US vs Naboo

[NecronLord]

Correct, if the us are going gung-ho so are the naboo otherwise it is an artificially tilted playing field

[NecronLord]

[1] This is Naboo vs. The US Armed forces, not the Republic vs. the US Armed Forces
[2] You expect to jam an INS system how?
[3] The hanger is wide open, A wide range of US PGM's can fly though a gap that size.
[4] The Naboo have about 60 fighters, they're not going to be able to cover all approaches in the weapons range while still attacking ground forces.
[5] There's no real reason for a shield and the ICS Locations does not mention one while showing the entire building in some detail.

1) Take and Hold. The naboo would send for assistance. Or you can have them isolated from the republic if you want, but that would mean our freind palpy (force storm anyone) would be there)
2) The fact that the INS ststem would be inoprable, due to different planetry conditions. gravity, sea level external pressure magnetic north etc. etc. and it would be relying on remote guidance.
3) so therefore they can't close the doors because they are open in the film They are bloody doors!
4) they don't have to, just take up position behind/above the wormhole on repulsors and shoot anyting coming through.
5)Abscence of Evidence is not evidence of abscenece.

If your going to bring quadrillions of beings with a technological advantage in aginst a couple percent of one planet then theres really no point in debat is there?

If where going to assume that US weapons won't work then whats the damn point of this? By the same hand USN vessel's might sink because of the composition of the water and aircraft might not be able to fly.

I note when bashing the mech heads you are keen on realism
right the water is clearly water, it has fish, nothing to say it is not, same for the air However the make up of Naboo is really fucked up and sensors set for earth will be affected.

The Naboo really are the shot first kill thousands type

Neither are the US particularly. Its a VS. The Federation are pacifists, that never seems to stop the trekkies

Lets see, you claime they could have shields. A detailed drawning shows none. The moive shows none. If you can't present any evidence of shields then you've got zip.

I said possibly, what part of that do you not understand
again
Abscence of Evicence does not equal evidence of abscence

[Manji]

The US forces would also have SSBNs and SSNs sneaking around underwater and getting close to Theed that way, then there would be no problem in launching.

[NecronLord]

Sensors, gungan allies, sea monsters...

(yes the gungans are allied here, its the planet Naboo not the people called "The Naboo")

[Darth Wong]

Oh, so now they're going to go nuclear and invite escalation against a member state of a galactic Republic? I nominate Manji for the "dumbest fucking idea of the week" award. It's one thing to argue the scenario without Republic involvement, it's another to pull out all the stops and use a nuclear first-strike against a non-aggressor state while STILL insisting that the Naboo have their hands tied behind their backs and can't call for help.

[NecronLord]

Oh, so now they're going to go nuclear and invite escalation against a member state of a galactic Republic? I nominate Manji for the "dumbest fucking idea of the week" award. It's one thing to argue the scenario without Republic involvement, it's another to pull out all the stops and use a nuclear first-strike against a non-aggressor state while STILL insisting that the Naboo have their hands tied behind their backs and can't call for help.

If we assume the republic doesn't exist then they have palpy to deal with...

[Sea Skimmer]

Oh, so now they're going to go nuclear and invite escalation against a member state of a galactic Republic? I nominate Manji for the "dumbest fucking idea of the week" award. It's one thing to argue the scenario without Republic involvement, it's another to pull out all the stops and use a nuclear first-strike against a non-aggressor state while STILL insisting that the Naboo have their hands tied behind their backs and can't call for help.

Actually after the first Proton torpedo is fired its reasonable to expect US deployment of tactical weapons at the very least.

[Darth Wong]

Against the only military target, which is located in the capital city?

[lgot]

I have a doubt...
...not the doubt that the side with higher technology will be unable to detect invasiors and the side with lowest technology will be able to do so...
...but the nuclear attack. How the USA will send the nukes by the wormwhole anyways ?
Also , Darth Wong, a question, by your own estimative the fighters of Naboo are able to cross the planet in minutes. That means they can cross the airspace of USA a lot of times with little or no chance to any USA plane ever to hit then. Is not that enough to assume that Naboo is the side with bigger chances to make a hostage of one side than USA ?

