Dark Lord; Rise of Darth Vader (Spoilers)

[Imperial Overlord]

came from botched trephination attempts

I have a fairly large vocabulary, but what the hell does that mean?

Its a procedure where you cut a hole in the skull. Used in the past to let out demons and in more modern times to relieve pressure inside the skull.

[MKSheppard]

I finally got and read Dark Lord; sorry for resurrecting the thread after several months; just wanted to throw my .02 in.

Hmm. Well, we can finally close the book on the Order 66 debate...

That scene does not make sense at all when set against ROTS. We have example after example of Clone troopers seeing a hologram of Lord Sidious saying "Execute Order 66", no explanation no nothing just seems to be a catchall for Kill jedi.

Why did Climber's group get told verbally "Kill the jedi", instead of having a little holographic Palapatine appearing on his HUD and saying "Execute Order 66"?

-----------

On the Imperator Class; I don't like that. It shouldn't be around just four-five weeks after Mustafar.

If the Imperator was available back then, why did Palpy, Vader, and Tarkin take a obsolete Venator to see the Death Star 1? That doesn't fit the Sith mold of "ULTIMATE POWER!"

----------------

Why did the Emperor just decide to go "OMFG T3H EVAL!" and start massacring and enslaving Wookiees just four weeks after gaining ULTIMATE POWER via the liquidation of the Jedi.

Shouldn't he, you know, wait and consolidate his power a bit more before he starts off with his plans for "Creating a Sith Empire?"

I know he's a Sith Lord with nigh UNLIMITED POWAR, but right now, he's very weak in many ways, the Senate is not yet a complete rubber stamp to his policies, and everyone still remembers the Republic.

More to the point, why are the Imperials already acting like well, the Imperials of the OT? It's only been four weeks since the declaration of the Empire...

There are large amounts of people who grew up serving the Republic and it's ideals in the Imperial Army and Navy at this point; the New Order can't have gotten rid of the Republicans in just four weeks.

The Wookiee Massacre and the Evil Imperial mannerisms shouldn't happen until about I think 5 years into the Empire; when Palpatine has built up a secure powerbase; and there are plenty of ruthless opportunists who have entered the Imperial Armed Forces.

[MKSheppard]

Now for something actually revelant and useful, LOL

the detailed description of Vader's injuries

His alloy lower legs were bulked by strips of armor similar to those that filled and gave form to the long glove Anakin had worn over his right-arm prosthesis. What remained of his real limbs ended in bulbs of grafted flesh, inserted into machines that triggered movement through the use of modules that interfaced with his damaged nerve endings. But instead of using durasteel, the medical droids had substituted an inferior alloy, and had failed to inspect the strips that protected the electromotive lines. As a result, the inner lining of the pressurized bodysuit was continually snagging on places where the strips were anchored to knee and ankle joints.

The tall boots were a poor fit for his artificial feet, whose claw-like toes lacked the electrostatic sensitivity of his equally false fingertips. Raised in the heel, the cumbersome footgear canted him slightly forward, forcing him to move with exaggerated caution lest he stumble or topple over. Worse, they were so heavy that he often felt rooted to the ground, or as if he were moving in high gravity.

What good was motion of this sort, if he was going to have to call on the Force even to walk from place to place! He may as well have resigned himself to using a repulsor chair and abandoned any hope of movement.

The defects in his prosthetic arms mirrored those of his legs.

Only the right one felt natural to him—though it, too, was artificial—and the pneumatic mechanisms that supplied articulation and support were sometimes slow to respond. The weighty cloak and pectoral plating so restricted his movement that he could scarcely lift his arms over his head, and he had already been forced to adapt his lightsaber technique to compensate.

He could probably adjust the servodrivers and pistons in his forearms to provide his hands with strength enough to crush the hilt of his new lightsaber. With the power of his arms alone, he had the ability to lift an adult being off the ground. But the Force had always given him the ability to do that, especially in moments of rage, as he had demonstrated on Tatooine and elsewhere. What's more, the sleeves of the bodysuit didn't hug the prostheses as they should, and the elbow-length gloves sagged and bunched at his wrists.

Gazing at the gloves now, he thought: This is not seeing.

