[jesusfreak]The Borg vrs. the Empire

[Mith]

*sigh*

I know how it works, what I'm saying is that the borg can adapt in other ways. But as it has been said before, I have of no proof. But even so, claiming that the Borg can't beam through Imperial hulls is just flat out silly. The Borg would eventually reach Vader and Assimulate him. He would then gain control over the Borg.

[Surlethe]

*sigh*

I know how it works, what I'm saying is that the borg can adapt in other ways. But as it has been said before, I have of no proof. But even so, claiming that the Borg can't beam through Imperial hulls is just flat out silly. The Borg would eventually reach Vader and Assimulate him. He would then gain control over the Borg.

You know what you're doing? You're making claims without presenting proof. Why do you think that will convince anybody?

[Noble Ire]

*sigh*

I know how it works, what I'm saying is that the borg can adapt in other ways. But as it has been said before, I have of no proof. But even so, claiming that the Borg can't beam through Imperial hulls is just flat out silly. The Borg would eventually reach Vader and Assimulate him. He would then gain control over the Borg.

You admit you have no evidence to support any of your claims, and yet you still preach your views as though they are undeniable.

[Stark]

Oh come on - the Borg will adapt in 'other ways'. Like, never-seen-before ways! Special ways, that would have saved them from numerous defeats! They didn't bother for S8472, but they'll do it for sure against SW vessels.

[Mith]

And you claim that Imperial hulls can block transporters with no proof of such.

[Stark]

Hello? Is this thing on?

Transporters are blocked by a vast catalogue of phenomena. Imperial ships include many of these. Why should we simply assume they'll work, despite the presence of phenomena that have stymied them in the past?

Their jammers DISTORT SPACE, for fucks sake.

[Cos Dashit]

And you claim that Imperial hulls can block transporters with no proof of such.

The burden of proof is on you. You made these claims, you need to back them up.

[Mith]

ah, I see, I assumed you meant jammers as in communication. Wow...they are screwed...knock one up for the IMP's.

[Connor MacLeod]

Three pages in, he has yet to back up any of his claims with proof. He even admits he has no proof, yet he continues to debate the issue rather than actually backing up his claims.

Back up your fucking claims. Every single one of them. Now.

[Patrick Degan]

In Star Trek TNG, The Best of Both Worlds, Part 1 and 2, it is seen that the Enterprise uses its main deflector dish as a weapon to destroy the Borg cube.

And this offers a valid comparison with a civilisation able to build ships with the capacity to both absorb and pump out weapons fire at power levels many orders of magnitude beyond Borg capabilities... how, exactly?

The effect of it is not statted to have a frequency,

The entire design of the weapon was predicated on hitting the frequency in which Borg shields were at their weakest.

even so the borg was able to adapt to it, thanks to their assimulation of Captain Pichard. So should this not show that the Borgs can adapt to such things?

It shows they could adapt to a weapon which was within the energy-output ranges they are used to and which they could pilfer detailed information on. It shows nothing of how they could possibly adapt to a weapon which is far more powerful than anything they're used to.

Oh, and BTW, the Borg were helpless before the weaponry of Species 8472. So much for this latest incarnation of the No-Limits Fallacy.

Borg ships are armed with high energy tractor beams

Higher than 200GT shield capacity? Doubt it.

plasma beams

Pity that Imperial ships are particle- and ray-shielded.

warp field destabilising weapons

Pity that Imperial ships don't depend on ST-style warp fields for propulsion.

and laser cutting beams

Pity that Imperial ships not only possess the aforementioned shields but also hulls with dense armour plate. The Borg won't have the time for their cutting-beams to even begin to register on instrumentation before their ship gets blasted.

That plus they have been seen transporting throught shields

Federation shields which are frequency-dependent, which Imperial shields are not.

and I don't see any diffrence in SW and ST shields, save that Sw shields are more primitive.

So "primitive" that they can withstand sustained bombardment on the order of 200GT. Keep paradiing your idiocy.

They may not be able to defeat the Imperials through pure strength, but with the choas of them beaminga board and assimulating?

Riiiight... because a very large contingient of heavily-armed stormtroopers are going to fall victim to slowly-lurching zombies —assuming of course that the drones simply don't go "splash" against the shields.

Keep in mind that they Empire has never seen this kind of tech before.

No, they've seen far better.

[OmegaGuy]

Alderaans planetary shield deflected the firepower of the Death Star for about a tenth of a second. That's absurdly impressive.

That's technically not an Imperial shield.

[Utah Jak]

Alderaans planetary shield deflected the firepower of the Death Star for about a tenth of a second. That's absurdly impressive.

