ROME - Italians would have to pay a 20 percent tax on pornography according to a budget amendment that cleared a first legislative hurdle, news reports said Thursday.
The proposed tax was approved at committee level and is expected to go before the Chamber of Deputies, Italy's lower parliamentary house, early next week.
The tax is expected to raise about euro220 million (US$260 million) to help reduce the national deficit and to help fund government tax breaks to families.
"I believe the porn tax is important not for moralistic reasons, which don't concern me, but because I think that at a time of difficult economic conditions for families it is right to tax products that are not essential," lawmaker Daniela Santache was quoted as saying by the ANSA news agency.
So--remember guys--by buying 'Lesbian Nuns Do Rome' you keep a child fed for one month.
General Zod wrote:How does this tax compare to taxes on other luxury goods? 20% seems pretty fucking steep, but that's probably cause I'm used to 7.9% tax levels. . .
VAT, the basic tax on most things, in the UK is 17.5%, welcome to Europe where we do everything bigger (tax wise at least)
"Prodesse Non Nocere." "It's all about popularity really, if your invisible friend that tells you to invade places is called Napoleon, you're a loony, if he's called Jesus then you're the president." "I'd drive more people insane, but I'd have to double back and pick them up first..." "All it takes for bullshit to thrive is for rational men to do nothing." - Kevin Farrell, B.A. Journalism. BOTM - EBC - Horseman - G&C - Vampire
How does this tax compare to taxes on other luxury goods? 20% seems pretty fucking steep, but that's probably cause I'm used to 7.9% tax levels. . .
We pay a total of 15% in sales taxes on most items in Ontario; which is combination of an 8% Provincial Sales Tax, and a 7% Goods and Services Tax. The PST varies from province to province; In Prince Edward Island the PST is highest at 10%, and in Alberta and the Territories there is no PST, only the GST, which is a federal tax and thus applies nationwide.
The M2HB: The Greatest Machinegun Ever Made.
HAB: Crew-Served Weapons Specialist
"Making fun of born-again Christians is like hunting dairy cows with a high powered rifle and scope." --P.J. O'Rourke
"A man who has nothing for which he is willing to fight, nothing which is more important than his own personal safety, is a miserable creature and has no chance of being free unless made and kept so by the exertions of better men than himself." --J.S. Mill
"I believe the porn tax is important not for moralistic reasons, which don't concern me, but because I think that at a time of difficult economic conditions for families it is right to tax products that are not essential," lawmaker Daniela Santache was quoted as saying by the ANSA news agency.
Lots of products are not essential; why single out porn?
By the way, if this had happened in the U.S. we'd already have three pages of standardized bitching about fundies.
BoTM / JL / MM / HAB / VRWC / Horseman
I'm studying for the CPA exam. Have a nice summer, and if you're down just sit back and realize that Joe is off somewhere, doing much worse than you are.
"I believe the porn tax is important not for moralistic reasons, which don't concern me, but because I think that at a time of difficult economic conditions for families it is right to tax products that are not essential," lawmaker Daniela Santache was quoted as saying by the ANSA news agency.
Lots of products are not essential; why single out porn?
How is it singling out porn exactly? It simply happens to be an untaxed item that could yield up alot of state revenue from the looks of things.
By the way, if this had happened in the U.S. we'd already have three pages of standardized bitching about fundies.
If they were doing it for obvious religious reasons or it was started up by some right wing group with an agenda, then maybe.
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
No, we just tax the living shit out of cigarettes. I hope some mischievous congressman offers a porn tax bill. I remember how the fundies pissed their pants and barked at the moon when states started lotteries to pay for schools. On the one hand they don't want to pay income taxes, on the other hand taxing something they don't like makes it a cash cow and less likely to be banned. A tax on porn and strip clubs would fuck these fundies up.
