A hypothesis asks whether something is true or false," he said. "(Evolution) is more than a hypothesis because there is proof."
[ST5 'God'] Do you doubt me? [/ST5 'God']

Atleast the church has some reason, little though it may be.
Poupard, for his part, stressed that what was important was that "the universe wasn't made by itself, but has a creator." But he added, "It's important for the faithful to know how science views things to understand better."
"Science is your friend" :mrgreen:
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Post by Dark Hellion »

Goddamn it (pardon the pun-iness of this) why can't anyone get the Galileo fact right. Galileo was not censured and made to do penance for his belief in Copernicus (half the fucking Cardinals where Copernicans at the time of his censureship) but for disobeying a papal mandate and being a general asshole to the biggest man in Europe. He pulled the equivilent of walking up to W. and kicking him in the nuts, of course you are going to get punished.
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Post by EmperorSolo51 »

Dark Hellion wrote:Goddamn it (pardon the pun-iness of this) why can't anyone get the Galileo fact right. Galileo was not censured and made to do penance for his belief in Copernicus (half the fucking Cardinals where Copernicans at the time of his censureship) but for disobeying a papal mandate and being a general asshole to the biggest man in Europe. He pulled the equivilent of walking up to W. and kicking him in the nuts, of course you are going to get punished.
That and theres a misconception about him being forbidden to do his his work ever again after his conviction. It is a fact that Galileo was sentenced to House Arrest, but, he was allowed to continue his work without interruption. Infact, he was allowed to recieve guests on many occassions and give them his notes so he could have them published. To say that the Church Punished him unfairly and that he was amartyr for science is a bit dishonest to say the least.
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Post by EmperorSolo51 »

BTW This statement by the Cardinal is just a reaffirmation of the Church's relationship with Science as stated in the the Catechism of the Catholic Church.


Respect for the person and scientific research

[quote='vatican II'] 2292 Scientific, medical, or psychological experiments on human individuals or groups can contribute to healing the sick and the advancement of public health.

2293 Basic scientific research, as well as applied research, is a significant expression of man's dominion over creation. Science and technology are precious resources when placed at the service of man and promote his integral development for the benefit of all. By themselves however they cannot disclose the meaning of existence and of human progress. Science and technology are ordered to man, from whom they take their origin and development; hence they find in the person and in his moral values both evidence of their purpose and awareness of their limits.

2294 It is an illusion to claim moral neutrality in scientific research and its applications. On the other hand, guiding principles cannot be inferred from simple technical efficiency, or from the usefulness accruing to some at the expense of others or, even worse, from prevailing ideologies. Science and technology by their very nature require unconditional respect for fundamental moral criteria. They must be at the service of the human person, of his inalienable rights, of his true and integral good, in conformity with the plan and the will of God.

2295 Research or experimentation on the human being cannot legitimate acts that are in themselves contrary to the dignity of persons and to the moral law. The subjects' potential consent does not justify such acts. Experimentation on human beings is not morally legitimate if it exposes the subject's life or physical and psychological integrity to disproportionate or avoidable risks. Experimentation on human beings does not conform to the dignity of the person if it takes place without the informed consent of the subject or those who legitimately speak for him.

2296 Organ transplants are in conformity with the moral law if the physical and psychological dangers and risks to the donor are proportionate to the good sought for the recipient. Organ donation after death is a noble and meritorious act and is to be encouraged as a expression of generous solidarity. It is not morally acceptable if the donor or his proxy has not given explicit consent. Moreover, it is not morally admissible to bring about the disabling mutilation or death of a human being, even in order to delay the death of other persons. [/quote]
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