That's technically not an Imperial shield.

However, it shows the level of technology available to the Empire. This proves that Star Wars tech is above and beyond that of the Borg or any Trek power.

[NecronLord]

The Empire is literally trillions of times more powerful than any Milky Way civilization;

The Organians beg to disagree.

[NecronLord]

I don't think you understand what frequency is. This helpful image will explain it for you.

Unfortunately, neither do the Trek writers. They just like the word, they have little understanding of what it should mean.

[OmegaGuy]

Alderaans planetary shield deflected the firepower of the Death Star for about a tenth of a second. That's absurdly impressive.

That's technically not an Imperial shield.

However, it shows the level of technology available to the Empire. This proves that Star Wars tech is above and beyond that of the Borg or any Trek power.

I know, I was just pointing it out.

Oh and this is an unrelated thought but it seems to me that the one technology that gives SW the edge over ST is hypermatter. If you think about it hypermatter is either directly or indirectly responsible for most of the Empire's advantages over ST.

[Typhonis 1]

Borg DIE. Sorry as has been mentioned before the main guns on a 20 yr old transport have a firepower of 200 gigatons.... Ep2 ICS. You can always adapt but their are limitations to adaptation and it's hard to adapt to things killing your ships in one shot. Ref species 8472.

[Typhonis 1]

Actually it is the advanced age of the Empire....it is built on the Old Republic and according to A New Hope they have had 20,000 years to grow and develop technology.

[Surlethe]

The Empire is literally trillions of times more powerful than any Milky Way civilization;

The Organians beg to disagree.

Oh, pshh. Repeat after me: sweeping generalizations are not fallacies. Sweeping generalizations are not fallacies. Sweeping generalizations ... .

Well, what I was trying to say was that the Empire is literally trillions of times more powerful than any of the civilizations with which the Federation has frequent contact in the series. Is there a sufficiently concise way to put that which won't piss off the Organians?

[Kadaeux]

In Star Trek TNG, The Best of Both Worlds, Part 1 and 2, it is seen that the Enterprise uses its main deflector dish as a weapon to destroy the Borg cube.

So what, microwave radiation was discovered by the invention of Radar yet its not a cost effective weapon, I would assume (sorry) That should we assume you can invent a weapon out of any communications device than and old lady with a phone could strangle you to death with the cord.

Also you mentioned Hypermatter, I have only ever seen it mentioned in one place, as the description for what powers the death star. I read somewhere (Sorry can't remember) that a Standard Star Destroyer was powered by a conventional Fusion reactor.

[Lord Pounder]

*sigh*

I know how it works, what I'm saying is that the borg can adapt in other ways. But as it has been said before, I have of no proof.

The defence rests your honour.

I don't know who you are or where you come from but here when you make claims "Because I say so" or "well thats what i want it to be" are not valid arguements. In actually fact such arguements are in violation of the board debating rules, you should read them.

[Ghost Rider]

And with that, and because I missed all the fun after going to bed, this one also will reside with most of this retard's posts.

[LaCroix]

Also you mentioned Hypermatter, I have only ever seen it mentioned in one place, as the description for what powers the death star. I read somewhere (Sorry can't remember) that a Standard Star Destroyer was powered by a conventional Fusion reactor.

Outch.

You know what amount of energy is needed to MOVE that "little" ISD around? Not to mention the fighting they do occasionally on their multi-year tours between tank-stops.

I believe you are talking about hydrogen fusion when relating to fusion

There is not enough room for the reactors and the fuel in an ISD if it was hydrogen-fusion based. (even if we go trecky-style and use 100% efficiency)

That quote will be (I assume ) that one with "a minature sun"... which should be read "power output of a small sun". we are talking of power generation in the 1e2x ranges (read "somewerebetween 1e20 and 1e29)

But if use a "fusion" reactor using hypermatter, things look quite different.

[Surlethe]

Also you mentioned Hypermatter, I have only ever seen it mentioned in one place, as the description for what powers the death star. I read somewhere (Sorry can't remember) that a Standard Star Destroyer was powered by a conventional Fusion reactor.

You read incorrectly. Conventional fusion doesn't produce the energy required to power a Star Destroyer; it's about three orders of magnitude inefficient.

[Kuja]

Even though he's already banned, I just can't resist linking this picture that, for me, always slams the tech disparity point home:

Scroll right!

[SirNitram]

Even though he's already banned, I just can't resist linking this picture that, for me, always slams the tech disparity point home:

Scroll right!

A nice, tall glass of perspective...