What really went on inside the Jedi Temple?

Cos Dashit · Post by **Cos Dashit** » 2006-02-15 05:52pm

In RotS, when Anakin went inside the temple to dispose of the Jedi inside, what went on? Were the children armed, and if they were, did they present a challenge for Anakin because of their numbers?

If they weren't armed and he merely slaughtered them, what do you think the possible outcome would have been if they all had lightsabers? (In a match between the younglings and Anakin, not the younglings vs. Anakin+ Clones.)

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-02-15 05:59pm

I'm not sure where I heard it, but they were armed, and since their bodies were found in one of the hallways, the fight must have lasted some time.

Doctor Doom · Post by **Doctor Doom** » 2006-02-15 06:18pm

In RotS, when Obi-Wan watches the security footage, you can see Anakin dueling with several Jedi in the temple.

Watch the movie.

Cos Dashit · Post by **Cos Dashit** » 2006-02-15 06:21pm

Yeah, but do you think that was a challenge to Anakin?

Perseid · Post by **Perseid** » 2006-02-15 06:33pm

Cos Dashit wrote:Yeah, but do you think that was a challenge to Anakin?

No not really.

Think about what your asking for a second and see if the points below answer your question;
1.Anakin is one of the most powerful force users alive,
2. he is a master of the Form V saber style,
3. he is a war vet as well as being more experienced with a lightsaber than they are,
4. and most importantly Obi Wan descirbes his actions to Padmè as "He was slaughtering Younglings"

Darth Raptor · Post by **Darth Raptor** » 2006-02-15 06:35pm

You'd be hard pressed to quantify how challenging the Temple massacre was for Vader. An individual Youngling, even a Padawan is no match for him; had they rushed him in swarms then yes, they could make him break a sweat. The fact is we don't know if they did that, or if they were split up engaging the stormtroopers, allowing Vader to take them out one by one.

There isn't enough information about their numbers, tactics or the circumstances of the battle to draw any concrete conclusions. If it had been extremely difficult for him, it might not have been viewed as such an atrocity. My money's on the whole affair being ridiculously easy for him.

Cos Dashit · Post by **Cos Dashit** » 2006-02-15 06:37pm

If about 5-15 clones can take down Jedi Knights, as shown in Order 66, wouldn't the same number of lightsaber wielding Jedis-in-training be at least a challenge to Anakin? It's all in the numbers, I thought he might be overwhelmed by 15 younglings.

Perseid · Post by **Perseid** » 2006-02-15 06:38pm

IIRC when Anakin arrived at the temple the Younglings crowded round him asking him what was going on and looking to him for protection. This would make killing them so much easier even for a Jedi such as Anakin, especially since you would never expect someone you look to for protection to turn around and kill you.

Doctor Doom · Post by **Doctor Doom** » 2006-02-15 06:42pm

If about 5-15 clones can take down Jedi Knights, as shown in Order 66, wouldn't the same number of lightsaber wielding Jedis-in-training be at least a challenge to Anakin? It's all in the numbers, I thought he might be overwhelmed by 15 younglings.

Oh, yeah, that logic makes perfect sense.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-15 06:46pm

In addition to the younglings, there were several more experienced Jedi, including at least two masters (Cin Drallig and Shaak Ti). I suspect they might have posed more a challenge, but the sheer height of Clone Troopers on his side may have very well meant Vader didn't have to do much more than kill the door guard, the youngling group, and Cin and his padawans. There's really no way to know for sure.

Chris OFarrell · Post by **Chris OFarrell** » 2006-02-15 07:06pm

"The Dark Nest" has R2 replaying footage he downloaded from the temples security system to Luke, Han, Mara et all.

In it we see a Master, a couple of Paldwans and some students manage to rally and form such a defence that the clonetroopers simply couldn't blast their way through. At which point Vader arrives and cuts his way up the line, kills everyone, then walks on.

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-02-15 07:15pm

Vader didn't just kill Younglings and miscellaneous Jedi Knights- he almost certainly killed Shaak-Ti, Jedi Council Member, who was present at the Temple at the time, as well as Cin Drallig, lightsabre master. The Ep 3 game also has him killing Cin Drallig's apprentice- in a really funny way

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-15 07:19pm

Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?

Yes, although the method of her execution is unknown. A cut scene has Anakin walking up to her as she's in mediation and stabbing her in the chest, but its non-canon, and rather silly on top of that. You'd think she'd feel the slaughter of hundreds of Force users within throwing distance and wake up.

Edit: Why did you delete your post?

Jedi Guardian · Post by **Jedi Guardian** » 2006-02-15 07:22pm

Noble Ire wrote:In addition to the younglings, there were several more experienced Jedi, including at least two masters (Cin Drallig and Shaak Ti)

Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?

he almost certainly killed Shaak-Ti, Jedi Council Member,

No I don't believe she was even a Council member before she died.

