Would you give up control of your society for "paradise

[The Grim Squeaker]

Hypothetical situation:
Tommorow a massive pyrtamid lands from space and hovers over egypt, out of it comes a single immense golden statue that declares that it is an emmisary of a higher power come to bring peace and prosperity to this universe.
It destroys every weapon on earth (From guns/stabbing knives up to nukes), and as a gesture of good will cures Aids, HIV, Cancer and Parkinsons/Alzheimer.
The being declares that it wants to unite all humanity under one nation divided into seperate national area (meanning that you can keep living in your own home) but that every homeless/poor person will be relocated to a area of different ethnicity to encourage the break down of "racial" barriers (Meaning that in a few centuries there will be no whites/blacks/etc...).

It will also give a source of renewing perpetual energy sufficient to power eevry home on earth, will remove all waste (Radioactive, unusable plastics, heavy metals etc...), create 3 space needles as well as one on the moon and a self sustaining lunar colony, as well as bringing a new copy of Earth as it was 100,000 years ago into the solar system to relieve population density.

However it will govern every human affair, using it's vast knowledge,pre-cognition and power to ensure a golden age until the heat death of the sun makes it relocate earth.

However it decrees that all forms of crime will be discouraged and anything above negligible (Pick pocketing, 16 year old with 18 year old sexual relations) will be punished by a mind wipe with the victims recieving a new personality but will be rendered sterile to prevent any genetic criminal tendencies from spreading, also no indictrination will be allowed although being raised towards a religion/philosophy will be allowed if the child attends a group of any alternative viewpoint at least once a week (Unless the philosophy is anti-social such as hate-crimes [Nazis, fanatic "kill humans" eco-fanataics etc...]).

Would you stay on this earth(s) under this dictatorship or would you ask to be trnasfered to an alternate earth where non of this has or will have happened (No cures, no alien etc...).

[UCBooties]

A reluctant yes. The benefits are amazing, and i still retain autonamy within my own life. But I won't deny there is a deffinate loss here, and that the loss may have deeper ramifications than I am considering. However, in the meanwhile, it i force creating a society that resembles in many ways one I find ideal, so I imagine I would in fact take the deal.

But I remain uncomfortable, for what little that is worth.

[TheMuffinKing]

Nope. If it were up to me I'd foolishly fight back and reject this utopia. If given the chance I'd try to unite enough of the alternate Earth to form an entity powerful enough to engage the aliens militarily. Barring that I will shout loudly with my fist in the air.

[UCBooties]

Nope. If it were up to me I'd foolishly fight back and reject this utopia. If given the chance I'd try to unite enough of the alternate Earth to form an entity powerful enough to engage the aliens militarily. Barring that I will shout loudly with my fist in the air.

A noble sentiment, but please explain why.

[The Grim Squeaker]

Nope. If it were up to me I'd foolishly fight back and reject this utopia. If given the chance I'd try to unite enough of the alternate Earth to form an entity powerful enough to engage the aliens militarily. Barring that I will shout loudly with my fist in the air.

A noble sentiment, but please explain why.

Seconded, I was reminded of this idea after reading the "Marvel universe: The end" where the Pharoa returns with omnipotent power, kills almost all the gods/supers and cures Aids/HIV before starrting to make a galactic order of peace, unity and harmony.
The remaining heroes band agaisnt him with Thanos, who ends up gainint toti-potence and absorbing the universe

[Crayz9000]

I wouldn't want any part of it. Part of my reason would be that in essentially taking away our collective free will, these aliens would be denying us of the very thing that makes us what we are.

It's very true that humanity has done some seriously twisted and wrong things in the past. However, it's equally true that we've done some outright incredible things, and this alien would be basically flushing the baby with the bath water.

I mean, imagine it: with all this wonderful technology, why should we even try to invent anything? Why innovate when you can just buy? Why think when others can think for you?

[The Grim Squeaker]

I doubt most people living in the third world would agree with your statmeents, frankly however I can only see people living in the fist world with no disease, poverty or hideous living conditions wanting to go to a world where they don't have a technological head start because they don't want to get a technological boost.