[Darth Wong]

...but the nuclear attack. How the USA will send the nukes by the wormwhole anyways?

The wormhole is stated to be very large (presumably large enough to fit warships, fly bombers, etc). However, if it comes out in the middle of an ocean as per the scenario, the chance of Theed being within bomber range is roughly 6%, assuming 2000 mile range. Not good odds.

Also , Darth Wong, a question, by your own estimative the fighters of Naboo are able to cross the planet in minutes. That means they can cross the airspace of USA a lot of times with little or no chance to any USA plane ever to hit then. Is not that enough to assume that Naboo is the side with bigger chances to make a hostage of one side than USA?

Of course, but the scenario simply asks whether the US could take and hold Naboo, not which side can deliver WMD's to target more quickly and easily. To hold Naboo is simply out of the question because it's a member of the Republic, and the US can't filibuster on the Republic Senate like the TF did. But to take Naboo implies invasion, and while the US has a large military and Naboo has a tiny military, a planet is still a very big piece of land to occupy, and ships take far too long to traverse oceans, particularly while under fire from fighters they have little or no chance of hitting. A Naboo starfighter could easily accelerate away from a missile right on its tail or even outrun bullets, which makes aerial combat against one exceedingly difficult.

Not all proton torpedoes are of such high yield that they qualify as weapons of mass destruction, and there's no reason why a squadron of Naboo fighters couldn't sweep over an American invasion fleet and hull a dozen of them at a time with low-yield protorps.

[lgot]

The wormhole is stated to be very large (presumably large enough to fit warships, fly bombers, etc). However, if it comes out in the middle of an ocean as per the scenario, the chance of Theed being within bomber range is roughly 6%, assuming 2000 mile range. Not good odds.

Then I guess what Naboo just have to do is patrol the Wormhole area to reduce this chance of 6% even more and to avoid any USA's dropping and by what you answered they do have pleanty of speed and power to do so...
I guess I return to my first post, the USA friends are having a big ego about this matter due the huge technological difference that Help the Naboo's side to protect them...

[Darth Wong]

I think it's just an over-reaction to the common Trekkie mentality that a tech difference is invariably insurmountable. If you took fifty thousand US marines and magically scattered them around Theed, they would seize control of the city in short order, and there's not a damned thing the Naboo would be able to do about it.

But given this particular scenario, the Yanks are hamstrung by their need to move their fleets over huge distances at glacial speeds of 30 or 40 knots. They have only a 50/50 chance of even showing up in the same hemisphere as Theed.

[Kettch]

Necron - I assume the INS being refered to above is an Interial Navigation System. Changing planets will not stop one from working. Basicly its a set of xyz axis accelerometers. Once the gravity for Naboo is calibrated for (so weapon does not overcompensate & become confused about its altitude), there is no problem with hitting anything as long as you know where you're launching from. For more info check a little way down on this page: http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/navy/doc ... PS/GPS.htm

[DodoBrd16]

"Oh, so now they're going to go nuclear and invite escalation against a member state of a galactic Republic? I nominate Manji for the "dumbest fucking idea of the week" award. "
______________________________________________________________________

We do have nuclear submarines that are capable of launching Non nuclear ordinance out of their Vertical launch tubes.

[NecronLord]

Fighters they have little or no chance of hitting

Which are sheilded against KT blasts

[Crayz9000]

Which are sheilded against KT blasts

Start firing tacnuke-tipped missiles

[NecronLord]

Which are sheilded against KT blasts

Start firing tacnuke-tipped missiles

Minion "Your Majesty, what do you require"

Padme "Go and call Seismic Charges Inc."

[NecronLord]

Necron - I assume the INS being refered to above is an Interial Navigation System. Changing planets will not stop one from working. Basicly its a set of xyz axis accelerometers. Once the gravity for Naboo is calibrated for (so weapon does not overcompensate & become confused about its altitude), there is no problem with hitting anything as long as you know where you're launching from. For more info check a little way down on this page: http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/navy/doc ... PS/GPS.htm

In the words of Apophis from SG-1

"I know exactly how it works!"