Elfdart wrote:No, we just tax the living shit out of cigarettes. I hope some mischievous congressman offers a porn tax bill. I remember how the fundies pissed their pants and barked at the moon when states started lotteries to pay for schools. On the one hand they don't want to pay income taxes, on the other hand taxing something they don't like makes it a cash cow and less likely to be banned. A tax on porn and strip clubs would fuck these fundies up.
Of course, going by their reactions in the thread about the .xxx domain name, taxing porn would only "legitimize" it, and thus be bad. Mmkay?
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
How is it singling out porn exactly? It simply happens to be an untaxed item that could yield up alot of state revenue from the looks of things.
Because it's...explicitly singling out pornography to the exclusion of other non-necessities. I don't know Italy's tax law, but I'm sure there are tons of untaxed items that could yield up a great deal of state revenue, including non-pornographic DVDs, music CDs, and video games.
If the criteria here is solely non-necessity, there is no reason pornography should be singled out.
If they were doing it for obvious religious reasons or it was started up by some right wing group with an agenda, then maybe.
No, I don't think so. If some legislator was pushing for a 20 percent tax on pornography and nothing else and tried to say it wasn't for moral reasons with a straight face, I think the bitching would commence.
BoTM / JL / MM / HAB / VRWC / Horseman
I'm studying for the CPA exam. Have a nice summer, and if you're down just sit back and realize that Joe is off somewhere, doing much worse than you are.
Joe wrote:
Because it's...explicitly singling out pornography to the exclusion of other non-necessities. I don't know Italy's tax law, but I'm sure there are tons of untaxed items that could yield up a great deal of state revenue, including non-pornographic DVDs, music CDs, and video games.
If the criteria here is solely non-necessity, there is no reason pornography should be singled out.
How are tax laws levied in Europe? Do certain types of nonessentials have to go through their own bills to get taxed? Or can you generally lump all manners of items into one tax? For example, how would you feasibly lump, say, alcohol and porn into one tax, or does each item have to be passed separately?
Could you reasonably tax both at fair rates? Are you that familiar with EU laws regarding taxation that you can legitimately say they're singling it out?
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
Could you reasonably tax both at fair rates? Are you that familiar with EU laws regarding taxation that you can legitimately say they're singling it out?
No, but reading the article, the distinct impression that I get is that they are singling it out, and until someone corrects me, that impression stands.
BoTM / JL / MM / HAB / VRWC / Horseman
I'm studying for the CPA exam. Have a nice summer, and if you're down just sit back and realize that Joe is off somewhere, doing much worse than you are.
Could you reasonably tax both at fair rates? Are you that familiar with EU laws regarding taxation that you can legitimately say they're singling it out?
No, but reading the article, the distinct impression that I get is that they are singling it out, and until someone corrects me, that impression stands.
More importantly, is there any legitimate objection to the tax itself, or is this just a response to the fact it 'seems' to be singling out porn?
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
General Zod wrote:If they were doing it for obvious religious reasons or it was started up by some right wing group with an agenda, then maybe.
Because, as we know, Italy doesn't have Fundies of its own:
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth
Could you reasonably tax both at fair rates? Are you that familiar with EU laws regarding taxation that you can legitimately say they're singling it out?
No, but reading the article, the distinct impression that I get is that they are singling it out, and until someone corrects me, that impression stands.
Quite possibly they are, but as has been said, its because it is a unnecessary product which currently isn't taxed specificly. So it joins the ranks of tobacco, alchohol, gas and possibly other stuff specific to Italy (over here for example it would include cars). And nobody will bitch about it since nobody can go against the tax in a European atmosphere without labeling the proponents moralist bigots while they seen to go to great lenghts to make that impossible. It is a nice extra income for the goverment (which most people consider good when its not something they need and use every day and its unlikely that many people will claim porn as something they need) plus it will be well welcomed, at least publicly, by the majority of the public (do to Italy being, obviusly, quite catholic). Win-win...
General Zod wrote:How does this tax compare to taxes on other luxury goods? 20% seems pretty fucking steep, but that's probably cause I'm used to 7.9% tax levels. . .
