Are the effects of the force limited by the speed of light?

[Noble Ire]

The "official" explanation was that the Mace Windu episode (I thought) was just the exagerated memories of a child embelishing the story (the boy who gave him water at the end). Of course it doesn't do anything to fix the exaggerations and wanking in the rest of the series, unless we assume the whole thing is also the kid's idea of how things happened.

It is. The entire series is canonically (IIRC) the recoutings of the events of the Clone Wars as Rebel propoganda, as told by that boy.

[Cykeisme]

Grievous demonstrated incredible power levels in the CW season 2 that he never demonstrated in the movie, including being able to leap dozens of feet in the air, react as fast if not faster than Jedi Masters, etc.

I tentatively propose that a possible explanation for the disparity in Grievous' combat abilities between CW and RotS might be due to the injuries he sustained to his organics following Mace's telekinetic attack. He may have needed extensive surgery to repair his organs, or more time to heal, before he regained peak effectiveness.


As for Mace's armor-rending feats of telekinesis, it's possible that we don't see any Force users do things like that in the movies because they don't have to. Mace happened to lose his lightsaber and had to stave off battle droids, a particular situation that doesn't occur in the movies.
Yoda and Sidious tossing around Senate pods must involve at least as much force as that needed to fling SBDs around and smash them open. True, those two are above the strength level of the average Jedi, but then again, so is Mace.
Nevertheless, the explanation that those scenes are based on exaggerated accounts is accepted; the question is how much is exaggeration.

[Molyneux]

That might be interesting, but if that's the case, why didn't Qui Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan have a similar experience? Then again this is sort of touched on in the ROTS novelisation, but I don't recall the exact details (something about Obi-Wan remembering a time when the Force didn't seem clouded).

Also, how do we understand this "shroud of the dark side" stuff?

What exactly does it entail... is it just the ability to see the future that is hindered? Or just precog?

Because the abilities demonstrated by Mace Windu in the CW are not limited to precog, short or long term, he's able to tear apart droids with his mind, and smash them with his bare hands with incredible speed. He turns into "the Flash" for the most part. As to the ability to crush metal with your mind, the only person to demonstrate that in the movies is Anakin at the end of ROTS, but even then that's just some sheet metal in the wall, not a bunch of SBD carapaces. The power is never used again (even the choking of Imperial officers seems to be a different power, because otherwise they would be dead in seconds with their trachea crushed instead of just seeming to be unable to breath and slowly losing consciousness, but being fine when the power is withdrawn).

Anyway, if the veil was lifted, one wonders how or why and why nothing was mentioned of it. It's a nice attempt at an explanation though!

The "official" explanation was that the Mace Windu episode (I thought) was just the exagerated memories of a child embelishing the story (the boy who gave him water at the end). Of course it doesn't do anything to fix the exaggerations and wanking in the rest of the series, unless we assume the whole thing is also the kid's idea of how things happened.

Keep in mind that Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan did indeed use something resembling superspeed in Phantom Menace.

[Stark]

I don't think Jedi do things in the CW cartoon that they can't do in the movies - they just do a lot more of it. If Jedi at the high end can lift starfighters and huge pillars, what's so odd about them being able to punch droids? We know they can jump like silly bastards and run really, really fast. I'd think people would be more upset about the Jedi jumping through space wearing a non-sealed helmet.

Complaining about Greivous is silly. In ROTS he can barely *stand*. No shit he can't fight very well anymore. Does he even try to fight Kenobi, or does he run like a little girl because he's fucked?

[Kurgan]

Yes, the Jedi do do things in CW we don't see them do in the movies. They never telekinetically rip droids apart. They can't smash airships together with their hands. They can't force push an entire crowd at once. We see the top Jedi Masters in the movies do maybe a tiny fraction of what they do in the CW, and the rest we just never see. I mean yeah, Obi-Wan tips over some Battle Droids with a double kick in TPM, but Mace Windu rapidly bashes them to bits with a rapid punches like E. Honda from Street Fighter II or something. If the movie Jedi had these powers they have gotten out of the Geonosis Arena with zero casualties, and only would have needed to send one or two Jedi at most (heck, Obi-Wan wouldn't have needed rescuing in the first place). In the CW General Grievous seems to carry around his own portable "Light Force dampening field" that sucks out the Jedi's power and give it to himself. Mace Windu didn't damage his lungs, he broke the dampening generator! Heh. I'm joking about that last part, but it would explain why the suddenly suck in his presence but rule elsewhere.

