Occupation

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-02-24 07:56am

Assuming that the Galactic Empire has invaded the UFP, Klingons, Romulans and Dominion as of DS9, how efffective do people think any of these would be at organising 'insurgent' style resistance? Would UFP, Romulan or Dominion civillians even fight?

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-02-24 08:10am

The Klingons would fight no matter what. To them, dying in battle is a sure-fire way to eternal bliss and glory. They also have the collective trauma from the last time their empire was occupied.

Effectiveness, however would be low. They're divided into Houses as it is, and from what I got from TNG the only thing holding them together is the Council and the Chancellor. When the government falls, the seperate Houses may not be capable of launching a coherent insurgency, instead relying on individual suicidal attacks.

The Romulans are many things, but stupid isn't one of them. They are proud, but from the Romulan War we know that they are capable of cutting their losses and surrendering in the hope of fighting another day. I don't see them blindly fighting an occupation to the death; they'll probably do what they do best - lie low and wait for an opportunity to rise again, even if it takes decades.

The Dominion - I don't really know. I'd imagine the Founders will try to stay out of the picture for as long as possible, and if they are at risk of being overrun, use the Jem'Hadar as a diversion - by making them fight to the last man/lizard - while they themselves scatter and hide.

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2006-02-24 08:13am

UFP for all it's high yadda yadda...would fall like a house of cards with the exception of a few pockets of resistence.

Klingons...if we go by anything of indication of the abilities at war. They practically would fight until exterminated.

Romulans would gladly welcome their new overlords and cackle at the level of power granted to them.

Dominion? Kill the founders, and they fall worse then the Federation.

LaCroix · Post by **LaCroix** » 2006-02-24 08:33am

Klingons would usually grab a knive and run screaming into a bunch of stormtroopers. No real deal.

To conquer the dominion, they have to kill off all Jem'Hadar due to their self-sacrifice tactics. so all that is left are the suppressed other species, so they won't get any uprising. Those guys were not able to do a proper upridsing for decades. They would rather welcome the Imperium as an improvement.

Federation people are no threat, they have the "moral highground" and therefore would try to negotiate theyr oppressors into moral acceptable beings. Ignore them long enough and they will adopt and flourish.

The Romulans are a threat. They have much expierience in espionage, assasination and guerilla tactics. also, they have an big ego and loooooooove their empire. And they are not known to be hesitating when they think force is needed to make their point clear.

Kane Starkiller · Post by **Kane Starkiller** » 2006-02-24 12:14pm

The real problem for any insurgent groups would be the number of Stormtroopers the Empire can deploy. You can have insurgents operating in Iraq where there are ~170 people for every U.S. soldier but the Empire could occupy all of the major planets in Federation, Klingon Empire, Romulan Empire with 1:1 population to troops ratio.
As for Klingons, they may spout their battle to the death songs all they want but we've seen them surrender plenty of times. When they see there is no hope of defeating the enemy they will fall in line just like everyone else.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-02-24 01:02pm

Keep in mind that the Empire is more than willing to use the classic "one thousand of your people will die for every one of ours" Brutal Overlord technique. But they might make it a million instead, just for punctuation.

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-02-24 01:34pm

Darth Wong wrote:Keep in mind that the Empire is more than willing to use the classic "one thousand of your people will die for every one of ours" Brutal Overlord technique. But they might make it a million instead, just for punctuation.

Just wondering : wha's their carrot approach ? Would they be lenient to a world that joins them voluntarily, and allow them to maintain relatively independant (ie, ruled by the locals but answering to the local Imperial representative) ? I can see governments like the Vulcans or Karemma seeking such a deal.

Elheru Aran · Post by **Elheru Aran** » 2006-02-24 01:51pm

Essentially, yes. War is inherently ineffective; when you've got intimidation on your side, that's a plus. As long as a planet is tractable and doesn't give their conquerors any shit, I can see the Empire being perfectly happy to leave them with a planetary governor and a small garrison. Said garrison would be much more than capable of crushing any resistance it came up against anyway...

