Somebody picked the wrong bluff to make

Isana Kadeb · Post by **Isana Kadeb** » 2006-04-18 11:44pm

Soontir C'boath wrote:
Isana Kadeb wrote:He seemed polite at least, many of the creationists loons are the foaming at the mouth types. can't get a coherent point across to save their mothers.
No, he is not polite when he is blatantly dishonest about who he is.

Having been in a couple of debates with scriptural literalists on this topic I can tell you it almost always gets nasty, and the ad hominems and logical fallacies predominantly fly in one direction. But yes, you're right.

brianeyci · Post by **brianeyci** » 2006-04-18 11:48pm

aerius wrote:Unless he goes to a kiddie college I doubt it. Every 1st year engineering program will have at least one physics course, and thermodynamics is covered in enough depth that a student shouldn't be this ignorant unless he skipped half the classes and/or flunked out.

A childhood friend is in third year engineering and he tried pulling the thermodynamics argument on me. It's possible if you're ideologically entrenched enough. And he tried pulling 9/11 conspiracy crap too.

I don't really talk to him anymore.

Brian

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2006-04-18 11:49pm

On entropy and thermodynamics: when I was in a freshman year "science for morons and/or liberal arts majors" survey course, we covered enough thermodynamics and entropy to understand that 2nd Thermodynamics doesn't disprove evolution. This guy's never been to college, or at least not to a good one.

Isana Kadeb · Post by **Isana Kadeb** » 2006-04-18 11:50pm

brianeyci wrote:
aerius wrote:Unless he goes to a kiddie college I doubt it. Every 1st year engineering program will have at least one physics course, and thermodynamics is covered in enough depth that a student shouldn't be this ignorant unless he skipped half the classes and/or flunked out.
A childhood friend is in third year engineering and he tried pulling the thermodynamics argument on me. It's possible if you're ideologically entrenched enough. And he tried pulling 9/11 conspiracy crap too.

I don't really talk to him anymore.

Brian

There are always some stupid people in high places. Behe comes to mind.

Plushie · Post by **Plushie** » 2006-04-19 12:03am

Actually, in reference to style over substance, one can often spot someone who is actually speaking technical terms and someone is trying to pretend to speak technically by sitting at their computer with a thesaurus.

I've taken any Google research over to the Scholarly Article section of their search engine recently and I've begun to notice just how different real technical jargon is from people just babbling on trying to sound smart. For instance, I was doing research yesterday on marijuana and I spent a rather long time (trying to) read this:

http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/con ... 126/6/1252

Now, compare the language in that paper versus the e-mails Wong has recieved. There's a pretty big difference.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-04-19 12:19am

Master of Ossus wrote:I don't see why you even entertained the idea that this guy might actually be an engineer. It's pretty clear even from the first e-mail that he doesn't know what he's talking about, and even the worst of diploma mills isn't handing out degrees that certify people as being capable of dealing with public safety issues like engineers are.

I knew he was a fraud from the first post, but I figured I'd only insinuate that he was a fraud rather than coming right out and saying it. As I said, he's got a military IP address, and unfortunately, there are an awful lot of technicians out there who think that "technician" and "engineer" are pretty much the same thing. Of course, he might not even be a technician; I suppose I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.

DPDarkPrimus · Post by **DPDarkPrimus** » 2006-04-19 12:38am

Isana Kadeb wrote:
brianeyci wrote:
aerius wrote:Unless he goes to a kiddie college I doubt it. Every 1st year engineering program will have at least one physics course, and thermodynamics is covered in enough depth that a student shouldn't be this ignorant unless he skipped half the classes and/or flunked out.
A childhood friend is in third year engineering and he tried pulling the thermodynamics argument on me. It's possible if you're ideologically entrenched enough. And he tried pulling 9/11 conspiracy crap too.

I don't really talk to him anymore.

Brian
There are always some stupid people in high places. Behe comes to mind.