The "official" explanation was that the Mace Windu episode (I thought) was just the exagerated memories of a child embelishing the story (the boy who gave him water at the end). Of course it doesn't do anything to fix the exaggerations and wanking in the rest of the series, unless we assume the whole thing is also the kid's idea of how things happened.

It is. The entire series is canonically (IIRC) the recoutings of the events of the Clone Wars as Rebel propoganda, as told by that boy.

Awesome. Cool though it was I'm getting sick and tired of arguing with people that it doesn't trump the movies. Thanks for that tidbit...

When ROTS came out, people were quoting LoE here like mad to explain every little detail, but I hear it conflicts slightly with CW even, can anybody clarify, since I've never read it?

[Utah Jak]

The "official" explanation was that the Mace Windu episode (I thought) was just the exagerated memories of a child embelishing the story (the boy who gave him water at the end). Of course it doesn't do anything to fix the exaggerations and wanking in the rest of the series, unless we assume the whole thing is also the kid's idea of how things happened.

It is. The entire series is canonically (IIRC) the recoutings of the events of the Clone Wars as Rebel propoganda, as told by that boy.

I haven't heard that theory. Very cool. However, if it is rebel propoganda, then how does this kid know about Siddious and Dooku's Sith dealings and plotting?

[Kurgan]

Keep in mind that Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan did indeed use something resembling superspeed in Phantom Menace.

I know, they used it to run away. Why didn't they use it to smash through the blast door quickly to capture the Viceroy? Why didn't anyone ever use it in combat? It may only be good for a quick escape. There's a big difference between running away and punching somebody so fast and so hard that they're reduced to fragments.

I haven't heard that theory. Very cool. However, if it is rebel propoganda, then how does this kid know about Siddious and Dooku's Sith dealings and plotting?

Perhaps it didn't come out until after the Rebel victory in ROTJ, so they knew or had figured everything out by then.

[Darth Wong]

I know, they used it to run away. Why didn't they use it to smash through the blast door quickly to capture the Viceroy?

If you could run ten times faster than normal, would you use that power to run straight into a three foot thick blast door?

Why didn't anyone ever use it in combat? It may only be good for a quick escape. There's a big difference between running away and punching somebody so fast and so hard that they're reduced to fragments.

Jedi aren't indestructible. The ability to accelerate at such great rates is probably taxing enough on their bodies and their powers without also trying to hit things.

[Utah Jak]

I haven't heard that theory. Very cool. However, if it is rebel propoganda, then how does this kid know about Siddious and Dooku's Sith dealings and plotting?

Perhaps it didn't come out until after the Rebel victory in ROTJ, so they knew or had figured everything out by then.

Quite possible. If this is true then it probabbly came out after the New Republic took Coruscant and the Imperial palace. Who knows what kind of stuff the NR found in there?

[Spartan]

And just how would the NR find out information such as the intimate details of two Sith Lords conversations, never mind the stuff that they could not possibly know. Or are we to belief that Sidious uploaded all this incriminating evidence to the Coruscant archives.

Come on NR intelligence is worthless. It might work that that kid could know about the battle of Dantooine, but how would they know the details of Anakins duel with Ventress on Yavin. Even Obi-wan wasn't privie to all the details of what happened.

[Spartan]

I honestly don't see what the problem with the CW cartoon is, nothing the jedi do is beyond what we see them do in the Movies. They're isplenty of over the top stuff in the EU, but its canon. Is Yoda shoving a TF landing ship that much than Luke crushing an AT-AT with the force? Is Mace fligging aside battle droids more wank than Palpatine's force storms? I mean really, how about a little perspective.

[Noble Ire]

And just how would the NR find out information such as the intimate details of two Sith Lords conversations, never mind the stuff that they could not possibly know. Or are we to belief that Sidious uploaded all this incriminating evidence to the Coruscant archives.

Come on NR intelligence is worthless. It might work that that kid could know about the battle of Dantooine, but how would they know the details of Anakins duel with Ventress on Yavin. Even Obi-wan wasn't privie to all the details of what happened.

Well, it is possible that some of the details could have been made up. I mean, there are plenty of places where the CW cartoons don't match up with established EU. It's like modern war movies; we know about where, when, and how important events happened, and we know the mindsets of individuals involved from letters and eye witness accounts. The film maker has to fill in the rest using the evidence at hand.