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2006-02-24 01:56pm

Bounty wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:Keep in mind that the Empire is more than willing to use the classic "one thousand of your people will die for every one of ours" Brutal Overlord technique. But they might make it a million instead, just for punctuation.
Just wondering : wha's their carrot approach ? Would they be lenient to a world that joins them voluntarily, and allow them to maintain relatively independant (ie, ruled by the locals but answering to the local Imperial representative) ? I can see governments like the Vulcans or Karemma seeking such a deal.

well Palpatine was content to leave world like Alderaan or Chandrila (as long as they followed the rules) alone before they started activly oppose the Empire.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-24 02:16pm

well Palpatine was content to leave world like Alderaan or Chandrila (as long as they followed the rules) alone before they started activly oppose the Empire.

Both Alderaan and Chandrilla had significant political power in the Republic and by extension the early Empire. Why do you think the Emperor was content to let Bail live, when he knew (as indicated in Dark Lord) he was probably aiding Jedi and being generally seditious.

No worlds in the ST galaxy would have that advantage.

Dark Primus · Post by **Dark Primus** » 2006-02-24 07:28pm

I think few houses in the Klingon Empire would try to ally themselves with the Empire, knowing they can't force them out. Some I think wil have no chice but to swallow their pride. Some others would see that as a betrayl. And maybe could lead to civil war. But I doubt very much all the Klingons would suddenly take a knife and run towards his end facing a platon of heavily armed Stormtroopers. Some maybe would, but not all.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2006-02-24 07:36pm

Noble Ire wrote:
well Palpatine was content to leave world like Alderaan or Chandrila (as long as they followed the rules) alone before they started activly oppose the Empire.
Both Alderaan and Chandrilla had significant political power in the Republic and by extension the early Empire. Why do you think the Emperor was content to let Bail live, when he knew (as indicated in Dark Lord) he was probably aiding Jedi and being generally seditious.

No worlds in the ST galaxy would have that advantage.

on then the Corporate Sector and the Hapans. Frankly I see more evidence on that the Empire leaves those who don't cause trouble pretty much alone then against it.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-24 07:41pm

on then the Corporate Sector and the Hapans. Frankly I see more evidence on that the Empire leaves those who don't cause trouble pretty much alone then against it.

I'm pretty sure that it was in the Imperial interest to let the Corporate Sector to govern itself, since occupation would invariable have a negative effect on their outflow of goods to the rest of the galaxy (same with the Hutts, who were left largely to their own devices). You do have a point about the Hapans though; they were extremely isoloationistic, relatively small, and would have been a pain to occupy. I suppose a comperable power in the AQ could find itself in the same position. The Cardassians perhaps, or the Gorn. However, the major powers, UFP, Klingons, Romulans, are too large and influential to be ignored.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2006-02-24 07:46pm

Noble Ire wrote:
on then the Corporate Sector and the Hapans. Frankly I see more evidence on that the Empire leaves those who don't cause trouble pretty much alone then against it.
I'm pretty sure that it was in the Imperial interest to let the Corporate Sector to govern itself, since occupation would invariable have a negative effect on their outflow of goods to the rest of the galaxy (same with the Hutts, who were left largely to their own devices). You do have a point about the Hapans though; they were extremely isoloationistic, relatively small, and would have been a pain to occupy. I suppose a comperable power in the AQ could find itself in the same position. The Cardassians perhaps, or the Gorn. However, the major powers, UFP, Klingons, Romulans, are too large and influential to be ignored.

by true but then were not talking about the whole of any of those but more planetary goverments surrendering to empire if left alone (to a degree).

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-02-24 08:13pm

by true but then were not talking about the whole of any of those but more planetary goverments surrendering to empire if left alone (to a degree).

Well, even in the more centrally regions of the Empire itself, not every world was under the direct oversight of the fleet or a Moff. In the AQ, as long as your world isn't too significant, and isn't inhabited by too many "alien aliens" (ie, more alien than your Vulcans or Bajorans), you might very well prosper under Imperial control, and never see a stormtrooper your whole life.

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2006-02-24 10:03pm

I think the UFP might be the only ones who could mount resistance, but are the ones least likely to do so. I doubt the Empire would allow Romulans, Klingons, Bajorans, Cardassians and others to infiltrate. An Earth human might be able to pull it off. The problem is, the UFP is already a one-party state, so they'd probably knuckle under or gleefully switch sides like the real-life Count Laszlo de Almásy.

