Sakura Kinomoto vs. The Axis

[SWPIGWANG]

It is the jews....it is all the jews man

[Yogi]

How much damage can the cards block?

Unknown. The Shield card is the only one that really "blocks" damage and while it is pretty good at keeping most things out, it's never had massive military ordanance thrown at it before. That's why I said that an open confrontation is the WORST strategy to follow.

[Ghost Rider]

And assuming Wrath of God...still they would look at people violating terms of Martial law as kill on sight.

Unless she can just project energy...that and to stop a military she is going have to do open actions or she will have accomplished nothing more than annoying the German machine.

Perhaps if she was working in concert with something this situation would be feasible...but her alone...I don't see it.

[Yogi]

First: What do you mean "just project energy"?
Second: If you are a soldier, and you beleive that the Wrath of God is decending upon your army, what would you do? Would you be more afraid of the Wrath of God, or the Wrath of the Army if it catches you deserting?
Third: Remember, she is taking out the most important aspects of their armies (Divination/Dream) such as the command centers etc.

I would consider that more than just an annoyance.

[Ghost Rider]

Compared to the overall effectiveness of what she must do...unless she works in concert with the Allies she had better kill more than 2/3 of an entire army with no chance of every being seen or any open conflict.

As for saying Project energy...does she have to be in that place or can she just simply will said thing into existence anywhere.

Plus I've noticed no one has thought of how the supposed Allies would view her...probable threat or just some wacky girl to exploit?

[SAMAS]

Compared to the overall effectiveness of what she must do...unless she works in concert with the Allies she had better kill more than 2/3 of an entire army with no chance of every being seen or any open conflict.

Assuming she doesn't get pushed to the point of killing(ie. no Kahzan rules), she can do a lot of damage to the German war effort by disabling and destroying many factories and bases with minimal loss of life(or maximum, if she so chooses, but that's unlikely at first)

As for saying Project energy...does she have to be in that place or can she just simply will said thing into existence anywhere.

Depends on what she uses. Most cards would require a line of sight, if for nothing else than the ability to see what she's going for. However, skilled users such as Eriol have used the cards remotely, scrying on their targets, and unleasing their power from the confort of home.

However, should she use the Create Card in the way it was first used, she nust writes it down and it happens.

Plus I've noticed no one has thought of how the supposed Allies would view her...probable threat or just some wacky girl to exploit?

Depends. Your average line soldier would probably see her as kind of an angel, wich unfortunately(For Sakura) would give Tomoyo ideas. After all, she is on their side.

Aside from that, I don't know.

That is, of course, assuming that she's found out.

[Ghost Rider]

So she either kills thus regarded as a high level threat or constaly does low level clandestine effort.

Thus marshalling a more concise effort instead of just a person in the wrong area at the wrong time.

As for just appearing as an angel...they also might think she's some alien threat by that extension thus killed on sight, thus not exactly confirmation.

Also I believe too many of us are ignoring this is at a point where the Allies are more screwed than not...and all Nazi Germany has to do is pull one more victory to secure the European land.

One girl better be doing city wide destruction through most of Euopre to begin deter them...and if that happens they marshall a good much of everything left to elimanate her.

Nothing has stated she is allied with anyone, or has any such plans...thus her against the Axis...and sorry she's still mortal...one shot from a gunman can kill her...and as she escalates the conflict the more likely this situation comes to bear.

[MKSheppard]

Okay then, you tell me.

A teenager and a pair of 10-year-old girls are walking down the street.

Exactly who is going to be raising alarm bells at this?

Everyone, because the stupid fucknuts are violating CURFEW...they
will be shot as attempted saboteurs.....

[MKSheppard]

Assuming she doesn't get pushed to the point of killing(ie. no Kahzan rules), she can do a lot of damage to the German war effort by disabling and destroying many factories and bases with minimal loss of life(or maximum, if she so chooses, but that's unlikely at first).