I honestly don't see what the problem with the CW cartoon is, nothing the jedi do is beyond what we see them do in the Movies. They're isplenty of over the top stuff in the EU, but its canon. Is Yoda shoving a TF landing ship that much than Luke crushing an AT-AT with the force? Is Mace fligging aside battle droids more wank than Palpatine's force storms? I mean really, how about a little perspective.

So just because one Force-user can do something, all of them can?
Yes, the feats shown are within the capabilities of some of the most wankish of characters at the most wankish of their moments, but not Yoda or Mace Windu. Yoda had to completely switch his focus in AOTC to stop the pillar from crushing Obi-Wan and Anakin. If he could push arounf TF dropships like they were Senate pods, why did he even have to do more than flick his wrist at the pillar to send it hurtling a thousand feet?
And there are accounts of Mace Windu being placed in deadly danger when being competely surrounded by a dozen Gand bounty hunters. If he could disassemble CIS armies at will, why would a handful of clumsy organics ever be a threat?

[Kurgan]

If you could run ten times faster than normal, would you use that power to run straight into a three foot thick blast door?

Rather, if you could rapidly smash through armored droids with your bare fists without injury, would you not attempt this on the blast door? Qui Gon's already softened it up a bit with his saber...

And if they can rip apart droids from the inside with their powers, why not do it on the Droidekas? Unless shields block the force...

Jedi aren't indestructible. The ability to accelerate at such great rates is probably taxing enough on their bodies and their powers without also trying to hit things.

All I'm saying is, if the Jedi are really as powerful as they are made out to be in the CW series (minus battles with Grievous), then that's a serious SOD problem with the movies.

And just how would the NR find out information such as the intimate details of two Sith Lords conversations, never mind the stuff that they could not possibly know. Or are we to belief that Sidious uploaded all this incriminating evidence to the Coruscant archives.

Come on NR intelligence is worthless. It might work that that kid could know about the battle of Dantooine, but how would they know the details of Anakins duel with Ventress on Yavin. Even Obi-wan wasn't privie to all the details of what happened.

Unless the Imperial palace was destroyed, they could just have raided it for data after the Emperor was dead. I doubt as he was falling to his death he pressed some kind of kill switch that destroyed all his files and data everywhere in the galaxy. Yes, perhaps he didn't write it all down, but at least its a possibility. All those complicated plans...

And missing details they could just fill in the gaps with logical deductions or just flat out artistic liscense, sure. I mean we're assuming it's canon though, so it has to be 'accurate'. But if you want to explain away the contradictions as artistic liscense, yeah that's fine. This angle isn't perfect but it's not impossible either. Security recordings in the chambers of important people would seem like something they would have even if they never intended for anyone to view them but themselves.

I just think we're faced with the "problem" of the variance in powers, and people wishing to use the CW as an accurate guage of power levels for various Jedi and Grievous. Dismissing it as exaggeration seems about the only consistent option to harmonizing it with other sources, to me.

[Spartan]

Noble Ire wrote:

Well, it is possible that some of the details could have been made up. I mean, there are plenty of places where the CW cartoons don't match up with established EU. It's like modern war movies; we know about where, when, and how important events happened, and we know the mindsets of individuals involved from letters and eye witness accounts. The film maker has to fill in the rest using the evidence at hand.

Possible, but the problem with that is that all the EU are basically historical records, in universe. When you start conceding that some parts may have been made up; where do you draw the line? Chee said that all LF produced materials have a grain of truth. Well, who's the filter? Most of the books and even the films give you the perspective of an omnipotent observer. Even the films give details that the surviving characters could not have known.

So just because one Force-user can do something, all of them can? Rolling Eyes
Yes, the feats shown are within the capabilities of some of the most wankish of characters at the most wankish of their moments, but not Yoda or Mace Windu. Yoda had to completely switch his focus in AOTC to stop the pillar from crushing Obi-Wan and Anakin. If he could push around TF dropships like they were Senate pods, why did he even have to do more than flick his wrist at the pillar to send it hurtling a thousand feet?

Ire, please point out where I said anything like that. I specifically compare the feat of four or the most powerful force sensitives, ever. I in no way insinuated that all jedi are of similar power.