The alien won't give humanity access to it's technology, it will only cure all diseases permanently, give the space technology mentioned and supply the power source.
Humanity will need to amke the teleporting systems itself although once they colonize the rest of the moon the alien will give huamnity the principles needed to amke a 10c engine and the technology to prevent humans going at that speed from turning into paste.

However I can see most of humanity slipping into ennui (If not debauchery) almost in an identical fashion to that seen in the fantastic "Childhoods end" by Arthur C Clark (That deals with an almost identical scenario. although in our case humanity will not "super evolve")

[NecronLord]

Fuck no. Would you trust any alien that claims to be both super-intelligent and interested in your planet, then annihalates any means you have of fighting it?

[The Grim Squeaker]

Fuck no. Would you trust any alien that claims to be both super-intelligent and interested in your planet, then annihalates any means you have of fighting it?

And has just cured every illness/didease in existence, has restored the rain forests, has given humanity acces to space needles, a self sustaining moon base, and is offering transport to a world where you can ddevelope without intefrerence if you wish or to a virgin earth if you want to start a new society using this technology.
Also you're saying that you'd prefer the situation where the 3d world was still hungry/starving/dying etc...

[Spoonist]

Heck, I'd click my heels and ask "how high".

If they did all that and only asked that we remove the criminals then whopediptywhoooo. I'm with them all the way.

Anyone read the "uplift" saga by Brin?

[Gandalf]

And has just cured every illness/didease in existence, has restored the rain forests, has given humanity acces to space needles, a self sustaining moon base, and is offering transport to a world where you can ddevelope without intefrerence if you wish or to a virgin earth if you want to start a new society using this technology.
Also you're saying that you'd prefer the situation where the 3d world was still hungry/starving/dying etc...

Because we do similar things with livestock.

We feed them well so they grow fat and make more meat. We have vast foelds that are maintained for this reason. We also work to keep them healthy so that they survive to become burgers and don't become dangerous for us.

[The Grim Squeaker]

So you'd prefer living with aids, cancer etc.... in the hope of threatening a being that can create a planet overnight?

[Gandalf]

owever it will govern every human affair, using it's vast knowledge,pre-cognition and power to ensure a golden age until the heat death of the sun makes it relocate earth.

How much do we get to do ourselves?

However it decrees that all forms of crime will be discouraged and anything above negligible (Pick pocketing, 16 year old with 18 year old sexual relations) will be punished by a mind wipe with the victims recieving a new personality but will be rendered sterile to prevent any genetic criminal tendencies from spreading, also no indictrination will be allowed although being raised towards a religion/philosophy will be allowed if the child attends a group of any alternative viewpoint at least once a week (Unless the philosophy is anti-social such as hate-crimes [Nazis, fanatic "kill humans" eco-fanataics etc...]).

So it's a death penalty for anything above a poorly defined line.

So you'd prefer living with aids, cancer etc.... in the hope of threatening a being that can create a planet overnight?

We should be able to deal with various diseases ourselves eventually.

In conclusion, we sell our species in hope that they live up to some noble expectations. Not a deal I'd agree with.

[The Grim Squeaker]

owever it will govern every human affair, using it's vast knowledge,pre-cognition and power to ensure a golden age until the heat death of the sun makes it relocate earth.

How much do we get to do ourselves?

All of it.

So it's a death penalty for anything above a poorly defined line.

Not death, new personality, anyone who steals in a society without hunger/poverty is not doing it for altruistic reasons.
Also, if you want New Orleans mk 2, feel free to move to earth 2.0.

We should be able to deal with various diseases ourselves eventually.

Oh yes, we're so close to a universal cure to AId's,Hiv,Cancer etc... that can be distributed to even the poorest back water country's residents

[Ghost Rider]

So an alien race comes in conquers us, makes it so that it can keep us like sheep for the rest of our lives and you're asking if you had knowledge of this or that which would you choose?