OK great, you've just destroyed the entire economy of france....

Everyone Starves to death except the farmers and the German
Occupying troops.

[SAMAS]

So she either kills thus regarded as a high level threat or constaly does low level clandestine effort.

Thus marshalling a more concise effort instead of just a person in the wrong area at the wrong time.

But the question is how do they find out who, or even what, if anything, is causing these seemingly unnatural natural disasters.

You have to realize that none of these are going to look anything like a conventional attack. No Tanks, no Jeeps, no Airplanes. No Bombs, no Rockets, no Bullets. Just vines popping out of nowhere and strangling your machines, or spears of earth erupting all around your base, or snow several feet deep dropping all over your bases(during a heat wave), Fires Starting all over the base for no reason, or unnatural darkness, soldiers falling asleep, and waking up to every weapon they have just *gone.*

Remember, at the least, Sakura only needs to see the target. We're talking about sniper-style Earthquakes here. Nobody's gonna suspect a little kid in an inn is casting spells through her window.

Setting more guards won't help much, either. They're going to have nightmares about Ghostly apparitions(Windy, Shadow), vines(Wood), Doubles of themselves(Mirror, Illusion), or worse(Watery, Ice, etc...) attacking them, but when they came to, nothing was there.

As for just appearing as an angel...they also might think she's some alien threat by that extension thus killed on sight, thus not exactly confirmation.

Assuming they're paranoid, stupid, and see her. If you heard about somehting attacking your enemies, a deliberately leaving civillians alone(except an unsceduled nap or sixty), would your first command be to shoot it on sight?

Also I believe too many of us are ignoring this is at a point where the Allies are more screwed than not...and all Nazi Germany has to do is pull one more victory to secure the European land.

Unfortunately, that means much of their military force is building in France... right where she is to mess it up. That means she has an opportunity to actually do some real good, bringing their planned advance to a grinding halt.

One girl better be doing city wide destruction through most of Euopre to begin deter them...and if that happens they marshall a good much of everything left to elimanate her.

Eliminate what? You're assuming that the minute something happens, they're going to deduce "Hey! A 10-year-old girl is using magic against us!" They have to find out what's going on first, before they can even begin to realize who's doing it.

[Ghost Rider]

But the question is how do they find out who, or even what, if anything, is causing these seemingly unnatural natural disasters.

You have to realize that none of these are going to look anything like a conventional attack. No Tanks, no Jeeps, no Airplanes. No Bombs, no Rockets, no Bullets. Just vines popping out of nowhere and strangling your machines, or spears of earth erupting all around your base, or snow several feet deep dropping all over your bases(during a heat wave), Fires Starting all over the base for no reason, or unnatural darkness, soldiers falling asleep, and waking up to every weapon they have just *gone.*

Remember, at the least, Sakura only needs to see the target. We're talking about sniper-style Earthquakes here. Nobody's gonna suspect a little kid in an inn is casting spells through her window.

Setting more guards won't help much, either. They're going to have nightmares about Ghostly apparitions(Windy, Shadow), vines(Wood), Doubles of themselves(Mirror, Illusion), or worse(Watery, Ice, etc...) attacking them, but when they came to, nothing was there.

She's not one of them...she's breaking curfew...she's a legitmate target...and shoot.

Assuming they're paranoid, stupid, and see her. If you heard about somehting attacking your enemies, a deliberately leaving civillians alone(except an unsceduled nap or sixty), would your first command be to shoot it on sight?

leap of logic given this is a wartime scenario...and in a country under martial law...she is breaking curfew.

Unfortunately, that means much of their military force is building in France... right where she is to mess it up. That means she has an opportunity to actually do some real good, bringing their planned advance to a grinding halt.

best leap of logic yet...so she's going to upscale her activites from mere clandestine to full scale attacks on guarded facility and and in France...who said the war machine is mostly there?!