The pressurized mask was goggle-eyed, fish-mouthed, short-snouted, and needlessly angular over the cheekbones. Coupled with a flaring dome of helmet, the mask gave him the forbidding appearance of an ancient Sith war droid. The dark hemispheres that covered his eyes filtered out light that might have caused further injury to his damaged corneas and retinas, but in enhanced mode the half globes reddened the light and prevented him from being able to see the toes of his boots without inclining his head almost ninety degrees.

Listening to the servomotors that drove his limbs, he thought: This is not hearing.

The med droids rebuilt the cartilage of his outer ears, but his eardrums, having melted in Mustafar's heat, had been beyond repair. Sound waves now had to be transmitted directly to implants in his inner ear, and sounds registered as if issuing from underwater. Worse, the implanted sensors lacked sufficient discrimination, so that too many ambient sounds were picked up, and their distance and direction were difficult to determine. Sometimes the sensors needled him with feedback, or attached echo or vibrato effects to even the faintest noise.

Allowing his lungs to fill with air, he thought: This is not breathing.

Here the med droids had truly failed him.

From a control box he wore strapped to his chest, a thick cable entered his torso, linked to a breathing apparatus and heartbeat regulator. The ventilator was implanted in his hideously scarred chest, along with tubes that ran directly into his damaged lungs, and others that entered his throat, so that should the chest plate or belt control panels develop a glitch, he could breathe unassisted fir a limited time.

But the monitoring panel beeped frequently and for no reason, and the constellation of lights served only as steady reminders of his vulnerability.

The incessant rasp of his breathing interfered with his ability to rest, let alone sleep. And sleep, in the rare moments it came to him, was a nightmarish jumble of twisted, recurrent memories that unfolded to excruciating sounds.

The med droids had at least inserted the redundant breathing tubes low enough so that, with the aid of an enunciator, his scorched vocal cords could still form sounds and words. But absent the enunciator, which imparted a synthetic bass tone, his own voice was little more than a whisper.

He could take food through his mouth, as well, but only when he was inside a hyperbaric chamber, since he had to remove the triangular respiratory vent that was the mask's prominent feature. So it was easier to receive nourishment through liquids, intravenous and otherwise, and to rely on catheters, collection pouches, and recyclers to deal with liquid and solid waste.

But all those devices made it even more difficult for him to move with ease, much less with any grace. The pectoral armor that protected the artificial lung weighed him down, as did the electrode-studded collar that supported the outsize helmet, necessary to safeguard the cybernetic devices that replaced the uppermost of his vertebrae, the delicate systems of the mask, and the ragged scars in his hairless head, which owed as much to what he had endured on Mustafar as to attempts at emergency trephination during the trip back to Coruscant aboard Sidious's shuttle.

The synthskin that substituted for what was seared from his bones itched incessantly, and his body needed to be periodically cleansed and scrubbed of necrotic flesh.

[Noble Ire]

Why did Climber's group get told verbally "Kill the jedi", instead of having a little holographic Palapatine appearing on his HUD and saying "Execute Order 66"?

Probably either because he wasn't high-ranked enough to warrant the message being beamed to him directly, or the Jedi that were part of the invasion simply weren't as powerful or important as those who's Clone commanders got the thumb's down signal from Palpatine himself.

On the Imperator Class; I don't like that. It shouldn't be around just four-five weeks after Mustafar.

If the Imperator was available back then, why did Palpy, Vader, and Tarkin take a obsolete Venator to see the Death Star 1? That doesn't fit the Sith mold of "ULTIMATE POWER!"

Well, it's not like they were arriving at some galactic diplomatic function. Practicality trumps "teh P0werZ" sometimes, even for a Sith, I would suspect.

Why did the Emperor just decide to go "OMFG T3H EVAL!" and start massacring and enslaving Wookiees just four weeks after gaining ULTIMATE POWER via the liquidation of the Jedi.

Shouldn't he, you know, wait and consolidate his power a bit more before he starts off with his plans for "Creating a Sith Empire?"

I know he's a Sith Lord with nigh UNLIMITED POWAR, but right now, he's very weak in many ways, the Senate is not yet a complete rubber stamp to his policies, and everyone still remembers the Republic.

