Galactic Civilzations II: 21 Feb

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2006-03-11 09:52pm

It just gets worse and worse. Now in what I'm guessing is the last mission, you are in a huge map, with about 8 or 9 systems, all already under control. Earth is in the middle and you have another colony over to the middle of the top right map border. Your goal is to take a planet, at what I assume is the lowest part of the map, and I think get a certain warship to it. Dread Lords, Drengin, and Kor are against you, with your usual group of allies as well as the Karx and Drath neutral. Earth and the colony both SUCK, there are no planets between you and your target, and the special ship has a shitty range, so you have to built military starbases to work your way down to the planet, and take it.

Also your tech tree has been all but reset. You have the first level weapon tech, as well as first level defense tech in each catagory and thats it.

Edit: Also my economy is shot to hell that I'm going into the red for maintenance for just the ships I start with(I have a -3bc at 0% production) I have to somehow set up a minimum of 4-5 starbases to be able to reach the target planet, hope the forces controlling it don't just start offing them cause I'm sure as hell not going to have the bc to set up battle stations, while at the same time research back up to planetary invasion, and unlike the earlier games, and unlike the other games, I start with just 5000bc in the vault, so I can't spend a few months burning through bc to get the needed tech and ships, cause I'll quickly reach maximum red and be completely shut down.

I'm not saying its impossible, just doing it is not going to be any fun.

Really, if your not liking the campaigns, quit at 5 or 6. 5 is really a good level, you have room to expand, you have plenty of allies to trade with, while still being overpowered. Your just scrapin' along, trying to hold yourself together until you can develop a ship that can start damaging these fuckers. It provides a real challenge(I don't know what I would of done had the Torians not stolen Dread Lord doom rays), while still basicly being the real game. None of thise mad dash to achieve a single goal, it feels like your playing a normal game with a very overpowered opponent.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-11 10:50pm

Shinova wrote:
Only 5? Interesting. Do you use below-common settings for your planets and stars?

I used abundant habitable planets, common planets and common stars and I'd be lucky if I could grab sixteen, everyone else would get 20 or 25 worlds in the initial rush.

Occaisional Habitable Planets, Common Stars and Planets.

I feel a bit more versmilitude when habitable planets are rarer, and ones above Class 15 are very uncommon excepting Minor Races.

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2006-03-12 07:30am

I actually got past the post-expansion period and spammed Defenders to get my military rating up and everyone pretty much left me alone, but I splurged too much on research buildings and so my economy and population were the worst ranked for the rest of the game. I out-teched everyone else (at the expense of social production), but came to a point where I just didn't have the money to support my ships.

Altarians started attacking me for some reason. I took several fleets of my most advanced cruisers and started wiping out their fleets left and right, and I conquered about a quarter of their territory when this weird bug came up and the turn button disappeared.

Ah well, I made a pretty bad start with my piss-poor economy anyways.

Ace Pace · Post by **Ace Pace** » 2006-03-12 07:44am

1.1 WILL include...

I can say that the 1.1 version will being including a Mirror Universe scenario -- cuddly Drengin and blood thirsty Altarians! Stay tuned!

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-03-12 07:56am

I conquered about a quarter of their territory when this weird bug came up and the turn button disappeared.

That's been happening to me, too, and if you wait a minute or so it pops back. It generally happens before an in-game video or one of the special events (United Planets meeting, moral dilemma, etc).

And for those who are curious : an approval rating of zero has some very interesting effects

Viva La Revolucion !

Hotfoot · Post by **Hotfoot** » 2006-03-12 01:26pm

Ace Pace wrote:1.1 WILL include...

I can say that the 1.1 version will being including a Mirror Universe scenario -- cuddly Drengin and blood thirsty Altarians! Stay tuned!

Damned Altarians are bloodthirsty bastards as is...should be fun though.

Ace Pace · Post by **Ace Pace** » 2006-03-12 01:30pm

For someone without the game, I clearly watch the site too much.

This has me up in hate drivin annoyance.

Digg is reporting that a website is implying that we want Galactic Civilizations II to be pirated. Absolutely not! Of course we DO NOT want our game to be pirated. We're a small company, every lost sale hurts us.