Eliminate what? You're assuming that the minute something happens, they're going to deduce "Hey! A 10-year-old girl is using magic against us!" They have to find out what's going on first, before they can even begin to realize who's doing it.

Presumption that because she's ten years old she won't be viewed as breaking curfew...thus breaking the law under totaliarian conditions...thus shot on sight...no questions asked.

[SAMAS]

But the question is how do they find out who, or even what, if anything, is causing these seemingly unnatural natural disasters.

You have to realize that none of these are going to look anything like a conventional attack. No Tanks, no Jeeps, no Airplanes. No Bombs, no Rockets, no Bullets. Just vines popping out of nowhere and strangling your machines, or spears of earth erupting all around your base, or snow several feet deep dropping all over your bases(during a heat wave), Fires Starting all over the base for no reason, or unnatural darkness, soldiers falling asleep, and waking up to every weapon they have just *gone.*

Remember, at the least, Sakura only needs to see the target. We're talking about sniper-style Earthquakes here. Nobody's gonna suspect a little kid in an inn is casting spells through her window.

Setting more guards won't help much, either. They're going to have nightmares about Ghostly apparitions(Windy, Shadow), vines(Wood), Doubles of themselves(Mirror, Illusion), or worse(Watery, Ice, etc...) attacking them, but when they came to, nothing was there.

She's not one of them...she's breaking curfew...she's a legitmate target...and shoot.

Assuming they're paranoid, stupid, and see her. If you heard about somehting attacking your enemies, a deliberately leaving civillians alone(except an unsceduled nap or sixty), would your first command be to shoot it on sight?

leap of logic given this is a wartime scenario...and in a country under martial law...she is breaking curfew.

Unfortunately, that means much of their military force is building in France... right where she is to mess it up. That means she has an opportunity to actually do some real good, bringing their planned advance to a grinding halt.

best leap of logic yet...so she's going to upscale her activites from mere clandestine to full scale attacks on guarded facility and and in France...who said the war machine is mostly there?!

Eliminate what? You're assuming that the minute something happens, they're going to deduce "Hey! A 10-year-old girl is using magic against us!" They have to find out what's going on first, before they can even begin to realize who's doing it.

Presumption that because she's ten years old she won't be viewed as breaking curfew...thus breaking the law under totaliarian conditions...thus shot on sight...no questions asked.

Again, by who? Every soldier in the immediate area is asleep or otherwise incapacitated. She can use Jump to stay on the rooftops, thus helping to avoid detection, and, if discovered, can reduce the chances of her getting hit by fire(that and the Shield Card.), create a mist or even total darkness to conceal herself, and if chased, trap any and all soldiers after her in a Loop or Maze.

[Ghost Rider]

Against one pack...she is up against the entire combined might of the Axis forces...so unless you can give me some way that she is going to make France sink into the ocean...she would be killed upon her first mistake.

Literally you have looked at this at some anime angle that she would do this and this and this...and given no real anything towards that she does not have some writer dictating a perfect character shield around her and she is in a hostile territory with relativily trigger happy people when she starts her sheenigans.

Your assuming that the germans will just roll up and cry instead of trying to search out and elimanate a threat.

[SAMAS]

Against one pack...she is up against the entire combined might of the Axis forces...so unless you can give me some way that she is going to make France sink into the ocean...she would be killed upon her first mistake.

There you go, with the "just wait until she makes a mistake."

Remember, she is not, nor does she have to, take them on all at once. She can use several forms of concealment to reach an area, Use a card to two to hit the target, and use a different form of concealment to get out.

Literally you have looked at this at some anime angle that she would do this and this and this...and given no real anything towards that she does not have some writer dictating a perfect character shield around her and she is in a hostile territory with relativily trigger happy people when she starts her sheenigans.

And that's what Yue and Keroberos are for to advise her on when and where to strike, and most importantly, to protect her.

