Narns: The Klingons of B5?

[Balrog]

I'd been thinking about this the other day and it got me wondering. Both are a proud war-like race, both charge heedlessly into the enemy's guns, and both tend to get the crap kicked out of them by competent foes. Are the Narns as bad as the Klingons, or is there some redeeming factor to them?

[Lord Zentei]

I'd been thinking about this the other day and it got me wondering. Both are a proud war-like race, both charge heedlessly into the enemy's guns, and both tend to get the crap kicked out of them by competent foes. Are the Narns as bad as the Klingons, or is there some redeeming factor to them?

1). The Narns don't have bad hair.

2). The Narns don't have those silly ronco vegematic things (damn silly weapons).

3). The Narns have better table manners.

[NecronLord]

Errr... Have you watched ST? In universe they're a potent military force. Hell, they beat the Federation when the two went to war in the alternate universe. And Q seemed to consider it plausible that they could beat the Romulans.

What's more, the Narns were defeated by a race with technology a million years better than theirs. A Culture Mind couldn't win that war.

[General Zod]

I'd been thinking about this the other day and it got me wondering. Both are a proud war-like race, both charge heedlessly into the enemy's guns, and both tend to get the crap kicked out of them by competent foes. Are the Narns as bad as the Klingons, or is there some redeeming factor to them?

Narms actually seem to care about things beyond combat and dying gloriously in combat.

[Nephtys]

The Narns are probably more accurately described as 'Space Indians'. Only without suicide. They got pushed off their home by an immensely more powerful military power.

Only, after that, they become 'Space Palestinians' and get very angry, and very armed, who capitalize on the political weakness of the Centauri government.

Plus. Narns don't brawl unless everyone else is. They stick to guns, and ships. None of the 'personal honor' crap either, beyond reasonable levels. Given the fact that they don't boast about being predators, and were an agrarian people before being enslaved (or at least, G'Kar claims so), they're a LOT better.

[Stofsk]

Plus. Narns don't brawl unless everyone else is.

False. The Narn started the riot in the episode 'The long twilight struggle' by brawling.

They stick to guns, and ships.

They also have knives and swords. They seem to have no problem using poisoned blades as well.

None of the 'personal honor' crap either, beyond reasonable levels.

Depends on what you mean. G'kar had to duel an upstart Narn youth firebrand for leadership of B5's Narn population in the episode 'Acts of Sacrifice'. Narn have a sword that looks remarkably similar to the Japanese katana and apparently they have a blade culture that says 'once drawn it cannot be sheathed without drawing blood'. Narn stand by ritual quite a fair bit too.

Given the fact that they don't boast about being predators, and were an agrarian people before being enslaved (or at least, G'Kar claims so), they're a LOT better.

They simply have more depth, something which the later generations of Star Trek can only dream about.

[Batman]

Plus. Narns don't brawl unless everyone else is.

False. The Narn started the riot in the episode 'The long twilight struggle' by brawling.

They stick to guns, and ships.

They also have knives and swords. They seem to have no problem using poisoned blades as well.

In all fairness I think Nephtys meant 'in actual frontline combat' as opposed to 'ever'. She's wrong there too-'Severed Dreams', anyone?-but by and large they use ranged weapons a lot more consistently in war than the Klingons do.

[Nephtys]

Plus. Narns don't brawl unless everyone else is.

False. The Narn started the riot in the episode 'The long twilight struggle' by brawling.

They stick to guns, and ships.

They also have knives and swords. They seem to have no problem using poisoned blades as well.

In all fairness I think Nephtys meant 'in actual frontline combat' as opposed to 'ever'. She's wrong there too-'Severed Dreams', anyone?-but by and large they use ranged weapons a lot more consistently in war than the Klingons do.

That's what I meant. The katanas and stuff seemed ceremonial. Like when G'kar is caught by Centauri security, he fights them with a pistol instead of a knife.

Oddly, in B5's confined spaces, the EA Marines broke into hand to hand with Station Security, and the Narns. I'm thinking of passing that off as due to the environment than habit... such as screaming berserker open-field klingons.

