Chris OFarrell wrote:And I'm not entirely sure how accurate this is, but I heard that the PC version sucked ass because the engine wasn't rewritten and recompiled for a true PC version, but was half runtime emulation of an X-BOX...which is why it required so much more processing power for crap.
Sounds dubious - The Xbox uses an X86 chip, so the instruction set would be the same, no emulation necessary.
They might be referring to some system whereby API calls are translated at run time, via a glue layer, rather than being re-written. This would also slow down execution, but couldn't really be called "emulation".
Well frankly other then a LOT of translation having to be done at runtime (The X-Box's OS isn't *really* the XP/NT kernal IIRC, just based loosly on it, but it's been a long time since I've looked closley), I simply can't see why the game performs so poorly on hardware on the order of five, ten, fifty, one hundred times faster, even when you try to match the hardware as closely as possible.
If it's just using D3D API's and the underlying OS isn't really that different AND it has an ungodly greater amount of resources to play with, with frankly minimal overhead...where the heck is the black hole?
Chris OFarrell wrote:Well frankly other then a LOT of translation having to be done at runtime (The X-Box's OS isn't *really* the XP/NT kernal IIRC, just based loosly on it, but it's been a long time since I've looked closley)
The XBox's OS is a stripped down Windows 2000 or XP kernel. The userland enviroment is also stripped down.
If it's just using D3D API's and the underlying OS isn't really that different AND it has an ungodly greater amount of resources to play with, with frankly minimal overhead...where the heck is the black hole?
Apparently the shaders used where custom designed for the the graphic card in the Xbox. And untill fairly recently, graphics cards suck at runnng anything which isnt designed exclusively for them. Not enough processing power to make up for the difference.
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Chris OFarrell wrote:Well frankly other then a LOT of translation having to be done at runtime (The X-Box's OS isn't *really* the XP/NT kernal IIRC, just based loosly on it, but it's been a long time since I've looked closley)
The XBox's OS is a stripped down Windows 2000 or XP kernel. The userland enviroment is also stripped down.
Well there you go. I had it in my mind it was a custom job loosly based on the same sort of design for some reason.
Then again, I've never been THAT interested in the whole X-Box technology thing....
If it's just using D3D API's and the underlying OS isn't really that different AND it has an ungodly greater amount of resources to play with, with frankly minimal overhead...where the heck is the black hole?
Apparently the shaders used where custom designed for the the graphic card in the Xbox. And untill fairly recently, graphics cards suck at runnng anything which isnt designed exclusively for them. Not enough processing power to make up for the difference.
Oh joy. So they originaly made HALO, probably in the day BEFORE custom GPU progrmaing for shaders came out, originaly for the MAC then for the PC, got brought out by Microsoft, destroyed the code, completly rewrote the game for the X-Box and wrote the shaders for the chop job GeForce card inside, then were too lazy to fix it when they ported it *back* to PC.
Chris OFarrell wrote:
Oh joy. So they originaly made HALO, probably in the day BEFORE custom GPU progrmaing for shaders came out, originaly for the MAC then for the PC, got brought out by Microsoft, destroyed the code, completly rewrote the game for the X-Box and wrote the shaders for the chop job GeForce card inside,
In both Halo 1 & 2, they use lots of low-polygon models with textures which are reliant on normal maps and shaders to make them look half-way decent.
Without them it looks damn bad, and you get some spectacular horrible terrain.
then were too lazy to fix it when they ported it *back* to PC.
Gearbox ported it to the PC, and to be perfectly honest I've never been impressed by any of thier products.
"Okay, I'll have the truth with a side order of clarity." ~ Dr. Daniel Jackson.
"Reality has a well-known liberal bias." ~ Stephen Colbert
"One Drive, One Partition, the One True Path" ~ ars technica forums - warrens - on hhd partitioning schemes.
As someone on another board pointed out, if a Vista version of WINE was released for Linux that runs Vista programs, Linux users might be able to play the game Windows XP users can't. That'd be hilarious.
It would be a case of irony, but it wouldn't be funny.
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It should be noted that anyone who wanted to play Halo 2 that badly could pick up a copy and an Xbox to play it on for less than the inevitable price of Vista.