He was in a high place. He hasn't done anything note-worthy since conversion.

I'm suprised that you're versed in the understanding of logical fallacies, given your behavior in other threads.

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2006-04-19 03:10am

Darth Wong wrote:I knew he was a fraud from the first post, but I figured I'd only insinuate that he was a fraud rather than coming right out and saying it. As I said, he's got a military IP address, and unfortunately, there are an awful lot of technicians out there who think that "technician" and "engineer" are pretty much the same thing. Of course, he might not even be a technician; I suppose I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.

My father was, technically speaking, a "technician" in the Navy during World War II: Fireman 2C, which meant he was part of the ship's boiler crew. He did go on to become an actual engineer with the space programme in later life. However, he'd never have attempted to claim he was an engineer or even a technician while in the Navy.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-04-19 11:12am

are based on my understanding of a discussion with my professor in Advanced Thermodynamics several years ago

Oh man, what kind of fallacy is this, then. "Appeal to long-term memory and subjective interpretation- fallacy"?

I also like his classic mistake with Evolution = Abiogenesis. For a person claiming to have higher education, he sure mixes up different fields of study.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-04-19 11:17am

I almost fell out of my chair laughing when I saw that "discussion with my professor" bullshit. It reminded me of Timothy Jones. As if you could somehow make it into an "advanced thermodynamics" class and still need to ask your professor what entropy is.

Fleet Admiral JD · Post by **Fleet Admiral JD** » 2006-04-19 11:40am

So once you wrap it up with this fucktard, are you putting it on the hatemail page for posterity?

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-04-19 11:45am

I once had a conversation with my junior high teacher about how I thought Jesus was an extraterrestrial.

He thought it sounded interesting, so I guess that gives me academic background to claim Jesus was an alien. 8)

mr friendly guy · Post by **mr friendly guy** » 2006-04-19 12:26pm

Why is it that Creationist think science uses Carbon 14 to date the age of the Earth? Someone posted a link previously to a board where some fundie almost discovered the sun from using the thermodynamics disproves evolution rubbish. The fundies on that board likewise thought they could disprove the age of the earth in billions by pointing out that Carbon 14 is only good for 50 000 years for dating purposes.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-04-19 12:37pm

Because C14 is the most famous dating method in popular culture? Without any academic background, that's the only one they're likely to ever hear about.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-04-19 12:41pm

VT-16 wrote:Because C14 is the most famous dating method in popular culture? Without any academic background, that's the only one they're likely to ever hear about.

This particular ignoramus has heard of the other ones. That's why he accused people of using long half-life elements to date young objects, even though that is not how those long half-life based dating methods are used.

Ypoknons · Post by **Ypoknons** » 2006-04-19 01:26pm

Darth Wong wrote:This particular ignoramus has heard of the other ones. That's why he accused people of using long half-life elements to date young objects, even though that is not how those long half-life based dating methods are used.

It's not hard to find out about them either. A random National Geographic will cover it.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2006-04-19 04:14pm

Darth Wong wrote:I knew he was a fraud from the first post, but I figured I'd only insinuate that he was a fraud rather than coming right out and saying it. As I said, he's got a military IP address, and unfortunately, there are an awful lot of technicians out there who think that "technician" and "engineer" are pretty much the same thing. Of course, he might not even be a technician; I suppose I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Who's military was he e-mailing from?

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-04-19 04:30pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:Who's military was he e-mailing from?