[Imperial Overlord]

B5 likes hand to hand. Humans go hand to hand, Narns go hand to hand, and Mimbari have the fancy force pikes. Beating up on the Narns for doing in close quarters isn't really fair unless you beat up on everybody for it.

[Lost Soal]

B5 likes hand to hand because, generally, guns are difficult to get on to the station, and for most riots, security doesn't want to shoot every one.

[Gustav32Vasa]

B5 likes hand to hand. Humans go hand to hand, Narns go hand to hand, and Mimbari have the fancy force pikes. Beating up on the Narns for doing in close quarters isn't really fair unless you beat up on everybody for it.

Minbari

[Batman]

B5 likes hand to hand because, generally, guns are difficult to get on to the station, and for most riots, security doesn't want to shoot every one.

Especially since post-TG PPGs don't have a stun setting.
And yeah, Gustav, that's one typo that happens a lot.

[Nephtys]

B5 likes hand to hand because, generally, guns are difficult to get on to the station, and for most riots, security doesn't want to shoot every one.

Especially since post-TG PPGs don't have a stun setting.
And yeah, Gustav, that's one typo that happens a lot.

To quote JMS... "Stun settings are for people who can't commit." ;P

[Batman]

Well at least with a stun setting 'Shoot first, ask questions later' is actually an option

[Stofsk]

Well at least with a stun setting 'Shoot first, ask questions later' is actually an option

If you have to shoot it's a good assumption that asking questions later would be pointless anyway.

[Batman]

Well at least with a stun setting 'Shoot first, ask questions later' is actually an option

If you have to shoot it's a good assumption that asking questions later would be pointless anyway.

I disagree. Riot control comes to mind, HRTs wouldn't have to worry about accidentally hitting the hostages, Valen Police in general would probably love having a stun setting, and overpenetration is no longer an issue.

[CaptainChewbacca]

It seems that Narns take using a blade very seriously. That guy who was there to protect G'kar for a while had a sword that once drawn could only be sheathed after it had shed blood. I wish I knew the backstory behind that bit of cultural niftiness.

[Nieztchean Uber-Amoeba]

It seems tasers, bean-bag rounds, tear gas, and batons are all lost technology to the Earth Alliance. Possibly the Minbari sacked their greatest libraries during the war?

[Batman]

Because tasers are oh so effective at crowd control, bean bag rounds is sorta hard to do with energy/particle beam weapons (and bean bag rounds can STILL be lethal at close ranges which means most of B5). I'll give you the batons, though.

[Anguirus]

B5 Security uses batons very heavily in "Point of no Return."

[Batman]

B5 Security uses batons very heavily in "Point of no Return."

I stand corrected.

[Uraniun235]

B5 Security uses batons very heavily in "Point of no Return."

Not terribly sure about the effectiveness though; I think the most prominent example of baton use was also the example of the guy with the baton getting his ass beat by some unarmed dude.

[PREDATOR490]

Use of certain weapons might not be possible due to the varying amount of aliens, some of which are allies and senators - not good PR if you end up with a death or severe beating on a station where "peace" is the idea. Especially following the Minbari ass kicking which pretty much presses the point home that the Earth Alliance has to tread very carefully while getting over what happened.
Tear gas might not work as well on some and batons arent that effective if your taking on foes with superior strength, not to mention its going to be rather ineffective against a Vorlon or creatures of such capabilities.

B5 was hardly a military outpost, infact it was designed to be the exact opposite, having a place for peace armed to the teeth would not be a very good example of a "neutral" space station.

B5 also tended to be out of date with little support from home at the start, thus its unlikely the guys back home are going to shell out massive amounts of money to outfit the station with a large stash of weaponary. Even if such weaponary was effective and feasible.

Final point is it takes more training to use varying weapons and resources to make them where as you can just make the PPGs for the kill. Thus probably the result of the guys back home keeping the budget as low as possible.

[Junghalli]

I'd say the Narns are really more like Bajorans, but portrayed in a more negative light.

[Uraniun235]

B5 was hardly a military outpost, infact it was designed to be the exact opposite, having a place for peace armed to the teeth would not be a very good example of a "neutral" space station.

Thirdspace showed B5 as having at least one tactical nuclear warhead.