More to the point, why are the Imperials already acting like well, the Imperials of the OT? It's only been four weeks since the declaration of the Empire...

There are large amounts of people who grew up serving the Republic and it's ideals in the Imperial Army and Navy at this point; the New Order can't have gotten rid of the Republicans in just four weeks.

The Wookiee Massacre and the Evil Imperial mannerisms shouldn't happen until about I think 5 years into the Empire; when Palpatine has built up a secure powerbase; and there are plenty of ruthless opportunists who have entered the Imperial Armed Forces.

Actually, Palpatine is realtively conciliatory still in the book because he recognizes he has to be, ie. allowing audiences with oppostion senators, or allowing Bail to keep on living.

As for the Wookiees, that whole incident seemed to be more Thrawn, and to a lesser extent Vader's doing. Tarkin's always been an evil bastard (see Rogue Planet), and he probably knew that he simply had more leeway to operate as he wished, since Palpatine was unlikely to remove him for committing genocide against a people who were both alien and known Jedi sympathizers.

[Cykeisme]

came from botched trephination attempts

I have a fairly large vocabulary, but what the hell does that mean?

Its a procedure where you cut a hole in the skull. Used in the past to let out demons and in more modern times to relieve pressure inside the skull.

This is interesting, since it implies Anakin was suffering from a hematoma. There weren't any apparent concussive head injuries inflicted during the duel, so it would imply that the heat during the lavabank barbecue was great enough (despite using the Force to sustain himself) to cause bleeding in his brain!

Why did Climber's group get told verbally "Kill the jedi", instead of having a little holographic Palapatine appearing on his HUD and saying "Execute Order 66"?

Simple. Commander Salvo received word that Order 66 was in effect, and he complied by issing orders to Ion Squad.
Clone Commanders receive Order 66, and relay it to the officers and troops below them. It's called the "chain of command".

If the Imperator was available back then, why did Palpy, Vader, and Tarkin take a obsolete Venator to see the Death Star 1? That doesn't fit the Sith mold of "ULTIMATE POWER!"

That wasn't the Death Star, it was the Separatist Great Weapon, constructed by the CIS. The Empire captured it and studied it, then built an even bigger and more powerful version.

As for Palpatine's actions, he'll do anything he wants that won't result in complete open rebellion among the general galactic population. Anything less doesn't matter, because he's ruling by force. He holds the unwavering loyalty of the largest and strongest military the galaxy has ever seen.

As for human officers acting like Imperial assholes, isn't it obvious? The reason why we only see assholes in the book is because the assholes are the ones who get promoted to positions of importance close to the top layer of the power structure.

[VT-16]

The Imperator and Tector classes were both undergoing prelimenary testing towards the end of the CW, as well as Venator production slowing down to benefit them, so it's not a stretch to have 2+ ships by a month after the wars end. I think someone else noted that this would put the ROTS DS scene at about one week or so after wars end, since Palpatine and Vader were in a Venator at the time.

About the wookiees, they were accused of aiding enemies of the Empire, and in the final issues of SW: Republic, their Claatuvac Guild of cartographers and navigators refuse to hand over information on their secret Hyperspace routes to Republic troops.
In a paranoid time when you have paramilitary groups popping up and grabbing whatever they can, excessive force towards a dissident planet like this could easily be justified.

[Cykeisme]

Yeah, anything in the name of galactic peace and stability.

[MKSheppard]

Clone Commanders receive Order 66, and relay it to the officers and troops below them. It's called the "chain of command".

Then why do individual clone pilots receive the order themselves in ROTS on their HUDs?

[MKSheppard]

As for Palpatine's actions, he'll do anything he wants that won't result in complete open rebellion among the general galactic population. Anything less doesn't matter, because he's ruling by force. He holds the unwavering loyalty of the largest and strongest military the galaxy has ever seen.

Actually, the war's over, and large amounts of stuff is now surplus; the Clone troopers are aging rapidly; etc, there is dissent in the Senate over his actions, he's not yet in a position to rule by force.

As for human officers acting like Imperial assholes, isn't it obvious? The reason why we only see assholes in the book is because the assholes are the ones who get promoted to positions of importance close to the top layer of the power structure.

How can the assholes rise to prominence in 4 weeks?