This got started because sales reports on Galactic Civilizations II have been much higher than anticipated. We've now outsold the first Galactic Civilizations in North America in the first 10 days. Last week we were apparently the #1 PC game at Walmart.

Naturally, some peple have taken the conclusion that because we don't have copy protection on our game, that we invite piracy. That is not the case, we simply think there are other ways to stop piracy than CD checks, strict DRM, etc.

What we do is provide a serial # that users can choose to enter when they install and use that unique serial # to download free and frequent updates.

Our license allows you to install the game onto as many machines that you own that you want as long as only one copy is being used at once. How many sales are lost because people want to have a game on their laptop and desktop and don't want to drag CDs around so choose not to buy the game?

Our company also makes utility software. We've been around a long time -- 14 years now. Our software gets pirated. We don't like it but piracy is a fact of life. The question isn't about eliminating it, it's about reducing it and trying to make sure that people who would buy your product buy it instead of steal it.

Our primary weapon to fight piracy is through rewarding customers through convenient, frequent, free updates.

If you make it easy for users to buy and make full use of your product or service legitimately then we believe that you'll gain more users from that convenience than you'll lose from piracy.

We realize that some people or companies might feel threatened at any evidence that implies that draconian DRM schemes or CD copy protection may not make that big of a difference in sales.

For example, we were quite disturbed to discover that the company that makes Starforce provided a working URL to a list of pirated GalCiv II torrents. I'm not sure whether what they did was illegal or not, but it's troubling nevertheless and was totally unnecessary.

All software is pirated, there's no way around it. We've been making software for over 10 years. We don't like our software being pirated. Like I said, every lost sales has an impact on us. But there are other ways to reduce it than through draconian copy protection systems.

Incidentally, the site that Starforce's forum admin linked to "prove" how much our software was being pirated we visited, followed the instructions on the site to get our game removed and the links were removed within a couple of hours. We'll continue to follow-up with them.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-12 01:31pm

I have never been agressively attacked by an Evil civilization.

Attackers in all of my games that include both evil and good civilizations in equal numbers.
----------Game 1
Drengin attacked by Altarians
----------Game 2
Altarians sneak attack me, get beaten into white peace.
Altarians attack Korx and Drath.
----------Game 3
Just a duel scenario between me and Terrans, doesn't count.
------------- Game 4
Terrans and Torians tagteam Drengin Empire.
Torians declare that the Drengin were Cleansed and that I shall too.
Smackdown occurs.
Terrans declare war afterwards.

I have never seen an Evil Civ besides myself survive, come to think of it, except one game of the Yor where they were so isolated only I bothered to attack them.

Also, is it just me or can you defeat an entire enemy power if they have few planets by making uber-fast ships, and invading and clearing the orbits of their planets and then landing troopships in the same week? This blitzkrieg seriously damages their economy and you can often get peace by giving one planet back and a bit of cash.

Now, it usually only works if you can sneak close enough not to tip them off (thus being harder at actual competant AI settings), and you have to get the invasions to work, but it often is gigantically cool.

On another note, Best Planet Ever- Class 17, with a +100% Research, a +700% Research, and a +700% manufacturing. Also had a moon for another +10% production. Amazing.

Netko · Post by **Netko** » 2006-03-12 02:22pm

On a fluke, my most recent Earth was +700% manu., +100% manu, +300% research, +300% food. The starting production rush was insane. I was getting more colonization ships then I knew where to send them.

McNum · Post by **McNum** » 2006-03-12 07:50pm

I bought the download version of the game, and it looks to be pretty fun. Although the Beginner level was kind of... meh. But hey, it's Beginner, it's supposed to be that way. I did practically conquer the galaxy with fighters, so I never really saw any ship bigger than medium.

I kind of think that the research speed is too slow for a medium size galaxy, though. But I noticed that I can change that.

It is, however, kind of nice to have a 4X game you can beat in an evening. Uusually these games can really drag on, even after it's clear who's winning. I love that the enemies surrender when they can't win. I wish more games had that.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2006-03-12 07:58pm

Well this series it's totally true that that game comes down to: It's the economy Stupid.

by building large amounts of trade, and a few recreation and embassy structures along with moderate factory and research, I can now keep my people happy, and keep myself not just out of debt, but spying on all my neighbors, trading stolen techs to the neighbors that I like and I am pretty well able to refit my whole fleets at times.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-12 09:47pm

McNum wrote:I bought the download version of the game, and it looks to be pretty fun. Although the Beginner level was kind of... meh. But hey, it's Beginner, it's supposed to be that way. I did practically conquer the galaxy with fighters, so I never really saw any ship bigger than medium.