Post by **Gandalf** » 2006-02-24 10:11pm

Elfdart wrote:I think the UFP might be the only ones who could mount resistance, but are the ones least likely to do so. I doubt the Empire would allow Romulans, Klingons, Bajorans, Cardassians and others to infiltrate. An Earth human might be able to pull it off.

It's possible that some organisations might be able to start sugically modifying their people in an effort to look like humans and start infiltrating the Empire.

4Tran · Post by **4Tran** » 2006-02-25 01:10am

In general, resistance to occupations are only successful because they are aided by an external power. In the case of an Imperial occupation, it's unlikely for any Trek power to risk war just to aid an occupied population. At the same time, the brutal measures imposed by an Imperial governor should be sufficient to crush any budding freedom fighters.

Gandalf wrote:It's possible that some organisations might be able to start sugically modifying their people in an effort to look like humans and start infiltrating the Empire.

I think that this tactic will only enjoy modest success. If it gets too widespread, the Empire has many means at their disposal to weed out the fakes. After all, they have to defend against this kind of thing in the galaxy far, far away. The only group really suited for this would be the Founders, but the Empire might well exterminate them all for this kind of provocation.

LongVin · Post by **LongVin** » 2006-02-25 01:32am

Most resistance will come to an end with the Empire destroying a rebellious planet as an example of what happens to traitors and those who work with them.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-02-25 05:48am

LongVin wrote:Most resistance will come to an end with the Empire destroying a rebellious planet as an example of what happens to traitors and those who work with them.

That worked so well on the rebellion in SW didn't it?

PayBack · Post by **PayBack** » 2006-02-25 08:19am

Very few Imperials need lose their lives. The front lines of occupation would be filled by a few million Cardassian or other colaberating troops backed by a small force of 10 or 20 billion droids

LongVin · Post by **LongVin** » 2006-02-25 10:18am

NecronLord wrote:
LongVin wrote:Most resistance will come to an end with the Empire destroying a rebellious planet as an example of what happens to traitors and those who work with them.
That worked so well on the rebellion in SW didn't it?

Well the Death Star got destroyed. I'm sure if it blew up Yavin the Rebellion would of been crushed.

Enola Straight · Post by **Enola Straight** » 2006-02-25 10:40am

I think it is rather obvious that there will be backlash against the UFP for one glaring reason...HUMANS.

The Galactic Empire is run by humans.
The Federation is run by humans.

When the Empire begins laying seige to the MW galaxy, all (accusing) eyes will be on Earth, blaming Starfleet and the Federation Council for the acts of their "secret army"

"These are Federation troops from the far future," they'll say. "A force sent back in time with advanced technology to wipe out rivals and consolidate "Federation Imperialism" to rewrite the future.

Perhaps some UFP citizens will believe this as well.

Imagine, oh I dunno, Mussolini sending his entire armed forces back in time and defend the Roman Empire from the Barbarians.
With 20th century tech (guns, tanks, fighter planes...plus supporting infrastructure) Mussolini could easily conquer the entire planet in under ten years.

THAT is what the inhabitants of the Star Trek galaxy will think the Galactic Empire is.

LongVin · Post by **LongVin** » 2006-02-25 10:46am

Enola Straight wrote:Imagine, oh I dunno, Mussolini sending his entire armed forces back in time and defend the Roman Empire from the Barbarians.
With 20th century tech (guns, tanks, fighter planes...plus supporting infrastructure) Mussolini could easily conquer the entire planet in under ten years.

LOL. That would make a great Alien Space Bats Alternate History.

Elfdart · Post by **Elfdart** » 2006-02-25 03:09pm

NecronLord wrote:
LongVin wrote:Most resistance will come to an end with the Empire destroying a rebellious planet as an example of what happens to traitors and those who work with them.
That worked so well on the rebellion in SW didn't it?

The Rebellion had a way to fight back. What are the Feddies going to do?

Gandalf wrote:
Elfdart wrote:I think the UFP might be the only ones who could mount resistance, but are the ones least likely to do so. I doubt the Empire would allow Romulans, Klingons, Bajorans, Cardassians and others to infiltrate. An Earth human might be able to pull it off.
It's possible that some organisations might be able to start sugically modifying their people in an effort to look like humans and start infiltrating the Empire.

I think the green and magenta blood will give any Klingon, Romulan or Vulcan spies away.