Most luxury goods in Italy are taxed at 20%
"It appears that our minds will never meet on this subject."
"If someone asks you why you're oppressing a world and you reply with a lot of poetic crap, no." - Lord of Light, Roger Zelazny
Joe wrote:
Because it's...explicitly singling out pornography to the exclusion of other non-necessities. I don't know Italy's tax law, but I'm sure there are tons of untaxed items that could yield up a great deal of state revenue, including non-pornographic DVDs, music CDs, and video games.
If the criteria here is solely non-necessity, there is no reason pornography should be singled out.
DVDs, CDs and video games are already at 20% tax in Italy (not all of them, but most are) as 20% is the luxury tax rate.
Those bought at the newspaper stand with various publication are cheaper; with the tax law porn both that way would be taxed, non-porn remains at a lower tax level.
No, I don't think so. If some legislator was pushing for a 20 percent tax on pornography and nothing else and tried to say it wasn't for moral reasons with a straight face, I think the bitching would commence.
Porn is in fact singled out. And the government is packed full of catholic bigots who fall over themselves to fellate the fucking Pope. It is done for 'moral' reasons. And it is done in order to finance various 'gifts', tax rabates, etc. planned to take place place just before elections...
"It appears that our minds will never meet on this subject."
"If someone asks you why you're oppressing a world and you reply with a lot of poetic crap, no." - Lord of Light, Roger Zelazny
fgalkin wrote:Umm...technically, those aren't Fundies, since they're neither fundamentalist nor protestant.
The term 'Fundamentalist' has changed in meaning since the ""original"" use in the '80s. If you can have a Islamo-Fundie, you can damn well have a Cathol-Fundie.
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth
General Zod wrote:More importantly, is there any legitimate objection to the tax itself, or is this just a response to the fact it 'seems' to be singling out porn?
Why is that not a legitimate objection? It is explicitly singling out porn, in case you don't know how to read the original article for some goddamned reason, so unless these outrageous tax rates are applied to every other kind of unnecessary luxury product as well (Italian-made Ferrari automobiles, anyone?), its stated justification is bullshit.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
General Zod wrote:How does this tax compare to taxes on other luxury goods? 20% seems pretty fucking steep, but that's probably cause I'm used to 7.9% tax levels. . .
VAT, the basic tax on most things, in the UK is 17.5%, welcome to Europe where we do everything bigger (tax wise at least)
holy fuck, thats insane! I pay a State of Rhode Island sales tax of 7% on most purchases (foodstuffs and clothing are exempt). I can understand , and even support a luxury tax on top shelf items, but 17.5% on everything? Thats downright oppressive!
"This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we’ll be lucky to live through it.” -Tom Clancy
Col. Crackpot wrote:holy fuck, thats insane! I pay a State of Rhode Island sales tax of 7% on most purchases (foodstuffs and clothing are exempt). I can understand , and even support a luxury tax on top shelf items, but 17.5% on everything? Thats downright oppressive!
Most items you don't need. Most foodstuffs, and essentials of living, including clothes, are exempt from any taxation in the exact same manner. More to the point, I fully support VAT, and think it should be higher.
This is mostly because my mum works as a VAT collector (Yes, evil is inherited) though!
But yeah, European taxes are, in general, considerably higher. 20% tax on porn isn't persecuting porn, it's moving it out of the 'essentials' category. Though I do not know, I strongly suspect that autos in Italy would have the same sales tax on them. Possibly higher, with enviromental conservation punishments added.
Superior Moderator - BotB - HAB [Drill Instructor]-Writer- Stardestroyer.net's resident Star-God.
"We believe in the systematic understanding of the physical world through observation and experimentation, argument and debate and most of all freedom of will." ~ Stargate: The Ark of Truth
NecronLord wrote:it's moving it out of the 'essentials' category
This would imply that other movies and books are still considered essential, which doesn't make a whole lot of sense. How can a movie be considered essential?
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