So I get to either suffer and be free or a slave to alien overlords for the rest of my life?

Such choices.

[Gandalf]

How much do we get to do ourselves?

All of it.

Then what is governing "every human affair"?

So it's a death penalty for anything above a poorly defined line.

Not death, new personality, anyone who steals in a society without hunger/poverty is not doing it for altruistic reasons.
Also, if you want New Orleans mk 2, feel free to move to earth 2.0.

And if you take away the personality, the person as they are is dead.

We should be able to deal with various diseases ourselves eventually.

Oh yes, we're so close to a universal cure to AId's,Hiv,Cancer etc... that can be distributed to even the poorest back water country's residents

I said eventually, you retard. Eventually does not equal "close".

As I said before, where are the guarantees that they won't just start treating us like cattle?

[The Grim Squeaker]

Ah well, to each his own.
I'll take the option with a space base, no crime (After a few years) and free access to the universe, and no fear of disease or for childrens safety.

I suppose I'm just naturally trusting of omnipotent aliens that don't bother calling themselves gods and don't demand anything for saving a quarter of the world from hunger/disease, must be from reading "Childhoods end" once too often

[Ghost Rider]

Ah well, to each his own.
I'll take the option with a space base, no crime (After a few years) and free access to the universe, and no fear of disease or for childrens safety.

I suppose I'm just naturally trusting of omnipotent aliens that don't bother calling themselves gods and don't demand anything for saving a quarter of the world from hunger/disease, must be from reading "Childhoods end" once too often

That's because you made up the hypothetical situation, dumbfuck.

So it's up to you to WHY anyone else should place any sort of trust into these beings. Why should anyone trust them given they are treating us less then children(no weapons, all Crime THEY dictate is bad and oh yeah...we make every choice for you.).

In the end you whole situation is asking people do you want to be treated as a cognizant being, or do you want someone else to do it for you?

[The Grim Squeaker]

How much do we get to do ourselves?

All of it.

Then what is governing "every human affair"?

I meant that at the end of the universe they will let humanity come along with them to the new universe where humans can do what they like. (Including warring on them or requesting to go back to a copy of this earth without the interference).

So it's a death penalty for anything above a poorly defined line.

Not death, new personality, anyone who steals in a society without hunger/poverty is not doing it for altruistic reasons.
Also, if you want New Orleans mk 2, feel free to move to earth 2.0.

And if you take away the personality, the person as they are is dead.

So Brainwashing is a worse punsihment than locking them away for life or injecting poison into their brains, because as a child their parents raised them badly or they had a badly wired neuron?
Point conceeded on the dead personality though, didn't quite understand you.

We should be able to deal with various diseases ourselves eventually.

Oh yes, we're so close to a universal cure to AId's,Hiv,Cancer etc... that can be distributed to even the poorest back water country's residents

I said eventually, you retard. Eventually does not equal "close".

As I said before, where are the guarantees that they won't just start treating us like cattle?

The fact that the "emmisary" they sent us used to be a human?
Although the Yudas goat example exists, the fact is that any race that could do something equiring such vast amounts of energy could just as easily enslave us and put us into breeding/force feeding pens.
The fact is that if they wanted us as cattle they wouldn't give us the choice of going to a copy of earth free of their intervention, or expend such ridicolous amounts of energy towards letting us spread and expand inside our own solar system let alone outside it.

[The Grim Squeaker]

Ah well, to each his own.
I'll take the option with a space base, no crime (After a few years) and free access to the universe, and no fear of disease or for childrens safety.

I suppose I'm just naturally trusting of omnipotent aliens that don't bother calling themselves gods and don't demand anything for saving a quarter of the world from hunger/disease, must be from reading "Childhoods end" once too often

That's because you made up the hypothetical situation, dumbfuck.

So fucking what? I didn't state my opinion int he OP, why is stating my thoughts clearly moronic? (Retorical question)

So it's up to you to WHY anyone else should place any sort of trust into these beings. Why should anyone trust them given they are treating us less then children(no weapons, all Crime THEY dictate is bad and oh yeah...we make every choice for you.).

