"The Swarm War" Talkback (Spoilers)

Perseid · Post by **Perseid** » 2006-01-02 02:46pm

Found the exact quote from the Roundtable discussion.

James Luceno said, wrote:His (GL) objection to Anakin Solo being the main series protagonist was, I think, possible confusion with Anakin Skywalker in the prequel trilogy of movies. There would be too many Anakins out there!

emphasis mine

Anyway on topic, Swarm War was average as EU books go with the entire trilogy of the same kind of quality.

However I'm pissed off that Jacen never got the chance to show off all of the new abilities he now has. I know he uses his powers to create Force illusions and even Force Walks to see what happened at the Crash in the first book. I was just left with a sense that he should be doing some kick ass shit after he manipulated the future enough to get Leia to the crash at the right time to receive his message.
Hopefully the writers in the next series of books will write Jacen a bit better since Troy Denning can't seem to get him right.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2006-01-02 02:53pm

Thanks for getting the quote, CorSec. It's been a while since I read it and if anyone feels as if I misled them, I apologize.

Enigma · Post by **Enigma** » 2006-01-02 03:00pm

Ok. I haven't read any SW books since the NJO series started but what is the GFFA and what happened to the New Republic?

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2006-01-02 03:04pm

Enigma wrote:Ok. I haven't read any SW books since the NJO series started but what is the GFFA and what happened to the New Republic?

The New Republic more or less collapsed under its own in-fighting and ineptitude, especially after Coruscant fell to the Yuuzhan Vong in Star by Star. The remnants were re-organized into the Galactic Federation of Free Alliances following the Battle of Ebaq 9 in Destiny's Way, where the tide of war turned slightly into the Republic's favtor.

Darth Raptor · Post by **Darth Raptor** » 2006-01-02 03:44pm

Grand Admiral Paelleon is CiC of the GFFA's military? I thought the Remnant was only nominally allied with the Alliance, not a... *gag* member state.

JME2 · Post by **JME2** » 2006-01-02 04:20pm

Darth Raptor wrote:Grand Admiral Paelleon is CiC of the GFFA's military? I thought the Remnant was only nominally allied with the Alliance, not a... *gag* member state.

After the Invasion, Traest Krey'Fey was recalled by the Botham government because he had not allowed the Vong to suffer Ar’kai after the re-taking of Coruscant. Sien Sovv, who had stepped down at the end of TUF, took over again. Towards the end of the year between The Joiner King and The Unseen Queen, Sovv was killed in an accident when a ship he was on was accidentally hit by another ship whose Vratix pilot was flying DUI (and believed to have been orchestrated by the Dark Nest). Pellaeon, who appears to have retired in the six years between the Vong Invasion and the Swarm War (or forced out by the Moffs) was asked to temporarily take over the position of CiC of the GFFA military.

Chris OFarrell · Post by **Chris OFarrell** » 2006-01-02 07:10pm

JME2 wrote:
Darth Raptor wrote:Grand Admiral Paelleon is CiC of the GFFA's military? I thought the Remnant was only nominally allied with the Alliance, not a... *gag* member state.
After the Invasion, Traest Krey'Fey was recalled by the Botham government because he had not allowed the Vong to suffer Ar’kai after the re-taking of Coruscant. Sien Sovv, who had stepped down at the end of TUF, took over again. Towards the end of the year between The Joiner King and The Unseen Queen, Sovv was killed in an accident when a ship he was on was accidentally hit by another ship whose Vratix pilot was flying DUI (and believed to have been orchestrated by the Dark Nest). Pellaeon, who appears to have retired in the six years between the Vong Invasion and the Swarm War (or forced out by the Moffs) was asked to temporarily take over the position of CiC of the GFFA military.

It's impossible that Pellaeon was forced out by the Moffs. Its clear he was the leader of the IR, despite what the Moffs thought. Hell its made very clear in 'Force Heritic 1' that he leads the IR military and they are personaly loyal to him. Technicaly the Moffs were in charge, but when he told them they were going to join the GFFA, one of them pulled a blaster. He bitchslaped said moff and the rest from then did whatever he said.

So yes, the IR did join the GFFA's, though its much less of a single government then the NR was, more a federation of many Governments. Pellaeon retired after the Vong War, then after Sov's death, he was asked by the Cheif of State to come out of retirement and take the CIC position for the duration of the crisis.

And he did. He is over 100 years old, but still going like he is 40.

