The Completely Unsanctioned Unofficial SW vs SG pics thread.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2005-11-15 09:04pm

yes exactly...

Utsanomiko · Post by **Utsanomiko** » 2005-11-15 09:06pm

My vote goes for removing them both.

I guess you could always put one back if somebody sends you a "what happened to that cool SW vs Stargate animation in your sig? I totally miss that one!" PM.

Einhander Sn0m4n · Post by **Einhander Sn0m4n** » 2005-11-15 09:14pm

I second that, Uts.

BTW, Punk, wtf is with the 'science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind' bit? I don't ever recall Einstein ever saying such a thing.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2005-11-15 09:17pm

PunkMaister wrote:I eliminated the largest one (in kb) I hope that helps.
Dang it's still a bit too long by about 10kb!
I guess is back to the old SIG again...
If anybody knows how how to make animated GIFs that would not take so much memory please let me know...

Dude, where did you get the "Science without religion is lame" quote from Einstein? More importantly, do you really think that?

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » 2005-11-15 09:34pm

Surlethe wrote:
PunkMaister wrote:I eliminated the largest one (in kb) I hope that helps.
Dang it's still a bit too long by about 10kb!
I guess is back to the old SIG again...
If anybody knows how how to make animated GIFs that would not take so much memory please let me know...
Dude, where did you get the "Science without religion is lame" quote from Einstein? More importantly, do you really think that?

I am surprised that you guys did not know about that quote. I've heard it quite a few times on TV shows even!

But ok...
Here's a few links:
http://www.schipul.com/en/quotes/view.asp?quoteid=1080
http://www.adherents.com/people/pe/Albert_Einstein.html
http://www.dogchurch.org/scriptorium/SciFaith.htm

And to answer your question yes I pretty much believe that as a practicing Christian. Why?

Spyder · Post by **Spyder** » 2005-11-15 10:57pm

Well, what makes science lame without religion?

Post by **Surlethe** » 2005-11-15 11:23pm

PunkMaister wrote:And to answer your question yes I pretty much believe that as a practicing Christian. Why?

Why does science require religion?

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2005-11-15 11:40pm

To provide a non-biased secular source for the Einstein thing:

http://www.quotationspage.com/quote/24949.html

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind.
-Albert Einstein, "Science, Philosophy and Religion: a Symposium", 1941

And by "lame" I would assume that Einstein meant along the lines of "crippled" and such.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » 2005-11-16 02:02am

Ok Let me make this really simple for everybody.
I believe that Science without any kind of religion or at lthe very east some sort of moral guidance is doomed to be used for the worst imaginable things and then some. That's how I believe in that particular quote.

What I gather from the last part of the quote that states that religion without science is blind is that blind faith alone cannot lead you anywhere.

The way I see it Faith and science or Faith and Logic reasoning have to go side by side as once stated in Babylon 5. "Is like going with just one shoe instead of 2" Science logic and reason help us in our everyday lives, Faith sustains us and take us where logic and reasoning alone cannot.

That's my opinion anyway...
BTW: This really should be a subject for a different thread...

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2005-11-16 02:22am

By your statement you are implying that a scientist who is not religious has no morality yes? Furthermore you are implying that religion (we must assume your religion) is the only source of morality. So you would claim that any scientist not a Christian exists in some sort of moral vacuum, or worse yet that they are pre-disposed to immorality.

Do we really need to go back over the Church's records in regards to morality or are you going to have the sense to drop this BS?

P.S. We know damn well where debates of this sort should be held, but it came up here and the lines are drawn here. If a mod sees fit to split this they damn well will, in the mean time keep your damn mouth shut about how other members of this board choose to debate you and any "suggestions" you might have for the mods.

Spyder · Post by **Spyder** » 2005-11-16 02:26am

So would you settle for "Science without morals is lame"? Or does it specifically have to be religion?

For example, is an athiest practising science doomed to doing evil?

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2005-11-16 02:30am

PunkMaister has not claimed that his religion is the only source of morality, nor that a scientist who is not Christian is immoral. Rather, he believes that science should have some sort of moral guidance, and that religion can convey it.

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2005-11-16 02:31am

Should he take the oppurtunity to stand up for himself he is free to contradict me, but I think we are safe in supposing that Punk is of the camp that can't seperate the concept of morality from the concept of religion.

Spyder · Post by **Spyder** » 2005-11-16 02:31am

I'm just getting clarification.

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2005-11-16 02:34am

Ford Prefect wrote:PunkMaister has not claimed that his religion is the only source of morality, nor that a scientist who is not Christian is immoral. Rather, he believes that science should have some sort of moral guidance, and that religion can convey it.

Fair enough, I'll try to avoid putting words in his mouth. I'm still waiting for some evidence of this great guiding light of religion in regards to science, or proof that without religion, science will run manaicaly insane.