In the end you whole situation is asking people do you want to be treated as a cognizant being, or do you want someone else to do it for you?

Frankly I understand the reasons for choosing to go to a interference free earth, but that doesn't change my opinion on humanity, namely:
People want to be lead (We have a serious case of herd mentality).
People who are starving won't care if they have to stop ethnically cleansing their country in order to recieve food and health. (Except for any dictators, but they fall into the brainwashing clause).
I seriously doubt that theres a person on earth dying from AID's,HIV,Cancer,Alzheimer,Parkinson that would say "Never mind freedom from the pain ajnd horro, I want my descendants to get the cure for this".

Also I'm not trying to convince anyone as to the wisdom of accepting the guidance of an omnipotent group of beings, but I felt like practicicng an argument anyway , But ignore what I just said, it does not reflect my actions in the following flame war/debate/argument against me for wanting to be a space travveling Gerbil.

[Gandalf]

I meant that at the end of the universe they will let humanity come along with them to the new universe where humans can do what they like. (Including warring on them or requesting to go back to a copy of this earth without the interference).

Again, no way of knowing if they'll fulfil their promises.

So Brainwashing is a worse punsihment than locking them away for life or injecting poison into their brains, because as a child their parents raised them badly or they had a badly wired neuron?

Yes. Prison time gives a chance for the person to realise they've done wrong. And this still seems to be around a poorly defined line of minor versus major crimes, a line they define.

The fact that the "emmisary" they sent us used to be a human?

Emissary of a people capable and willing to brainwash? Doesn't that ring an alarm bell?

Although the Yudas goat example exists, the fact is that any race that could do something equiring such vast amounts of energy could just as easily enslave us and put us into breeding/force feeding pens.

And it's even easier when we give up all possible defenses.

The fact is that if they wanted us as cattle they wouldn't give us the choice of going to a copy of earth free of their intervention, or expend such ridicolous amounts of energy towards letting us spread and expand inside our own solar system let alone outside it.

If they wanted us as cattle, it's in their best interests to have us healthy and expanding. More cattle means more of whatever the hell they want us for.

[Ghost Rider]

Ah well, to each his own.
I'll take the option with a space base, no crime (After a few years) and free access to the universe, and no fear of disease or for childrens safety.

I suppose I'm just naturally trusting of omnipotent aliens that don't bother calling themselves gods and don't demand anything for saving a quarter of the world from hunger/disease, must be from reading "Childhoods end" once too often

That's because you made up the hypothetical situation, dumbfuck.

So fucking what? I didn't state my opinion int he OP, why is stating my thoughts clearly moronic? (Retorical question)

Oh wait, you mean you don't like to be called a moron for agreeing with a moronic concept. Shit, dumbass...I guess this is why people are called idiots for beliving in Creationism, Young Earth and whole host of other choices.

I'm sorry if you don't cared for being called it, but you amply demonstrated such with going "I suppose I'm naturally trusting of these omnipotent aliens."

Too bad, you haven't given reason why the rest of us should be.

So it's up to you to WHY anyone else should place any sort of trust into these beings. Why should anyone trust them given they are treating us less then children(no weapons, all Crime THEY dictate is bad and oh yeah...we make every choice for you.).

In the end you whole situation is asking people do you want to be treated as a cognizant being, or do you want someone else to do it for you?

Frankly I understand the reasons for choosing to go to a interference free earth, but that doesn't change my opinion on humanity, namely:
People want to be lead (We have a serious case of herd mentality).
People who are starving won't care if they have to stop ethnically cleansing their country in order to recieve food and health. (Except for any dictators, but they fall into the brainwashing clause).
I seriously doubt that theres a person on earth dying from AID's,HIV,Cancer,Alzheimer,Parkinson that would say "Never mind freedom from the pain ajnd horro, I want my descendants to get the cure for this".