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2006-02-15 07:22pm

Jedi Guardian wrote:
Noble Ire wrote:In addition to the younglings, there were several more experienced Jedi, including at least two masters (Cin Drallig and Shaak Ti)
Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?

he almost certainly killed Shaak-Ti, Jedi Council Member,
No I don't believe she was even a Council member before she died.

The novel says she was in the Temple...so Vader did kill her.

And she was on the Council.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-15 07:23pm

No I don't believe she was even a Council before she died.

Yes, she was (and IIRC, she was one in AOTC as well). You can see her clearly on a council projection when Yoda is talking with Mace from Kashyyyk.

Cos Dashit · Post by **Cos Dashit** » 2006-02-15 07:24pm

So even experienced swordsmen weren't more than an annoyance to good ol' Annie.

Jedi Guardian · Post by **Jedi Guardian** » 2006-02-15 07:24pm

Noble Ire wrote:
Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?
Yes, although the method of her execution is unknown. A cut scene has Anakin walking up to her as she's in mediation and stabbing her in the chest, but its non-canon, and rather silly on top of that. You'd think she'd feel the slaughter of hundreds of Force users within throwing distance and wake up.

Edit: Why did you delete your post?

I messed up on something. I also thought that she was killed by Grivouse was she not?

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2006-02-15 07:26pm

Jedi Guardian wrote:
Noble Ire wrote:
Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?
Yes, although the method of her execution is unknown. A cut scene has Anakin walking up to her as she's in mediation and stabbing her in the chest, but its non-canon, and rather silly on top of that. You'd think she'd feel the slaughter of hundreds of Force users within throwing distance and wake up.

Edit: Why did you delete your post?
I messed up on something. I also thought that she was killed by Grivouse was she not?

A scence which was taken out of RoTS.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-15 07:26pm

I messed up on something. I also thought that she was killed by Grivouse was she not?

Also a cut scene (although I think that bit of story would have improved the beginning of the movie, actually). Nevertheless, as I said, you can see her later in the film, as the novelization also states, thus she survived the battle of Coruscant.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2006-02-15 07:26pm

Jedi Guardian wrote:
Noble Ire wrote:
Shaak Ti was killed wasn't she?
Yes, although the method of her execution is unknown. A cut scene has Anakin walking up to her as she's in mediation and stabbing her in the chest, but its non-canon, and rather silly on top of that. You'd think she'd feel the slaughter of hundreds of Force users within throwing distance and wake up.

Edit: Why did you delete your post?
I messed up on something. I also thought that she was killed by Grivouse was she not?

Deleted scene, and non-canon. 'Infinities' level at most-- but also non-canon. IIRC Shaak Ti's 'death' in canon occurs in the Jedi Temple, I'm not sure whether by Anakin or clones.

EDIT: Well, looks like people are sure on the ball in this thread...

Trytostaydead · Post by **Trytostaydead** » 2006-02-15 07:30pm

Wasn't there that scene with the teen running out blocking shots from clone troopers until he was overwhelmed?

I think partly the reason why it was also easy for Anakin/Vader was the Jedi Kngihts were stretched thin across the galaxy not to mention especially from their losses at Genosis. Most of the experienced fighters were probably out leading the Grand Army of the Republic at the time.

Jedi Guardian · Post by **Jedi Guardian** » 2006-02-15 07:35pm

Trytostaydead wrote:Wasn't there that scene with the teen running out blocking shots from clone troopers until he was overwhelmed?

I think partly the reason why it was also easy for Anakin/Vader was the Jedi Kngihts were stretched thin across the galaxy not to mention especially from their losses at Genosis. Most of the experienced fighters were probably out leading the Grand Army of the Republic at the time.

Right this is true not many experienced Jedi were guarding the temple, after all they didn't expect an attack on there own grounds. I would think that if that kid put up such a good fight there would be many more experienced Jedi at the Temple at the time.

Cos Dashit · Post by **Cos Dashit** » 2006-02-15 08:25pm

If there were several younglings at the Temple, and some experienced ones (like the kid that killed some clones), weren't there be more Jedi Knights or Guardians? I understand that many of them were out leading the Republic, but were only those two or three Jedi's 'watching' all the younglings?

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-15 08:33pm

Cos Dashit wrote:If there were several younglings at the Temple, and some experienced ones (like the kid that killed some clones), weren't there be more Jedi Knights or Guardians? I understand that many of them were out leading the Republic, but were only those two or three Jedi's 'watching' all the younglings?

No, there were numerous instructors, knights, and guardians still at the Temple, simply less (and of generally lesser skill) than the population pre-war, as noted in Yoda: DR. I would assume that the clones in suffiecent numbers were enough to simply overwhelm all but a few of the inhabitants (Cin, his padawan, a few of the younger students, possibly Shaak Ti) who Vader promptly dispatched.