I kind of think that the research speed is too slow for a medium size galaxy, though. But I noticed that I can change that.

It is, however, kind of nice to have a 4X game you can beat in an evening. Uusually these games can really drag on, even after it's clear who's winning. I love that the enemies surrender when they can't win. I wish more games had that.

Beginner has the Lowest AI with like 25% economy compared to yours (they have a -75% penalty, IE). Set it to Challenging for 75% Economy and an AI that analyses what you're doing and tries to counter. Or try Intelligent for you and the AI both being equal and the highest AI routines enabled. It's crazy.

Galaxies on Large usually see Medium ships, with Large ones in the endgame if you try hard to get them. Huge and Gigantic will often see Large and Huge hulls, respectively.

I'm currently playing The Foundation, a Research power with minor Economic and Influence bonuses. I'm facing the Classic Six opponents [Altarian, Torian, Human, Drengin, Yor, and Arcean] at Challenging Difficulty [Bright AI]. I've hyperteched so bad it hurts- I swear to Liet that I once researched 3 technologies in a single week. I swear, I had so much research money it overflowed and sent me from Space Weapons to Mass Driver II.

My people must be on drugs, too. I have Ultra Spices and 2 Morale Resources up to Mining Center. At 49% taxes I have a 96% approval rating. Crazy, man. I have 8 planets at 100% approval, one at 98 (my tax-farming planet Anacreon), and one at 89 (my capital Terminus).

I didn't think I was going to make it, at first. I made colony ships, but by 8 planets my economy was nosediving at -60 BC/turn. I actually started an AAR, and titled it "Decline and Fall of the Foundation", expecting to be pwned. I wasn't. In fact, because of their constant war with the Drengin, the Terrans are below me. I lolled when the Drengin attacked Earth's nearby mining starbases, as I waltzed in with Fast Constructors and stole the newly uncovered Economic and Research resources before the Drengin or Terran constructors could arrive.

By the end, I came out with 10 Planets, only 3 Class 8 or Below, and 2 above 13. The economy took a few dives, but I pulled out (at 78 bc at one point!) and now have the greatest research and economy in the game. Time to hypertech.

Isn't it hillarious when you play such a large galaxy that the United Planets decides between you or maybe just you and one other empire? I voted the Galactic Prison to myself in the first meeting.

Exceptionally glad I did not ally with Evil despite dipping into it at one point from events (+49% research on Konam, my Tech World #1 of 3? How can I resist?) (I then chose a Good choice on an event to get back Neutral when I researched Ethics). UP restricted Evil to 3 trade routes, and I need trade routes to up relations since my military is teh suck.

Yosemite is right, Economy is the Key- and +50% tax income from Star Democracy is worth whatever you need to do to make approval. It's not hard to keep in power despite the insecurity of being a democracy if you're not being owned by the AI and having to up taxes or the like.

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-03-12 10:21pm

Well, March 12 has come and gone and GalCiv2 still hasn't fucking hit stores here.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-03-12 10:42pm

Glad I didn't wait for it to come out here

What the fuck kind of street date is MONDAY anyway?

MRDOD, you must be way, way better than me. I sometimes get a decent economy - if I take econ bonuses - but otherwise i'm constantly cruising zero dollars, selling tech/ships for money, lowering industry, etc. Bah!

RRoan · Post by **RRoan** » 2006-03-12 10:51pm

On my current game (gigantic, with three other major races), I have roughly 65,000 credits. It goes up by the hundreds with each turn. This game has plenty of fun times.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-03-12 10:52pm

Yeah, one of my mates usually has 15k in the bank by year 2. Shits me to tears.

PS, the AU release is pushed back to 21st. Sorry Vympel :S

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-12 11:26pm

Stark wrote: MRDOD, you must be way, way better than me. I sometimes get a decent economy - if I take econ bonuses - but otherwise i'm constantly cruising zero dollars, selling tech/ships for money, lowering industry, etc. Bah!