In AOTC, Yoda, had just finished force enhancing his feeble body to the point that he could own a Sith lord, and had absorbed and deflected MJ range Sith lighting! You don't know how much he had already stressed his body. When he lifts the boulders on Illium in CW, he'd had an indeterminate amount of time to rest. When pushes the landing ship, he wasn't under attack. Please, explain why you think he should be able to split his focus to handle stopping the pillar and stop Dooku from escaping. That pillar is just a lower limit by the way we have no idea what Yoda's max is. I could just a easily say that since he's a master on the council; that he was way out of practice in ATOC. After all when would he ever have to use the force like that? Their were no Sith around and no major wars until the prequels. Abilities and skills atrophy with disuse. He and Mace could easily have gotten stronger with practice between the events in AOTC and CW.

And there are accounts of Mace Windu being placed in deadly danger when being completely surrounded by a dozen Gand bounty hunters. If he could disassemble CIS armies at will, why would a handful of clumsy organics ever be a threat?

Where is this stated. In the republic comics he and the other Coruscant jedi are so much more powerful, than typical jedi that a dozen didn't dare to fight him. Even though they had him surrounded and in the open. The consensus was that if he'd come to kill them the would be dead! These were jedi including masters and full knights. Ventress wouldn't even fight him she flat out ran away.

As far as bounty hunters go, Mace stormed a space station manned by over a hundred or so bounty hunters, with three other masters as cleaved through them effortlessly. Not surprising as even Darth Maul could effortlessly waste dozen of Black Sun operatives credited as "the worst killers and mercenaries in the galaxy". Mace is more powerful than Maul...right?

As to why he didn't use the force the waste the Gands. I have to ask when has any jedi used the Force to just kill anyone in cold blood? Smashing dozens of droids with the Force no problem. Smearing a dozen grands, well the jedi code would forbid that. Jedi don't use their powers the way you or I would, they are religious fanatics, after all.

[Stark]

You might even point out nasty things like 'how's Yoda going to fight with one hand holding up a fucking huge pillar' or 'it's ROUND, if he throws it away Dooku can just roll it over the noobs' or 'dropships have controls and repulsors, pillars don't'. But why? Even in the CW cartoon, Yoda is seen concentrating heavily to move the dropships - at least as much as when holding the pillar. He had to 'catch' the pillar - take it's motion from 'squish' to 'nothing' and he'd just had a fight with a powerful enemy. How is this supposed to be easy again? Or didn't you notice that acceleration on things with the Force is always really slow? Maybe it's really, really hard to stop MASSIVE PILLARS in an INSTANT? Naaaah. And shit, what's he going to do with it? Stand it back up?

[Spartan]

Kurgan wrote:

Unless the Imperial palace was destroyed, they could just have raided it for data after the Emperor was dead. I doubt as he was falling to his death he pressed some kind of kill switch that destroyed all his files and data everywhere in the galaxy. Yes, perhaps he didn't write it all down, but at least its a possibility. All those complicated plans...

Your missing the point such records should not even exist. Are we to assume that Sith Lords keep diaries?!! Who the hell else would need to know the detailes of his personal conversations with Vader for instance. In fact we already know that the Sate had purged the whatever personal files the Emeperor might have had before leaving his clone in his place and fleeing to Byss. Further, Isard purged the entire imperial data base, before pulling out of Coruscant in Wedge's Gamble. The rebels didn't even know of the existence of the Grand Admirals or even the imperial order of battle. But you assume that they know Emeperors master plan?

And missing details they could just fill in the gaps with logical deductions or just flat out artistic liscense, sure. I mean we're assuming it's canon though, so it has to be 'accurate'. But if you want to explain away the contradictions as artistic liscense, yeah that's fine. This angle isn't perfect but it's not impossible either. Security recordings in the chambers of important people would seem like something they would have even if they never intended for anyone to view them but themselves.

Read what I wrote to Noble Ire above. The line has to be drawn somewhere and the problem of us knowing things that the characters in Univers could never know; exists in all literature. For instance how could Jesus's diciples know the details of the high preists conversation with Pilate? But its still canon right?

I just think we're faced with the "problem" of the variance in powers, and people wishing to use the CW as an accurate guage of power levels for various Jedi and Grievous. Dismissing it as exaggeration seems about the only consistent option to harmonizing it with other sources, to me.