Archon · Post by **Archon** » 2006-01-02 08:23pm

RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2006-01-02 08:33pm

Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.

wait a sec doesn't the Thraw trilogy happen something like 10 years after ROTJ and in it Pallaeon had served 50 years under the Empire, if both cases are correct he would have joined the Republic sevice (as he probably doesn't separate Republic and Imperial service from each others) at age 11

Archon · Post by **Archon** » 2006-01-02 08:48pm

The Thrawn Trilogy takes place 5 years after Return of the Jedi.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2006-01-02 09:03pm

Archon wrote:The Thrawn Trilogy takes place 5 years after Return of the Jedi.

yeah I checked (misremembered the film (it was 9 years after ANH)) and based on that fact your math seems quite accurate.

Xess · Post by **Xess** » 2006-01-02 09:21pm

Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.

Well I saw a quote here on SDN that shows that average lifespan for a healthy human male is ~110-130 years or so. So it wouldn't be a far stretch to say Pellaeon's able to command a fleet. It's like a 60 year old Admiral nowadays.

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2006-01-02 09:42pm

Xess wrote:
Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.
Well I saw a quote here on SDN that shows that average lifespan for a healthy human male is ~110-130 years or so. So it wouldn't be a far stretch to say Pellaeon's able to command a fleet. It's like a 60 year old Admiral nowadays.

Another example would be one of the Bakuran senators in Truce at Bakura, who was still running smoothly at somewhere between 145-150 years old.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2006-01-02 09:44pm

The Truce at Bakura novel and sourcebook had individuals who were over 130-150 years of age and still going (albeit I think one of them had been using prosthetics somewhat as well.)

One of Han's friends he runs across in Agents of Chaos had some sort of rejuvenation therapy as well and IIRC he'd been well into his seventies or eighties before doing it (Roa, I think.)

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2006-01-02 09:47pm

Connor MacLeod wrote:The Truce at Bakura novel and sourcebook had individuals who were over 130-150 years of age and still going (albeit I think one of them had been using prosthetics somewhat as well.)

One of Han's friends he runs across in Agents of Chaos had some sort of rejuvenation therapy as well and IIRC he'd been well into his seventies or eighties before doing it (Roa, I think.)

It sort of makes one wonder how old some humans can get in the SW universe, particularly if they can afford the best longevity treatments money can buy.

The Original Nex · Post by **The Original Nex** » 2006-01-02 09:50pm

There's also a line in Survivor's Quest suggesting that "sixties" is "middle aged" for a human implying an average life span of around 120.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2006-01-02 10:25pm

Vympel wrote:It's his usual fucking moronic bullshit. There's no such thing as an 8km Super-class Star Destroyer, period.

Sure there is. What Hodge utterly fails to realize is that that class is completely and utterly DIFFERENT from the Executor.

The Guardian and the Vengeance are both Executor-class, because the illustrations accompanying both vessels conform to a 11-12 mile length.

The Intimidator was identified as an "Executor-class" in the Black Fleet Crisis.

The Night Hammer/Knight Hammer which was built after Endor was stated by Pellaeon to be as large as the Executor.

Most importantly, various WEG sources (ISB, GG3) as well as the EGV&V and the NEGV&V all flat out state that there were at least 3 additional SSD's as large as the Executor in service before Hoth. The NEGV&V adds to this that "several more" were under construction in that timeframe. It goes on to say that while the "total number' of such vessels built by Endor was never specifically known, it said that a "handful" materialized in the hands of Imperial warlords post Endor.

Its worth noting that one of the old SWAJ Q&A articles oncee speculated that there might have been as many as 16 Executor-like vessels in production (again, at least.)

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2006-01-02 10:33pm

Guardsman Bass wrote:
Connor MacLeod wrote:The Truce at Bakura novel and sourcebook had individuals who were over 130-150 years of age and still going (albeit I think one of them had been using prosthetics somewhat as well.)

One of Han's friends he runs across in Agents of Chaos had some sort of rejuvenation therapy as well and IIRC he'd been well into his seventies or eighties before doing it (Roa, I think.)
It sort of makes one wonder how old some humans can get in the SW universe, particularly if they can afford the best longevity treatments money can buy.

According to some of the fluff in the TaBSB, eppie Belden was 132, her husband was 30 years older. And that's not neccesarily the upper limit, either. One line of dialogue said that Eppie had "done the math" and that they could celebreate their hundredth anniversary "easily."

Furthermore, Eppie noted that their droids were as "good as any in the Core" (note that this IS A frontier world, albiet a weahtly one..) and that one could expect to see "two hundred" easily.