Rush to as many planets as possible. Set your survey ship on autosurvey- make sure you have Abundant Anomalies! It gives you teh cashzors for extra ships!.

It doesn't matter how far you dip as long as you maintain at least 70% production and a tax that doesn't send you into the red approval numbers. I usually go to 60%. Sell techs that are nonmilitary like Life Support and Sensors to the AI for a bit of extra cash.

You MUST buy a colony every turn until you get down to about 1600 BC (your economy will nosedive, so you need that money for cushion to avoid production freeze until you can bring yourself back level). Don't bother scouting, just send them towards stars (hopefully you are not the Terrans with no planet minimap abilities). Send them towards the closest star, hopefully with a lot of planets around it and thus better chances of a good world.

Scouting is for pussies, use the Scoutship to get money from anomalies (AVOID WORMHOLES, they usually put you out of range and kill time and lose shitloads of cash). Scouting will be the colony ship arriving in uncharted territory. To save time, only look at stars. If you get close enough to see the star, click it to see the number of habitable planets. If there are none, don't bother clearing the fog if there's still some around it's planets and move on. Once you found a colony, now you have more range. Keep looking and looking until you run out because the AI has arrived at your borders. Scrap any remaining colonies for cash. You're done, hopefully you have quite a few.

Constructors are a secondary priority, but try to send them towards the farthest resources first. AIs usually won't go for stuff inside your borders until you wait a while. Exceptions are planets, you must colonize that shitty Class 5 ot 6 world inside your main system in order to keep AI colonies off your back. You'll get plenty of warning if you have good sensors, but make sure you ahve enough cash. I usually do it right away with my slow colony starting ship to make sure they stay away, despite how it doesn't run a profit.

Now, find one planet, preferably a Class 15 or above (I like 19s and the like). Build 3 Xeno Farms, 3 Entertainment Centers, and fill the rest (1 Eco Capital, rest Markets). That planet is now the center of your empire, do not lose it.

Also, build starports whenever you reach a new planet and use it to build the new colony ships, otherwise you'll take longer. The only exception is when the planet is in the same system or very close, in which case the extra weeks or 200 bc of construction isn't worth it.

Rush research to Impulse Drive for extra drives and those +speed bonuses you get from better spacefolding techniques. You essentially not only get better drives, you get +1 parsec/week just from researching it.

SPECIALIZE. I cannot stress how important it is to have a commerce world and a manufacturing world and a research world or even multiple ones. Generalist worlds and such are shitty for everything, instead of awesome for one thing. Try not to specialize too hard until your expansion is done lest you find a world with precursor shit.

Build an Economic Starbase so that it hits both your Manufacturing and Economic World (if possible, if not, choose or make two). If possible, your research one, too.

Churn out shitty Defenders for a while, 2-4 per planet, it will keep you out of war for a few years while you research Medium Hulls and get the weaponry. I managed to have 2 defenders per planet, just refusing demands over and over. The enemies got to Wary relations rating, but then I started churning out Wienis-class Cruisers with 6 attack and 2 defense, about 1 every other week. They gained a new respect of me instantaneously.

Unless you're going for Good, weigh the options carefully for Neutrality. It is extremely important that you pick Evil on important ones, such as +Research or +Economy, and choose Good on things that take money or morale (which is dime-a-dozen once you get an economy since you can cut taxes back to 49 or 39%) the like to keep your rating up. Goodies must choose Neutral and Good, unless it is too tempting.

Choosing Luck Bonus apparantly will make you get more events, thus letting you choose Bonuses more often while staying Neutral (because you get more Goods).

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-03-12 11:34pm

Thanks for the advice! I pretty much do all that already. Do you end up filling your c5 planets with research/econ and just setting them to research and forget about them? If I built 3 farms and 3 entertainment, I'd have a fucking riot. I have massive problems keeping anything over 15b people happy on one world. I'm glad I'm not alone in having a broken economy at the start

I know pop and markets influence money... I'm not sure I understand how to exploit it, though. I guess population gives you your tax base, and markets influence how much you can tax them, or something. :S

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-03-12 11:38pm

Stark wrote: PS, the AU release is pushed back to 21st. Sorry Vympel :S

Where did you learn that?