How? With CW we actually have a visual representation of those abilities, most of the EU is the typed page. Just how do we relate say Master Skywalkers power to Master Yoda's? Luke is far more wanked, and even more poorly defined. Unless you think reconstructing an entire castle in minutes is less wanked out than smashing a few dozen battle droids. Take Sidious anyone watching ROTS can see that he and Yoda are near equals. Hence the Darth Vader will be more powerful than both of us, comment. Rather, than he'll be even more powerful than I am. But most of the fans here don't bat an eye at his wankatine powers in Dark Empire. Why?

As far as Grevious is concerned he's not wanked out either, or are you saying that a SW technology can not be build a droid capable of fighting Jedi of equal terms? The EU show that that is not the case the are numerous examples of droids owning or threatening individual jedi. The difference between the Jedi being pounded by him in the CW cartoon is that those jedi were afraid. Now could he scare: Dooku, Sidous, Anakin, Obi-Wan, Mace, or Yoda? Hell no. Sure, he could beat some members of the Jedi Council, but you don't make it to the Council on power alone. Otherwise, Anakin and Qui-Gon would have made the cut. While, people like Yaddle and Coleman Trebor wouldn't. It's all political, ie. do you have the right mindset.

[Spartan]

Stark wrote:

You might even point out nasty things like 'how's Yoda going to fight with one hand holding up a fucking huge pillar' or 'it's ROUND, if he throws it away Dooku can just roll it over the noobs' or 'dropships have controls and repulsors, pillars don't'. But why? Rolling Eyes Even in the CW cartoon, Yoda is seen concentrating heavily to move the dropships - at least as much as when holding the pillar. He had to 'catch' the pillar - take it's motion from 'squish' to 'nothing' and he'd just had a fight with a powerful enemy. How is this supposed to be easy again? Or didn't you notice that acceleration on things with the Force is always really slow? Maybe it's really, really hard to stop MASSIVE PILLARS in an INSTANT? Naaaah. And shit, what's he going to do with it? Stand it back up?

Thank you! I was just about to mention the droships repulsors.

[Stark]

To be frank, we shouldn't *need* to mention it. If Jedi could drag dropships capable of reaching orbit in seconds or minutes... well. That would certainly be something.

EDIT - It's even arguable that Yoda disengaged: in ROTS he makes the same decision. Dookus' pillar move was an effective one, as it's almost certain it took more effort to catch the pillar than damage it at cause it to fall.

[Spartan]

Well even padawan's can push starships into hyperspace.

[Noble Ire]

Possible, but the problem with that is that all the EU are basically historical records, in universe. When you start conceding that some parts may have been made up; where do you draw the line? Chee said that all LF produced materials have a grain of truth. Well, who's the filter? Most of the books and even the films give you the perspective of an omnipotent observer. Even the films give details that the surviving characters could not have known.

Save that in no other case is it actually suggested that it might be so. It might make make sense that a lot of it is in some way is a historical account, as in the NR bias of post-Empire EU, but that has never been canonically supported. In this case, it is.

Ire, please point out where I said anything like that. I specifically compare the feat of four or the most powerful force sensitives, ever. I in no way insinuated that all jedi are of similar power.

Perhaps not, but you did suggest that each of them have powers at are interchangable, which is simply not the case. Just because Luke can crush an AT-AT doesn't mean Yoda should be logically able to move dropships (which are hundreds of times the mass, anyways).

In AOTC, Yoda, had just finished force enhancing his feeble body to the point that he could own a Sith lord, and had absorbed and deflected MJ range Sith lighting! You don't know how much he had already stressed his body.

While this is undoubtedly a factor, I have a hard time believing that the previous battle would effect his power so much that feat that should require only a small fraction of his power would consume his focus entirely. I suppose that's also your explanation as to why Mace Windu didn't simply disassemble the arena droids when he fell in AOTC, because he had gotten a bit burnt.

And I really don't see the "there skills were atrophied" excuse flying, either. Its not like the Jedi never had to face hostile threats before the war, and even if they didn't, I don't see how it would decrease their powers by several hundred percent.

Where is this stated. In the republic comics he and the other Coruscant jedi are so much more powerful, than typical jedi that a dozen didn't dare to fight him. Even though they had him surrounded and in the open. The consensus was that if he'd come to kill them the would be dead! These were jedi including masters and full knights. Ventress wouldn't even fight him she flat out ran away.