[The Original Nex]

As for the Wookiees, that whole incident seemed to be more Thrawn, and to a lesser extent Vader's doing.

You mean Tarkin, not Thrawn correct?

And with regards to the "Why is Palpy on board a Venator?" Saxton has offered the point that the bridge configuration of the vessel that Palps and Vader were on would be impossible if the ship were a VenStar, therefore, he postulates that it was in fact a larger vessel not seen in the film itself.

Take it as you will.

[Crazedwraith]

That's silly, we clearly see a set up shot of Venators. Why then suddenly switch to an entirely different ships bridge?

[Cykeisme]

Clone Commanders receive Order 66, and relay it to the officers and troops below them. It's called the "chain of command".

Then why do individual clone pilots receive the order themselves in ROTS on their HUDs?

The clone pilot who received Order 66 directly is likely a commander, like Oddball.

How can the assholes rise to prominence in 4 weeks?

Yes-men that gel with Palpatine's views, that he's taken notice of, would have been promoted during the war itself. Do you also find it strange that Tarkin (a man who acts, and I quote, " like well, the Imperials of the OT") has so quickly found the Galactic Emperor's favor?

Actually, the war's over, and large amounts of stuff is now surplus; the Clone troopers are aging rapidly; etc, there is dissent in the Senate over his actions, he's not yet in a position to rule by force.

Large amounts of stuff is now surplus? Explain please.
And yes, the war is over, but the clone troopers aren't aging any less rapidly than they were during the war. He's still in de facto and de jure command of the goddamn military! You keep harping over the phrase "4 weeks", so throwing it right back, what makes you think the Grand Army is any less potent than it was four weeks ago?!
Besides, there's an explicit statement in the very same book that new stormtrooper legions are being grown on bases located on Outer Rim worlds.

[MKSheppard]

The clone pilot who received Order 66 directly is likely a commander, like Oddball.

Proof?

Yes-men that gel with Palpatine's views, that he's taken notice of, would have been promoted during the war itself.

Nope. Doesn't work like that. You can't promote assholes like Tarkin very rapidly to the top during the war, when it's still the Republic, you have to promote people who pay more than just lip service to the ideals of the Republic; IE no obvious non-human hating assholes like Tarkin.

Large amounts of stuff is now surplus? Explain please.

The war's over, you think the Empire is going to pay quintillions of credits to ship obsolete crap back home to supply depots? Money that could be spent on new equipment?

And yes, the war is over, but the clone troopers aren't aging any less rapidly than they were during the war.

From Palpie himself:

"No less important, our present army of clone troopers is aging at an accelerated rate, and will need to be supplemented, gradually replaced, by new batches of clones."

He's still in de facto and de jure command of the goddamn military! You keep harping over the phrase "4 weeks", so throwing it right back, what makes you think the Grand Army is any less potent than it was four weeks ago?

Do you have any idea of how dangerous the first couple of months are after you've replaced a government with your own system? That's when the majority of counter-coups occur. Do you seriously think Palpatine, after so carefully plotting the Clone Wars to his advantage, plotting events 20 years in advance, is going to risk igniting mass public resentment to his government BEFORE he has had the time to put in place controls, such as the ISB, COMPNOR, Ubiqtorate, et al? Four weeks is barely enough to get the bureaucracy to accept new ideas; much less a complete 180 degree change from how they've done things for the last 1,000 years in the Galactic Republic.

Hell, at this point, they still haven't decided what to do with what's left of the Jedi Temple.

Besides, there's an explicit statement in the very same book that new stormtrooper legions are being grown on bases located on Outer Rim worlds.

And how long will it take for THEM to be mature? Hmm?

*Imagines 5 year old (biologically) clonetroopers. CHIBI-TROOPER!*

[VT-16]

To be fair, the Palpatine-hologram on Cato Neimoidia only says "Execute Order 66". This may very well be a pre-recorded message, since he doesn't address the pilot by name.

*Imagines Palpatine with name-list for every single execution*

"Commander Sr... Sre....Scres...uh...Commander, execute Order 66!"