Your assuming that the germans will just roll up and cry instead of trying to search out and elimanate a threat.

Not really, I have looked at this under Kahzan rules, removing only the Bloodthirst. That means that she'll be using her cards to the best of their ability and with little hesitation, not conveniently forgetting about a card that can easily end a confrontation so it can be drawn out.

[SAMAS]

Here's an idea of what the Germans are up against. This is a list of all the Clow Cards. Thier powers are hinted at in their names.

The Windy
The Wood
The Jump
The Fly
The Watery
The Illusion
The Flower
The Sword
The Thunder
The Shadow
The Mirror
The Shield
The Maze
The Erase
The Glow
The Dark
The Light
The Firery
The Earthy
The Arrow
The Big
The Change
The Create
The Dash
The Dream
The Fight
The Float
The Freeze
The Little
The Lock
The Loop
The Mist
The Move
The Power
The Rain
The Return
The Sand
The Shot
The Silent
The Sleep
The Snow
The Song
The Storm
The Sweet
The Time
The Twins
The Voice

[Yogi]

To summerize 9+ pages of arguments.

Why Sakura will win:
Sakura's power is unlike anything the Axis has ever seen before.
Sakura can confuse the enemy with her vaired powers.
Sakura can mis-direct the enemy with her varied powers.
Sakura can scare the piss out of the enemy with her varied powers.
Sakura can hide with her varied powers.
If push comes to shove Sakura can kill with her varied powers.
If push comes to shove, Sakura and her Guardian Beasts can defeat small groups of German soldiers.

Why the Axis will win:
Sakura cannot take the combined firepower of the Axis.
Sakura will walk around without trying to conceal herself, thereby exposing herself to said firepower.
The Axis will carpet bomb their own bases to get at Sakura.
The Axis will assume a mundane source to the events, as opposed to a divine one.
The Allies will view Sakura as an emeny and try to kill her.
The Resistance will view Sakura as an enemy and try to kill her.
Sakura cannot deal enough damage to make a diffrence.

Now to add something new. If Sakura uses "The Shadow" card, she doesn't need to be there to use her powers, just her shadow.

[Ghost Rider]

So in the end all we have done is shown what each side is capable of.

In the end the question still beggars...can Sakura defeat the Axis.

Unless she can make France sink into the ocean I say no.

[SAMAS]

She doesn't have to.

The Allies are still there, just on the defensive. Sakura can hold back the invasion, and demoralize the German Army, At least enough to allow them to get back into the game.

[Ghost Rider]

Largest leap of logic yet.

So she's going to singlehandly hold back the entire German army and wait till the Allies muster forces back after their largest push was summarily defeated.

Why not just say she'll go back in time to kill Hitler and stop the creation of the Nazi party

[HemlockGrey]

The Woody

Fixed it for ya.

In any case, there is, always, one thing that anime cannot defeat and never will defeat- the Principality of Zan! Fear Zan!

[SAMAS]

Largest leap of logic yet.

So she's going to singlehandly hold back the entire German army and wait till the Allies muster forces back after their largest push was summarily defeated.

Why not just say she'll go back in time to kill Hitler and stop the creation of the Nazi party

She has the Return card. She can do that, you know.

[Ghost Rider]

And would this stop the Axis forces, how again?...also thank you for the cop out solution.

So the only way she can accomplish this is to go back kill Hitler in the off chance that none of this happens thus she never comes into this time in the first place...thanks

[SAMAS]

Why do you think I didn't pull that out before?

But if you want it that way, we already know she suceeded in turning it around, becuase she go sent back. She wouldn't have seen the things Japan did as horrible if they won...

[Ghost Rider]

I see leap of logic must win debates in your eyes...uh huh...danken

[SAMAS]

Let's put it this way:

You have yet to provide an effective counter to anything Sakura can do, except to say that the Germans will be extra vigilant, and hope that you get lucky, and she makes a mistake, and you manage to get her.