Edit: Given cloning technology and transplants ,prosthetics, and the like (Orn Belden, eppie's husband, had a number of prosthetic replacements IIRC.) one can probably expect to live indefinitely, as long as one has access to the money and technology.

Ender · Post by **Ender** » 2006-01-02 11:14pm

Frankly, I don't have a problem with an 8 km long Super class ship.

Assuming a common density, and scaling down proportions to 8 km, the ship commonly referred to works out to about low 10^26 watts depending on assumed accel. Give it comparable accel to an Acclamator, and it gets about 4*10^26. Now going by the illustrations, the armor plating is thinner as well, so with a good accel, thin armor, and that much power it would be about a star battlecruiser.

Make it a Fondor design so you don't mess with the established Kuatii naming comnvention (say they stole ideas from the Executor designs they had - after all they had the designs for a while before it got pushed through post Yavin). You have an explanation for a weaker ship that looks similar but is different that rationalizes the difference.

Archon · Post by **Archon** » 2006-01-02 11:33pm

Xess wrote:
Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.
Well I saw a quote here on SDN that shows that average lifespan for a healthy human male is ~110-130 years or so. So it wouldn't be a far stretch to say Pellaeon's able to command a fleet. It's like a 60 year old Admiral nowadays.

True.

Even in Battletech, which I would say is far less advanced than Star Wars, they have characters that are going strong well into their eighties.

DesertFly · Post by **DesertFly** » 2006-01-03 12:09am

I have to agree with Connor about lifespans. Also, even if medical technology can no longer preserve your body, wouldn't it theoretically be possible to go increasingly cyborg, until eventually you are totally droid or totally droid excepting the brain?

If I remember correctly, one of the charcters in (gag) Children of the Jedi had been transferred into an artifical body after she contracted some incurable disease. What I don't remember, (and really don't want to reread the book for,) is whether it was actually her conciousness transferred into that body, or just a carefully made duplicate of her personality.

LongVin · Post by **LongVin** » 2006-01-03 12:20am

Lord Revan wrote:
Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.
wait a sec doesn't the Thraw trilogy happen something like 10 years after ROTJ and in it Pallaeon had served 50 years under the Empire, if both cases are correct he would have joined the Republic sevice (as he probably doesn't separate Republic and Imperial service from each others) at age 11

Perhaps he is also counting for a cadet training school that prepares prospective military officers for military service. This would be similar to what existed in Germany in the early 20th century(or to lesser extent military academies today in the U.S.) It was not unheard of someone joining a military academy at age 12 in late 19th early 20th century Germany staying there till they were 18-21 then joining the military.

So if you count his 50 years of service from Cadet school he could be only in his 60s

Archon · Post by **Archon** » 2006-01-03 12:24am

LongVin wrote:
Lord Revan wrote:
Archon wrote:RE: Pellaeon's Age.

The Thrawn Trilogy Sourcebook states that he is 65 as of the Battle of Endor (4ABY). That would make him 97 during Dark Nest III: The Swarm War.

Unless my math is incorrect.
wait a sec doesn't the Thraw trilogy happen something like 10 years after ROTJ and in it Pallaeon had served 50 years under the Empire, if both cases are correct he would have joined the Republic sevice (as he probably doesn't separate Republic and Imperial service from each others) at age 11
Perhaps he is also counting for a cadet training school that prepares prospective military officers for military service. This would be similar to what existed in Germany in the early 20th century(or to lesser extent military academies today in the U.S.) It was not unheard of someone joining a military academy at age 12 in late 19th early 20th century Germany staying there till they were 18-21 then joining the military.

So if you count his 50 years of service from Cadet school he could be only in his 60s

I forgot to mention that Pellaeon lied about his age an entered the Raithal ( ? ) Academy when he was 15. I think that would bring all my numbers into alignment.

Illuminatus Primus · Post by **Illuminatus Primus** » 2006-01-03 12:58am

HIMS Brawl (later "Imperial Warlord" Zsinj's flagship Iron Fist) must be an Executor-class, because it was directly indicated to be part of the Lusankya/Executor's original generation of ships, and Razor's Kiss must similarly be the same class as it was a sister to Iron First.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-01-03 08:29am

It sort of makes one wonder how old some humans can get in the SW universe, particularly if they can afford the best longevity treatments money can buy.

There's a Duke Teta mentioned in Star Wars Chronicles: The Prequels as being 300 years old at the end of the Clone Wars, due to countless medical treatments, and organ transplants.

Then there's the B'omarr monk-method (remove brain, put it in a jar attached to a robot-spider). :P