US Navy. To be more specific, a WHOIS search on 138.162.0.45 gives us this:

ARIN WHOIS IP Lookup wrote:OrgName: NCTC
OrgID: NCTC-1
Address: 130 West Avenue Suite D
City: Pensacola
StateProv: FL
PostalCode: 32508-5111
Country: US

NetRange: 138.162.0.0 - 138.162.255.255
CIDR: 138.162.0.0/16
NetName: CISCO-BLOCK8
NetHandle: NET-138-162-0-0-1
Parent: NET-138-0-0-0-0
NetType: Direct Assignment
NameServer: NCC.NCTS.NAVY.MIL
NameServer: GATE.NCTS.NAVY.MIL
NameServer: NS1.NOSC.MIL
Comment:
RegDate: 1990-05-07
Updated: 2004-09-20

RTechHandle: LS529-ARIN
RTechName: Slade, Lawana
RTechPhone: +1-850-452-7562
RTechEmail: LSLADE@nnic.navy.mil

OrgTechHandle: RS2224-ARIN
OrgTechName: Smith, Richard
OrgTechPhone: +1-850-452-7570
OrgTechEmail: RSMITH@ncts.navy.mil

# ARIN WHOIS database, last updated 2006-04-18 19:10
# Enter ? for additional hints on searching ARIN's WHOIS database.

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2006-04-19 06:37pm

I shall use my incredible connections to discover who this fella is.

nko.navy.mil ahoy!

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2006-04-19 06:43pm

Man, am I retard. That "NCTC" group ID? That asshole is affliated with my community in some way! I suspect that sense it says "Pensacola" he's at "A" School (meaning his ass either just got out of boot or he may be an instructor...or something else, but those are the two big possibilities).

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2006-04-19 06:53pm

Bingo. No hit on the nko white pages for Randall Phelps. I suspect he just got out of boot and doesn't even have an nko account.

No hit for Lawana Slade, but I have a hit for the Richard Slade in the who-is track down.

I'm convinced ole "Randall Phelps" is NAME DELETED DUE TO ERROR who is either in A School or is waiting for it to start. If he's claiming to be "Mechanical" he might be a 'tard waiting for CTM A school to start and somehow thinks the M stands for Mechanical. Ask him in your next e-mail.

At first I had thought that maybe Phelps was a civilian, but since it seems that even Civilians who work for the DoN have nko accounts I'm definately leaning towards the "Right out of Boot Camp"...camp.

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2006-04-19 06:56pm

Please excuse my spelling, it seems to be especially bad today. Just got madder and madder as the lenses focused.

Lonestar · Post by **Lonestar** » 2006-04-19 07:23pm

One last post, because I jumped the gun.

I saw NCTC-Pensacola and associated it with NTTC-Pensacola's new name (it's changed a few times since I've been there.) It isn't. While the Richard Smith in the listing came back as part of the Information Dominance community, which only supported my original thought.

Well, apperently there is also a NCTC in Gulfport Mississippi. NCTC in this case seems to stand for Naval Construction Training Center. So, he's emailing you from the fucking SeaBees organization. Probably.

For those that don't know, the SeaBees are the Navy's construction workers.

The first ten hits on NCTC on navy.mil's search function involve the Seabees.

Don't know why they would have something in Pensacola though, with a manager in the ID community attached to them.

So, uhm....can a mod, like, delete my previous 4 posts or so?

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2006-04-19 07:32pm

Removed the name from Lonestar's post, since it was obviously not the guy.

Ariphaos · Post by **Ariphaos** » 2006-04-22 04:01am

aerius wrote:Unless he goes to a kiddie college I doubt it. Every 1st year engineering program will have at least one physics course, and thermodynamics is covered in enough depth that a student shouldn't be this ignorant unless he skipped half the classes and/or flunked out. His "understanding" of thermodynamics was likely googled off the web or lifted off wikipedia, I doubt any engineer who actually passed 1st year could be this dumb, let alone one who claims to have done graduate studies.

Dunno, there were two YECs at my at my college, one mechanical engineer, the other metalurgical, who, despite being juniors, still could not grasp that the second law of thermodynamics only involved closed systems until I spelled it out for them in baby steps.

There was also a kid getting his Master's in Geology. SDSM&T was considered to be a pretty good college at that time.

...they just ignore data that is not relevant to their world view, and the rest of us debated how they passed their courses.