Also I'm not trying to convince anyone as to the wisdom of accepting the guidance of an omnipotent group of beings, but I felt like practicicng an argument anyway , But ignore what I just said, it does not reflect my actions in the following flame war/debate/argument against me for wanting to be a space travveling Gerbil.

If you want to fucking argue come up with a argument that isn't "And your choices are mindless slave in paradise or what you have now?"

Like you put at the end, you're content to being a gerbil. Some people aren't.

[Hillary]

Hypothetical situation:
Tommorow a massive pyrtamid lands from space and hovers over egypt, out of it comes a single immense golden statue that declares that it is an emmisary of a higher power come to bring peace and prosperity to this universe.
It destroys every weapon on earth (From guns/stabbing knives up to nukes), and as a gesture of good will cures Aids, HIV, Cancer and Parkinsons/Alzheimer.
The being declares that it wants to unite all humanity under one nation divided into seperate national area (meanning that you can keep living in your own home) but that every homeless/poor person will be relocated to a area of different ethnicity to encourage the break down of "racial" barriers (Meaning that in a few centuries there will be no whites/blacks/etc...).

It will also give a source of renewing perpetual energy sufficient to power eevry home on earth, will remove all waste (Radioactive, unusable plastics, heavy metals etc...), create 3 space needles as well as one on the moon and a self sustaining lunar colony, as well as bringing a new copy of Earth as it was 100,000 years ago into the solar system to relieve population density.

However it will govern every human affair, using it's vast knowledge,pre-cognition and power to ensure a golden age until the heat death of the sun makes it relocate earth.

However it decrees that all forms of crime will be discouraged and anything above negligible (Pick pocketing, 16 year old with 18 year old sexual relations) will be punished by a mind wipe with the victims recieving a new personality but will be rendered sterile to prevent any genetic criminal tendencies from spreading, also no indictrination will be allowed although being raised towards a religion/philosophy will be allowed if the child attends a group of any alternative viewpoint at least once a week (Unless the philosophy is anti-social such as hate-crimes [Nazis, fanatic "kill humans" eco-fanataics etc...]).

Would you stay on this earth(s) under this dictatorship or would you ask to be trnasfered to an alternate earth where non of this has or will have happened (No cures, no alien etc...).

My cynical mind is thinking this.

If they are helping us through sheer philanthropy, why do they need to control our actions - that is the sign of a dictator, however benevolent.

If their motives are not philanthropic, why are we letting them render us defenceless?

I wouldn't trust the little golden bastard - in any event, anyone who looks like an Oscar has to be dodgy

[The Grim Squeaker]

Although the Yudas goat example exists, the fact is that any race that could do something equiring such vast amounts of energy could just as easily enslave us and put us into breeding/force feeding pens.

And it's even easier when we give up all possible defenses.

We don't give them up, they vaporize every weapon on earth more lethal than a fencing sword or kitchen knife.
How do you propose fighting that? A Xelee nightflyer out of our asses?

If they wanted us as cattle, it's in their best interests to have us healthy and expanding. More cattle means more of whatever the hell they want us for.

Isn't it easier then to take off eevry religous person on earth and represent themselves as gods to them, and leave the troublesome Inteligentsia either for brainwashing or death, as well as not bothering with the poor/starving/sick of the 3d world?

Emissary of a people capable and willing to brainwash? Doesn't that ring an alarm bell?

Who said anything about brainwashing, if someone told you that you could bring humanity to a higher level, eliminate poverty/sickness/disease and have fun at the monkeys worrying about you possibly wanting them for food/slaves when you can create planets-
Wouldn't you?

Too bad, you haven't given reason why the rest of us should be.

The fact that they've eliminated disease, poverty, given us space travel and a free second earth/moon base, and are allowing us to exist without any of their interference or benefits if we want?

[Rye]

Humankind is clearly outclassed on every level in this contact, rebellion is pointless. I would rather be transported to a new world, so my mind has something to do. Freedom is a state of mind, since the aliens wish to dominate that, true freedom would be removed.

I don't think the benefits would be worth having everything regulated so much, but I hope the stupid and worthless people think differently so they don't come with me.