*Crosses off yet another name*

I also think most of the humanocentric officers seen also happened to be accomplished Republic soldiers, who've already proven themselves in combat, like Admiral Screed.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Nope. Doesn't work like that. You can't promote assholes like Tarkin very rapidly to the top during the war, when it's still the Republic, you have to promote people who pay more than just lip service to the ideals of the Republic; IE no obvious non-human hating assholes like Tarkin.

Why not? Palpatine and his technocrats already controlled everything. COMPOR has been founded already. Palpatine already has seized control of the media and subverted the majority of the Senate - who is going to have bones to pick with whom his High Command promotes. You're also dismissing the fact that Palpatinist partisans may have kept some of their more imperious, authoritarian, and specieist attitudes to themselves until their leader was legally infalliable.

Do you have any idea of how dangerous the first couple of months are after you've replaced a government with your own system? That's when the majority of counter-coups occur. Do you seriously think Palpatine, after so carefully plotting the Clone Wars to his advantage, plotting events 20 years in advance, is going to risk igniting mass public resentment to his government BEFORE he has had the time to put in place controls, such as the ISB, COMPNOR, Ubiqtorate, et al? Four weeks is barely enough to get the bureaucracy to accept new ideas; much less a complete 180 degree change from how they've done things for the last 1,000 years in the Galactic Republic.

The Galactic Empire is hardly a fundamentally different mechanism from the Galactic Republic. The ROTS Republic is already 80% of the OT Empire already. COMPNOR already exists, as does the ISB, and so does Imperial Intelligence under the Isards, just all with different names. The Senate, the bureaucracy, the ministries, all of these are remaining the same as they had essentially been for the last several years. The only major change is Palpatine is now a legally-enshrined permanent despotic monarch.

Palpatine was able to do what he did because of his caesarist political stance with the public; his self-proclamation of the Empire was a fiat accompli exactly because the public nearly demanded it. They adored Palpatine.

Hell, at this point, they still haven't decided what to do with what's left of the Jedi Temple.

They never do. In ANH the precise difference between Sith Lord and Jedi Knight is lost on the Imperial officers, and they largely regard Vader as Palpatine's pet loyal Jedi. "You are all that remains of their religion" - it is likely that the Jedi genocide was not necessarily public or popular; the Final Solution of the Jewish Question was a private institution. Many may have been unaware of what the Inquisitorious was really up to, or how many Jedi really were killed. Palpatine gets away with publically killing most of them by saying they were part of a coup against the Republic; but the idea of the Jedi isn't necessarily evil in the public's mind.

And how long will it take for THEM to be mature? Hmm?

Many of the clones prepared in the later stages of the war were grown relatively quickly. HttE notes that the clonemasters during the war had learned to grow stable clones in just a year, and it was rumored had learned to circumvent that as well - though the secret was lost. The facilities were already established to replace battlefield losses, there would already be new ones constantly coming off the line. Palpatine's remark is sensibly a statement that more funding must be procured to prolong the program indefinitely.

[MKSheppard]

You're also dismissing the fact that Palpatinist partisans may have kept some of their more imperious, authoritarian, and specieist attitudes to themselves until their leader was legally infalliable.

The problem is, the general personality type that goes for that finds it very hard to hide their true attitudes for very long.

Palpatine was able to do what he did because of his caesarist political stance with the public; his self-proclamation of the Empire was a fiat accompli exactly because the public nearly demanded it. They adored Palpatine.

Because they saw him as the answer to everything that bedeveiled the Republic, corruption, greed, et al; he promised to make the trains run on time, in other words.

He can't just institute "Imperial Level Oppression" overnight; the public outcry will be enough to stop his plans or slow them down significantly; he still doesn't have the near total police state apparatus he'll have by A New Hope. What you're seeing is just the beginnings of that apparatus. He still has to force out long-serving Republican bureaucrats to replace them with his own New Order men for the bureaucracy to be totally loyal and compliant.

He still has to respect the public's will.....marginally....for now.

Many of the clones prepared in the later stages of the war were grown relatively quickly

Are there any sources for this other than Zahn's Thrawn Trilogy by the way?

[Cykeisme]

The clone pilot who received Order 66 directly is likely a commander, like Oddball.

Proof?

In the movies, we only see Clone Commanders viewing a holographic Palatine delivering Order 66- not every single trooper. Dark Lord corroborates this, since only Commander Salvo receives Order 66 directly. The pilot that shoots down Plo Koon receives Order 66 directly. He's also flying on a Jedi General's wing, implying senority of rank. Is there any other logical conclusion?