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2005-11-16 02:38am

UCBooties wrote:Should he take the oppurtunity to stand up for himself he is free to contradict me, but I think we are safe in supposing that Punk is of the camp that can't seperate the concept of morality from the concept of religion.

It's just bad form to strawman someone, regardless of who they are. As it stands, he seems to believe there is moral guidance without religion, so it isn't safe to assume that at all, nor has stated that he believes that that religion should be Christian, either.

I believe that Science without any kind of religion or at lthe very east some sort of moral guidance is doomed to be used for the worst imaginable things and then some.

I apologise for acting like this, but just because he's Christian and believes that there should be some sort of morality behind science doesn't automatically mean he thinks that non-Christian scientists are bad.

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2005-11-16 02:46am

See my above concession, here I will even add an apology, I shot off my mouth too soon because I find it too easy to assume the worst of Punk, for that I owe him and the rest interested in this debate an apology.

Those from my early days on the board may recall that I myself am a Christian, and this has not changed. However, I saw an old fight looming up yet again and tried to put it down hard before it got out of hand. My mistake was assuming that I knew more about Punk's position than has been revealed. We'll wait and see what he says, assuming he replies at all.

ray245 · Post by **ray245** » 2005-11-16 03:17am

who here has created an entire self made CGI scene of stargate ship against star wars beside Glimmervoid?

Glimmervoid · Post by **Glimmervoid** » 2005-11-16 05:23am

ray245 wrote:who here has created an entire self made CGI scene of stargate ship against star wars beside Glimmervoid?

Most of the credit for the ones I did should go to the people who made the modules/ship art work. All I did was cut out, paste and add weapons fire using a feather 10 loop tool. Any one could learn to do it (well maybe not anyone...).

On a related note PunkMaister, no I did not make the models; I have no skill at 3D image creation. I just image goggled deathglider and the starwars ship came from a wallpaper I think. Then cut them out (which can take a while if they are not on a white back ground) pasted them on a back ground I got from a image Google search for Star field and added in some faded weapons fire. Also there is some rotation as well.

Glimmervoid · Post by **Glimmervoid** » 2005-11-16 11:51am

I rotated the deathglider so I looks like it’s following the Jedi star fighter manoeuvre.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2005-11-16 12:03pm

Glimmervoid wrote:[img]http://img352.<znib>.us/img352/411/fightersstargatevstarwars34ap.jpg[/img]

I rotated the deathglider so I looks like it’s following the Jedi star fighter manoeuvre.

You might want to stagger the weapons fire so it looks like the deathglider has been shooting through the turn. The bolts should be flying off tangentially to the curve.

Glimmervoid · Post by **Glimmervoid** » 2005-11-16 12:05pm

Surlethe wrote:
Glimmervoid wrote:[img]http://img352.<znib>.us/img352/411/fightersstargatevstarwars34ap.jpg[/img]

I rotated the deathglider so I looks like it’s following the Jedi star fighter manoeuvre.
You might want to stagger the weapons fire so it looks like the deathglider has been shooting through the turn. The bolts should be flying off tangentially to the curve.

I was thinking about doing that but the layers were messing up so I left it out this version. It’s still a work in progress though so it might be in the next. But now I need to start work on a 5 page computing essay due tomorrow of which 1/2 a page is done

.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » 2005-11-16 01:39pm

Ford Prefect wrote:PunkMaister has not claimed that his religion is the only source of morality, nor that a scientist who is not Christian is immoral. Rather, he believes that science should have some sort of moral guidance, and that religion can convey it.

Indeed I have not... In fact I believe I clearly stated that "at least without some sort of moral guidance science could indeed run amok"

And no I don't believe automatically that all atheists are evil anymore than I would believe that all muslims are terrorists, It's just absurd.

Now traditonally and I do mean traditionally religion has been the campground for morals and ethics etc.
Especially when taken from a spiritual context.

Now the problem has been that more often than not spirituality has been taken out of religion and with dire consequences each and every time from the crusades to 9/11.

To be honest neither religion nor science is at fault here but us humans. We are the ones that suck.
We are the ones that turn anything good into an excuse to get power through fear, violence and so on. We are the ones that turn what could be a discovery that benefits all mankind into weapons of mass destruction.

BTW: Honestly can we move this discussion somewhere else? This is way off topic seriously!:shock:

UCBooties · Post by **UCBooties** » 2005-11-16 03:14pm

If you feel you have a point to make, start a thread. It's not our job to make one for you.

PunkMaister · Post by **PunkMaister** » 2005-11-16 06:00pm

UCBooties wrote:If you feel you have a point to make, start a thread. It's not our job to make one for you.

I honestly believe I have already made my point. What I'm saying is that this is not the subject of this thread and that is basically off-topic that's all.

EDIT: Getting back on topic...

Glimmervoid wrote: I rotated the deathglider so I looks like it’s following the Jedi star fighter manoeuvre.

That's just awesome Glimmervoid keep up the good work