Vendetta wrote:It should be noted that anyone who wanted to play Halo 2 that badly could pick up a copy and an Xbox to play it on for less than the inevitable price of Vista.
Don't even start with that shit. Even with the mouse and keyboard adapter, Halo 2 on the X-Box is a shadow of what its capable of on the PC.
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"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
...Vista for more than an XBox and Halo 2? Jesus, where are you getting your operating systems from? 110-170 is what I sell brand new copies of XP to customers for. Don't tell me you're actually buying retail-boxed copies of your OSes?
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brianeyci wrote:If you're not a student how can you get an OEM version of Windows without buying a new computer?
You don't HAVE to buy a new computer, just part of a computer. Someone I know bought his copy of XP Pro OEM with a Serial ATA cable, and was in perfect compliance with the OEM licensing stuff.
I imagine if you had a buddy who was lucky enough to go to a college blessed by Microsoft, he could snag a copy of XP on the cheap. (I've heard of some colleges offering MS operating systems... even Server 2003!... for absurdly low prices)
I am still wondering WTF Bungie and Microsoft were thinking with the Vista announcement. That has got to kill the sales. By the time a significant number of people finaly get Vista, Halo 2 will have dropped in price. Microsoft is killing their shot at making mondo bucks on the initial full prices sales here.
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"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
The Microsoft OEM lisence agreement states that OEM copies of XP have to be sold with some piece of computer hardware. I sell 'em for 107 or 167, respectively, and toss in a two-dollar power cable. As for where to get 'em, find the small computer stores, the indie brick-and-mortar places. That's where I work.
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Wouldn't it be cheaper, and generally easier to simply buy an X-Box and pick up Halo 2 for that than upgrading your system to a brand new OS just so you can run Halo 2?
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General Zod wrote:Wouldn't it be cheaper, and generally easier to simply buy an X-Box and pick up Halo 2 for that than upgrading your system to a brand new OS just so you can run Halo 2?
And what the fuck do we care about the shitty console version of the game when a superior PC version will be made?
"If the facts are on your side, pound on the facts. If the law is on your side, pound on the law. If neither is on your side, pound on the table."
"The captain claimed our people violated a 4,000 year old treaty forbidding us to develop hyperspace technology. Extermination of our planet was the consequence. The subject did not survive interrogation."
Probably. On the flip side, we could just play superior shooters on XP and not upgrade either, making it a moot point.
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White Haven wrote:...Vista for more than an XBox and Halo 2? Jesus, where are you getting your operating systems from? 110-170 is what I sell brand new copies of XP to customers for. Don't tell me you're actually buying retail-boxed copies of your OSes?
By the time Vista comes out, at this rate, Halo 2 will be a classic previous-gen game you can buy for cheap and the XBox will be a previous-gen console for $99 or less (depending if Vista actually comes this year, which I'm doubting).
White Haven wrote:...Vista for more than an XBox and Halo 2? Jesus, where are you getting your operating systems from? 110-170 is what I sell brand new copies of XP to customers for. Don't tell me you're actually buying retail-boxed copies of your OSes?
Amazon will sell you an Xbox for $109 and Halo 2 for $30, and that's now.
And that's without being sneaky and using ebay, which can knock $40 off easy.
Still, the difference is a LOT narrower, if not dead even, if you're smart enough to buy OEM.
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Uraniun235 wrote:I imagine if you had a buddy who was lucky enough to go to a college blessed by Microsoft, he could snag a copy of XP on the cheap. (I've heard of some colleges offering MS operating systems... even Server 2003!... for absurdly low prices)
Or free for almost everything that you could want (I think the only major software not available is the full version of office), as long as you claim that the software will be used for coursework
One computer only tho. Still, a MSDNAA subscription is a VERY nice thing to have.
Alyeska wrote:And what the fuck do we care about the shitty console version of the game when a superior PC version will be made?
AHAHAHAHAHHAhAHAHAHAHHAHAhAhAHHAHAHHA
Halo 1 was a horrible resource hog on PCs why should Halo 2 be any different?
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