You're attempting to find a discrepancy here, taking up issue with the fact that Climber did not receive Order 66 directly. Unless you can prove that every single Clone Trooper received Order 66 directly (which the movie contradicts), there is no discrepancy.

Alternatively, perhaps only clones that have direct access to hyperwave communications equipment would have received the Order directly. This includes Clone Commanders (by virtue of their being high on the chain of command), and pilots (in their fighters). This second explanation still does not show any problems with Climber receiving the kill order from Salvo, the same way the gunner was ordered by Cody.
I still go with the first explanation: like any order, it went down the chain of command (but bypassing the Jedi Generals, of course).

Large amounts of stuff is now surplus? Explain please.

The war's over, you think the Empire is going to pay quintillions of credits to ship obsolete crap back home to supply depots? Money that could be spent on new equipment?

Why would the equipment even be surplus? Your assumption is that it's no longer needed, since the war is over. Yeah, the war is over, but Palpatine does still need it. To keep things in line.

As for "obsolete crap", are you by any chance aware of the technological stasis in SW civilization?

Do you have any idea of how dangerous the first couple of months are after you've replaced a government with your own system? That's when the majority of counter-coups occur. Do you seriously think Palpatine, after so carefully plotting the Clone Wars to his advantage, plotting events 20 years in advance, is going to risk igniting mass public resentment to his government BEFORE he has had the time to put in place controls, such as the ISB, COMPNOR, Ubiqtorate, et al? Four weeks is barely enough to get the bureaucracy to accept new ideas; much less a complete 180 degree change from how they've done things for the last 1,000 years in the Galactic Republic.

Exactly, Palpatine plotted everything carefully.
The "180 degree change" is hardly something that happened suddenly. Isn't that the point of the 20 years of plotting? At the risk of playing with semantics, he never staged a coup in the first place, so how would there be a counter-coup? And who will stage it? He's the hero of the people, the man of the hour, holding the Republic together, winning the Clone Wars, and surviving Jedi treachary.

Anyway, it's not as though Palpatine fried the Wookie city and laughed in everyone's faces. He still had to be careful, which is why the HoloNet news reports give a spin doctored story that insurrectionists on Kashyyyk were planning a rebellion, with Jedi involved. The traitorious Jedi only just tried to wrest control of the Republic, remember? That's the reason for Order 66.
He played on the galactic population's fears of another rebellion springing up, the memory of the recently ended war fresh on their mind.

And how long will it take for THEM to be mature? Hmm?

*Imagines 5 year old (biologically) clonetroopers. CHIBI-TROOPER!*

Almost humorous, I suppose.
However, the new clones would be ready before the old ones are dead. I can't even believe I need to point this out!
They don't birth a batch of clones and then wait until they reach ten years of age before they start a new batch. As we see in AotC, at any given time, there are clones at every age, at every step in the process. In fact, we see five-year old clones (ten years old, biologically), as well as fetuses growing in artificial wombs. At the time of the book Dark Lord, of those seen in AotC, the former would be eight (biologically sixteen), and the fetuses would be three (biologically six). Of course, there are in existence more clones of every age, continuing to come off the "assembly line."
The Outer Rim bases simply signify an expansion of the cloning program.

[Noble Ire]

Are there any sources for this other than Zahn's Thrawn Trilogy by the way?

Thue usage and testing of Spaarti cloning cylinders during the Clone Wars is noted in a few Republic comics, I believe (the Xagobah arc, maybe?). In any event, it was widely unused because the clones it produced rapidly became mentally unstable without the protective presence of Ysalamiri to cut them off from the force (and even then, some went insane eventually), and thus was ill-used during the war. However, the Kaminoans may have improved their own technology by studying it, as is suggested elsewhere IP notes.

[Illuminatus Primus]

The problem is, the general personality type that goes for that finds it very hard to hide their true attitudes for very long.

Stalin was able to keep his dick in his pants and execute tsarist officers in plausibly deniable circumstances; he didn't demand Lenin let him murder millions right fucking now.