Its noted in the NEGT: Characters, as well as some of the pre-war Republic comics. As to the bit with the Jedi, does he actually have to fight them? That's exactly why he survived the Gand; Mace had built up an aura of invicibility, and used it to escape positions he might normally not have walked away from. Why would the Jedi be any different?

As far as bounty hunters go, Mace stormed a space station manned by over a hundred or so bounty hunters, with three other masters as cleaved through them effortlessly. Not surprising as even Darth Maul could effortlessly waste dozen of Black Sun operatives credited as "the worst killers and mercenaries in the galaxy". Mace is more powerful than Maul...right?

I think the point of the Gand incident was that the dozen Gand had him completely surrounded, each with a blaster to fire from every direction. That's quite a bit different from taking enemies in smaller groups, or deflecting more attacks all from a single direction. In the CW episode, IIRC, Mace is placed in a similar, surrounded position, and massacres the army by himself.

As to why he didn't use the force the waste the Gands. I have to ask when has any jedi used the Force to just kill anyone in cold blood? Smashing dozens of droids with the Force no problem. Smearing a dozen grands, well the jedi code would forbid that. Jedi don't use their powers the way you or I would, they are religious fanatics, after all.

Then why not just push them all back, or knock the guns out of their hands? Certainly, Jedi have been shown to use lower-scale powers like that, and used them on multiple targets. Surely disarming a dozen bounty hunters would take less focus than pulverizing or tearing apart thirty plus war droids in rapid succession.

You might even point out nasty things like 'how's Yoda going to fight with one hand holding up a fucking huge pillar' or 'it's ROUND, if he throws it away Dooku can just roll it over the noobs' or 'dropships have controls and repulsors, pillars don't'. But why? Even in the CW cartoon, Yoda is seen concentrating heavily to move the dropships - at least as much as when holding the pillar. He had to 'catch' the pillar - take it's motion from 'squish' to 'nothing' and he'd just had a fight with a powerful enemy. How is this supposed to be easy again? Or didn't you notice that acceleration on things with the Force is always really slow? Maybe it's really, really hard to stop MASSIVE PILLARS in an INSTANT? Naaaah. And shit, what's he going to do with it? Stand it back up?

The repulsor issue is a good point, but I really didn't see what he did as seizing control of the ship's systems. The pushing back of the MTTs and the closing of the drop doors were certainly done simply by his own "strength", and the way in which the ship moved after getting back in the air didn't seem in keeping with its movements whne under regular control. However, I suppose I could accept that as a possible explanation.

Well even padawan's can push starships into hyperspace.

Hur Hur

I would hardly use that particular incident as any indicator of normal Jedi power.

[Stark]

Ire, I don't think it looks that way either. But isn't that what we're supposed to do with the ridiculous parts of the EU? Rather than cry 'wank lol' we're supposed to rationalise it. That's what I just did - is isn't so objectionable or so ourside regular experience now. Frankly, since the 'wings' on those things are packed with repulsors, the way they turn as they're being pulled together could suggest they were being moved by repulsor. Who cares if that was the original intent? The APCs look much more like he 'pushed' them, but again, they float on repulsors. There's no need to imagine him pushing multi-ton vehicles, while the drivers don't bother trying to resist.

[Noble Ire]

Ire, I don't think it looks that way either. But isn't that what we're supposed to do with the ridiculous parts of the EU? Rather than cry 'wank lol' we're supposed to rationalise it. That's what I just did - is isn't so objectionable or so ourside regular experience now. Frankly, since the 'wings' on those things are packed with repulsors, the way they turn as they're being pulled together could suggest they were being moved by repulsor. Who cares if that was the original intent? The APCs look much more like he 'pushed' them, but again, they float on repulsors. There's no need to imagine him pushing multi-ton vehicles, while the drivers don't bother trying to resist.

Yes, it is a better explanation than him physically moving them, I agree, and it is justifiably possible as well.

I wish that the exact status of the CW cartoons would be elaborated more; without any confirmation or explanation, the discrepancies therein, precieved and otherwise, are quite annoying.

[Stark]

Yeah - the 'exaggeration' thing is fine with me - since the Jedi simply use their powers MORE and MORE FREQUENTLY than in the movies - but it's far too vague, and makes the cartoon a pretty useless source since any reference to it is immediately dogpiled into the 'lolz cartoon suck' discussion.