Star Wars Peaceful attitude and telepaths

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Kurgan
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Post by Kurgan »

That's not entirely true. Remember that Miles O'Brien's mother cooked real meat like mutton shanks. Keiko was somewhat revolted at the thought of Miles' mother actually touching and handling "real meat".

It's apparently not a common practice, but it still exists.
That is an important point. In essense, it appears to be a cultural thing. Ie: the majority of humans in the Federation (and according to Enterprise, which, like it or not, is still canon... they got this idea from the Vulcans, who are vegetarians) feel its more "enlightened" and "moral" to do it that way.

But just like in a society where everybody is conforming to a certain way of living, there are always a few who rebel, either loudly or quietly. O'Brien seems to be one of them.

And yes, I know there are examples of "non-replicated" food as well, when Sisko goes home to meet his father, and when Picard goes to meet his brother's family, both offer him "home cooked" food.

I always assumed that replicated food would only be for Starfleet ships, for convenience (carry a load of raw biomass for use as any food you want, verses a load of food that might would take energy to keep from spoiling, and preparation time, etc.) But maybe indoctrination is so high that Starfleet types have a hard time breaking out of the mold.

But, when you get down to it, eating non-seafood "meat" is considered taboo in Federation society. Its another nice way to point out their moral hypocrisy.
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Post by Kurgan »

Bah, sorry for the spelling errors/typos. ; P

So no, it's not ILLEGAL, but, as you say, it's frowned upon.
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Enlightenment
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Post by Enlightenment »

Backstabber wrote:Even if you have such a big event as that it wouldn't change millions of years of evolution. World War 2 didn't change much.
WWII did cause a fairly significant change in the practice of international affairs. From WWII onwards the practice of territorial expansion by military conquest has been broadly regarded as illegitimate. Compared to earlier attitudes, particularly pre-WWI, this is a pretty fundamental shift in how ordinary people and their leaders view warfare.
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Post by Backstabber »

Enlightenment wrote:
Backstabber wrote:Even if you have such a big event as that it wouldn't change millions of years of evolution. World War 2 didn't change much.
WWII did cause a fairly significant change in the practice of international affairs. From WWII onwards the practice of territorial expansion by military conquest has been broadly regarded as illegitimate. Compared to earlier attitudes, particularly pre-WWI, this is a pretty fundamental shift in how ordinary people and their leaders view warfare.
International affairs. Perhaps. But Territorial expansion has happened. If even infrequently. Russia-Afghanistan, Vietnam, Israel-Middle East, Persian Gulf, to name a few off the top of my head. As well as illegitimacy, it truly depends on the terms of the conquest. To put it bluntly, if it didn't directly affect Northern interests we didn't care. Look at the continued fighting in Africa, as a example. War and conflict have solved more dilemmas then anything else.

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P.S. I think Starship Troopers should be required reading for any school. Especially for those who wish a military career. Everybody in the military should read the book.
Peace is far off yet. It will be blood and death for some time to come.
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`Why, what did she tell you?'
`I don't know, I didn't listen.'
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Peregrin Toker
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Re: Star Wars Peaceful attitude and telepaths

Post by Peregrin Toker »

Backstabber wrote:Now realistically speaking, you throw 5 humans together, you will have a fight in 20 minutes. It is natural. HUmanity are a violent and emotional people. We are natually violent. There is never a point in human history where we have had peace.
Hmmm.... maybe this is the reason why the humans hate the Klingons so much in ST... they remind them of their past.

(Didn't Quark once explain humans' dislke of Ferengi with "we remind you humans* of your greedy past??")

*In order to pronounce it in real Ferenglish, it should be said "hew-marrn."
"Hi there, would you like to have a cookie?"

"No, actually I would HATE to have a cookie, you vapid waste of inedible flesh!"
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Durandal
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Post by Durandal »

Troi's description of the Federation is more like a "wouldn't it be nice if..." scenario. Yeah, I wouldn't mind never having to deal with money again and everyone working for the betterment of humanity. That'd be really cool. I wouldn't have to worry about student loans, bills, or any of that bullshit. If no one was poor, that'd be nice, too.

But it won't happen. Ever.

People will always want some kind of tangible reward for their efforts. I don't work for free. Hell, Troi was just flat-out lying, anyway. She never really mentioned Tasha Yar's home, where there was poverty and hunger. She conveniently left out the Federation's policy of noninvolvement, even when other races are in desperate peril. Stuff like that.
Damien Sorresso

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Scorpius
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Post by Scorpius »

Another example of the totalitarian Utopia:

LIATOR: Do you execute criminals?
PICARD: No... not any longer, that is.
RIVAN: You did once?
PICARD: Unfortunately, yes. But since then-
RIVAN: And when you did, was it believed necessary to do so?
PICARD: Can we please get to the facts concerning our crewmember? (pauses a moment) Yes, some people then felt it was necessary. But we've learned how to detect the seeds of criminal behavior...


How many here have stole money from your parents? Cheated on an exam? Stolen cookies when mommy said not to? Well you would've been DETECTED too...
Pizza, Margarita Shooters and naked Sebacen girls...Now that's a party.
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Cpt_Frank
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Post by Cpt_Frank »

If we assume the ST society would seem to work the way it's described it'll be one extremely oppressive system, not unlike authoritarian communism, only a bit pussified.
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