He can't just institute "Imperial Level Oppression" overnight; the public outcry will be enough to stop his plans or slow them down significantly; he still doesn't have the near total police state apparatus he'll have by A New Hope. What you're seeing is just the beginnings of that apparatus. He still has to force out long-serving Republican bureaucrats to replace them with his own New Order men for the bureaucracy to be totally loyal and compliant.

And how will the happy Coruscanti citizens know about the officer corps being dicks, exactly? And humans didn't like fringeworld aliens for quite awhile.

Are there any sources for this other than Zahn's Thrawn Trilogy by the way?

Well, they couldn't possibly have the level of militarization observed accounting solely for the known original 10-year-growth Kaminoan clones, and it stands because there's no irrevocable reason to deny it.

[Ender]

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On the Imperator Class; I don't like that. It shouldn't be around just four-five weeks after Mustafar.

If the Imperator was available back then, why did Palpy, Vader, and Tarkin take a obsolete Venator to see the Death Star 1? That doesn't fit the Sith mold of "ULTIMATE POWER!"

Because they didn't shep.

The Venator has square bridge windows and is a square. The bridge they stood on was rounded and had triangular windows. Those Venators were just escorting whatever ship they were on.

[President Sharky]

The clone pilot who received Order 66 directly is likely a commander, like Oddball.

Proof?

Here's that specific clone's bio from the Guide to the Grand Army:

Captain "Jag" Jai'galaar CT 55/11-9009

Part of the famed CT-5 batch, then-Commander Jai'galaar proved to be an able and aggressive pilot. But his destiny was to lead not to fly. He commanded the 127th Gunship Wing at Geonosis but was demoted and disgraced during the tragic Retreat at Katraasii. But his bravery and talent were recognized by General Plo Koon, who drafted the Captain as test pilot for the new ARC-170 fighters.

Jag took to the craft with gusto and turned Incom's odd snub-nose into a fierce war machine. Jag was flying an ARC Wing over Cato Neimoidia when Order 66 was given. Despite his feelings for the Jedi General, Captain Jag did his duty.

So he was an air captain, a rank of considerable weight, and he may have been the commanding clone under Plo Koon during the Cato Neimoidia sortie, so it's reasonable to assume that Palpatine contacted him simply because he was the highest ranking clone.

[Mange]

To be fair, the Palpatine-hologram on Cato Neimoidia only says "Execute Order 66". This may very well be a pre-recorded message, since he doesn't address the pilot by name.

*Imagines Palpatine with name-list for every single execution*

"Commander Sr... Sre....Scres...uh...Commander, execute Order 66!"

*Crosses off yet another name*

I also think most of the humanocentric officers seen also happened to be accomplished Republic soldiers, who've already proven themselves in combat, like Admiral Screed.

Yes, but the pilot acknowledged it "It will be done, My Lord.". My hypothesis is that perhaps Palpatine personally ordered clone troopers that were in contact with members of the Jedi Council to execute Order 66 (we don't see a similar message being intercepted by Commander Bly on Felucia, however, we don't see such a message to kill Ki-Adi either, so it's hard to say either way).

[Mange]

Are there any sources for this other than Zahn's Thrawn Trilogy by the way?

Thue usage and testing of Spaarti cloning cylinders during the Clone Wars is noted in a few Republic comics, I believe (the Xagobah arc, maybe?). In any event, it was widely unused because the clones it produced rapidly became mentally unstable without the protective presence of Ysalamiri to cut them off from the force (and even then, some went insane eventually), and thus was ill-used during the war. However, the Kaminoans may have improved their own technology by studying it, as is suggested elsewhere IP notes.

Are you sure? According to Hero of Cartao by Timothy Zahn that appeared in SW Insider #68-#70, Spaarti Creations was destroyed on Sidious's orders while the remaining Spaarti cylinders were shipped away to Wayland.

[Cykeisme]

Spaarti cylinders or quick-growth clones are not necessary to demonstrate that there is a constant supply of clone soldiers being manufactured; I already addressed that.
The same infants and children we see in AotC itself would be reaching fighting age at around Dark Lord, and there are no doubt new batches at all stages at any given time.

[Vympel]

the detailed description of Vader's injuries

Dude- I copy-typed the entire passage already in this thread: Link