Aside from the fact that radar would not work due to the god like jamming, and they would have to fire from Visual range of the target...

Recalibrating the gravitational parameters...

Which unfortunately would a requre them to know the mass of Naboo. And B the missiles cannot be recalibrated that easily, to my knowl
age it is a ROM chip, They need to devise a way of adjusting it to work on both sides of the wormhole. Then they need to make said chips, and remove the old ones and place the new ones into the desired ordanace. Then they possibly have to test it. All in All far longer than three hours yes?

[Crayz9000]

Minion "Your Majesty, what do you require"

Padme "Go and call Seismic Charges Inc."

Easy to say when your *one* squadron of planetary defense starfighters has already been shot down with nukes...

[Jim Raynor]

Minion "Your Majesty, what do you require"

Padme "Go and call Seismic Charges Inc."

Easy to say when your *one* squadron of planetary defense starfighters has already been shot down with nukes...

Where is it stated that Naboo only has 1 squadron of fighters? And just how is the US going to hit these fighters? Never mind the fact that they can withstand multiple, direct kiloton level blasts.

[NecronLord]

Minion "Your Majesty, what do you require"

Padme "Go and call Seismic Charges Inc."

Easy to say when your *one* squadron of planetary defense starfighters has already been shot down with nukes...

Can someone please tell me why everyone thinks that the Naboo only have one Squadron. They only have one in the film, would this not be because there are only so many pilots a pair of Jedi can release?

[DodoBrd16]

There is no way in HELL that the US Armed forces would launch any kind of attack on an alien world until they have detailed intel on what the enemy can do and where their assets are.

This would mean heavy use of special forces which could be deployed by the navy using submarines to sneak Marine Recon and SEALs close enough to the beach for them to use small rafts of submersibles.

This recon operation would not be a short term activity people, were talking months if not years.

The recon units would then spread out, looking for signs of military centers or population. They would gather intel on the planet ranging from the military all the way to culture.

Unfortunetly for the troops they will have to hump back all their intel to the coast to meet up with a retrival team...since breaking radio silence could give away their posistion.

Once all the intel they had gathered(( as well as probably a few pieces of Naboo technology)) are reviewed the military will start moving supplies and units into place here on Earth.

Also as a result of reviewing all the intel it is most likely that our generals would come to the proper conclusion that Naboo has no real ground force yet their Air/Space force would be a major problem to any invasion force. They would then have the special forces on Naboo start to go over any hangars that they find and gather all possible intel they could. Long range photos and probes of their detection systems for the hangars.

Now when the word comes that they are to launch the attack or attacks, they could go a couple of possible routes. Either using Javelin type launchers and sending missiles into the hangar, hoping to hit a fuel cell or weapons stash.

Second is, they could try to breach the hangar, kill any guards(( they could have learned their posistions and patrol routes using long rang optics)) and then plant charges on the fighters, then destroy them.

Third is, plant a low yield war head, maybe Nagasaki yield near the hangar. If there are any convient hills infront of the hangar, place it on the side facing the hangar so you can atleast direct some energy right into it.

This would be the time that out special forces would probably break radio silence and inform the sub off the coast wether or not the hangar(s) had been destroyed, or, atleast their fighters.

If they have not, no go.

If they have, then the invasion force comes through the worm hole and launches a full scale assault.

[DodoBrd16]

Oh and if the Republic can get in on this war then so can the rest of the nations of the Earth.

If I remember correctly there is a Amphibious assault craft that the Russians have that can go incredibly fast over water and deliver a hell of alot of troops in one run.

[NecronLord]

Oh and if the Republic can get in on this war then so can the rest of the nations of the Earth.

If I remember correctly there is a Amphibious assault craft that the Russians have that can go incredibly fast over water and deliver a hell of alot of troops in one run.

Well I'm sure they'll be shitting their collective pants then won't they?

[DodoBrd16]

Heres the sight.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ship/row/rus/904.htm


Fast little bugger.