Actually, the release date of March 12th was listed as Sunday for EB Games, which is even more ridiculous, new games don't get delivered to stores on a bloody Sunday. I rang up Games Men, they had a release date of the 3rd, but they hadn't gotten their stock either, so same shit. *sigh*

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-12 11:44pm

Stark wrote:Thanks for the advice! I pretty much do all that already. Do you end up filling your c5 planets with research/econ and just setting them to research and forget about them? If I built 3 farms and 3 entertainment, I'd have a fucking riot. I have massive problems keeping anything over 15b people happy on one world. I'm glad I'm not alone in having a broken economy at the start

I know pop and markets influence money... I'm not sure I understand how to exploit it, though. I guess population gives you your tax base, and markets influence how much you can tax them, or something. :S

Category five? Mars-like... hmmm... I always do this:
1 Initial Colony, 1 Entertainment Center, 3 Research. Set to Research, ignore. This is a Research Colony, not a main Research World, so Tech Cap is for a Class 12 or so world that's built like this but with a Farm and a Factory included.

The key to the commerce world is Extreme Entertainment or above, and a high class world. And a Morale Resource, if possible. 3 Xeno Farms and 3 Extreme Sports Arenas is doable, trust me. If you feel insecure with the risk, try 4 Morale buildings. The +14 bonus from Planet Quality or so also helps a ton, making the world good. A paridise-like world will not only have more room for seven pop structures (3 Farms, 4 Morale), it will have room for a shitload of Market Centers.

Markets will lessentially increase the amount of money you get per person on the world, making it profitable. Farms will give you more people, essentially doubling or tripling your base income (and thus double to tripling the amount you get per market, too). Morale is the unfortunate inefficiency, because you need Bread and Circuses to keep 20 billion overtaxed residents happy and- more importantly- paying taxes.

Despite the inefficiency, I've been lowering my taxes to around 32% in the Foundation game. There's something majestic about 100% Approval from your subjects. Assuming there are any, there are less than 200 million people who dislike my rule under the Technologist Party. Also, I heard you get 2x population growth with 100% approval, which helps my burgeoning Commerce World.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-03-12 11:49pm

So planet quality has an impact on morale? That probably explains my all the c5 I colonise have horrible morale. Around 25b even my homeworld is difficult to control.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-13 12:08am

Stark wrote:So planet quality has an impact on morale? That probably explains my all the c5 I colonise have horrible morale. Around 25b even my homeworld is difficult to control.

Absolutely. Check the tooltip of your planet's approval rating under the colony management screen (AKA doubleclick planet, hold mouse over approval) to see it.

Don't go to 20b, by the way, except on commerce worlds. 10-12 billion (1 Xeno Farm) is enough for any world except a tax-farming operation, and early-game colonization rush nescessitates that you not tax-farm your homeworld as it needs to have factories and labs on it.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-03-13 12:17am

Yeah, my starting world always ends up full of factories, even if it's got bonuses for other things. Later I can never be bothered changing it around.

Again, thanks for the advice.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-03-13 01:04am

Wow, this game will be interesting. The Drengin and the Arceans are dividing Terran space up, despite the Terrans being gifted with outdated Foundation Technologies (IE- ones new to the rest of the universe, mostly) and the capacity to make Medium Hulled Ships.

Also, I sighted the worst thing imaginable- an Arcean Frigate. I saw only one deep inside their territory, and it is inferior to my Wienis-class Cruisers in every way, but it still means that I won't be able to catch up militarily as fast if at all. Also, if the Arceans have Medium Hulls, they might not be as paranoid as me about trading them to just anybody.

Luck +25% is a fun bonus, though. I found a Ranger, which I named the FFS Seldon. Singlehandedly doubled my tiny military rating, bringing me almost up to Altarian standards and moving me from last to fourth place out of seven.

Only good thing was a conned the Drengin out of Diplomatic Translators for just a miniaturization tech and about 200 BC.

Anarchist Bunny · Post by **Anarchist Bunny** » 2006-03-13 01:37am

I'd bitch about how much the game crashes, but you know, with autosaving its never really a set back, and I think its almost intentional, crashes are about the only time I stop playing the game.